should i go with kt150's now or wait a bit??


simple question folk's,    I have two jolida 502 amps running in mono.  kt120 tube's with about 200 hours. just broken in lets say.  this is almost going on two years now so I guess Im not listening as much as I should be. I will take care of that!!    the amps are running the top end of my infinity 1b speaker panel's.   mid's and high's.  no bass work here. so the question is is it worth installing kt150's at this point in time.    for $600, I would need eight of them, what kind of improvement in sound would I get.  with just 200 hrs on 120's would you run them a little longer to at least get some use out of them.   everybody like's the 150's for the solid bass they get out of them but I would not see that running the mid/tweeter panel.   what would you guy's do if you had the $600 ready to go??  (don't answer that)   can we assume in time the 150's price will drop a little more and just wait it out .   I know it's such a tough decision here, just help me out ok. thanks
tomtab
I say: Just do what you think is best as long as you can live with the consequences. Sounds like you need to work on your self confidence...
o, i have plenty of confidence dweller, don't worry about that    its the $600 i'm thinking about spending and not getting much results.
Hi Tomtab

I own a Jolida JD502P amp and I made the jump to the Tung Sol KT150s a couple of years ago and was SO happy I did. Previously I had the Tung Sol KT120 and the sound was meh compared to the KT150s. To me the KT150s in the Jolida give you sweet midrange with wonderful bass. Sell those KT120s and use those proceeds to the KT150s.

Message Wolf_Garcia here on audiogon too. He has a Jolida JD502P with KT150s installed as well.

Thanks
I hear you jed. thanks for the input.   im leaning that way. just wanted a few audiogoners to lean me that way.  such a shame, only 200 hrs on the 120's
Post removed 
Dweller is perky huh? Man...Keep the 120s as backup maybe…can't hurt. My trusty 120s wore out after 3 years in the aforementioned (Jedinite…dude has great taste in amps, as does tomtab) 502P, and the 150s had just become less expensive so I got a quad...in they went and after over a year they continue to sound friggin' great and I hope they last as long as the 120s.

I just read a thing in a recent UK mag (HIFI News or something) where the reviewer, who loves (I mean REALLY loves) his Audio Research Ref 75 with KT120s, reviews the new AR GSi75 integrated. He goes nuts because although the new integrated is supposed to be the same power output as his amp from the same damn company, it blows away his Ref 75 in term of power and control over his reference speakers…he's absolutely sure it's the KT150s making the difference although it is a different amp of course…still...Besides, they're shaped like pickles, they're larger, and amp designers are all over these things so what's not to like?
ok, now that wolf has spoken i guess i will just have to spend the dough.  what the hell, whats with another set of tubes hanging around
Sounds like the 150s are the way to go. As Wolf stated i would keep the 120s as a back up set. Also you might want to reinstall the 120s after extended listening to the 150s to best discern the advantages of the latter.

For for your system setup, I would definitely be looking at el34 tubes if your amp can handle them. 

brf,   i dont think my amp will work with el34's.   i did think of them because i hear they shine on midrange and my speakers have that in spades.  I have heard though that the new 502 amps can.  maybe down the road when its time to change out amps going with something that uses the el34's.   i thank you all for your input on this and will let you know how it all works out

 The Fusion 3502P is reworked version of the JD502P. It has upgraded clarity caps and resistors and diodes. Also with a flick of a switch, you can set your amplifier up to operate 6550, KT 88, KT 120, KT 150 or EL34 Vacuum Tubes. The circuit has been redesigned and placed the same venerable steel chassis. Parts of the unit have been upgraded to include ESA clarity coupling caps, high speed diodes and DC voltage to the preamplifier tubes which lowers the noise floor and enhances clarity, air and dimensionality. You choose the tubes you want with your order. And for the best part, a clear, smooth sound with the 3 dimensional air that vacuum tubes can deliver. Fusion series amps have the level one upgrade components- ESA clarity caps, Hexfred diodes, and Vishay resistors. Can be upgraded with Rike Audio caps. Ask for price.

just got this off the net. the new 502p amp. sounds interesting $1,400 ...
i have a novel idea!!   since i have two amps in mono i can buy one set of 150's and run one amp 150 tubes and the other amp 120 tubes. then i can compare the difference of the left and right speaker 's sound.  that is of course after the 150'a break in.  just a thought  
A very novel idea Tomtab, you could try it but good luck trying to differentiate exactly what you're hearing. Better to compare directly with the same tubes in both amps. I do believe the sonic attributes of the Kt150 tube will be to your liking, there nothing I can hear NOT to like although I don't have a Jolida but a Quicksilver and the improvement is not subtle. This seems the case across the board with other amps as well.  As others have noted, you still have the kt120s as backups. Life is too short, the Kt150s in my experience, if you have the amps that can use them which you do, are simply a nobrainer, trust your peers on this one and go for it!
tubegroover,   im going to do it.  just wanted some feedback on the subject.  going to order some today.   thanks
OP, you should have gone for the 150s 2 years ago. You might have listened for more than 200 hours since then.
wise guy,   the 150's were more money two years ago.  now that i have more time to listen i will get my moneys worth
Good for you tomtab. Now don't forget to come back and tell us your findings! So far as the price going down, that would be good news for sure, I'll probably pick up another set just in case of an unexpected production stop in Putin's Russia.
you know everybody before you know it the kt 180's will be out and all us suckers that went out and spent good money on 150's  are going to plunk down $100 plus a tube for them. in the mean time the 150's are ordered. will let you know how they work out
I would wait it out 

Wait, this just in: KT-220's are rumored to be in development.


Update: KT-220 "plus".


I heard about the KT-180's over 2 years ago. Still waiting.
This particular "sucker" waited until my trusty 120 reached the end of their road (3 years of hard pressed tubing), and I would have certainly bought another quad of them except for the fact that 150s had engendered such raves and cost $269 for a no bullshit quad ("factory matched" no "cryo me a river" or Careful Selection price increased ARC style nonsense) from the people who sold me the 120s previously. A 100% reputable Ebay seller with a return policy. They KILL in my modded Jolida…actually they don't kill anything except microphonics supposedly, and when they die I'll get another quad unless New Sensor comes up with something else.
Ahhh cynicism, you have to love it in our hobby, I sure do, it keeps things real. I am curious though, how many of the posters past Tomcats last and Wolf’s most recent have heard and compared these tubes with others in something they are quite familiar? Oh btw, I put my money where my mouth is and just received another quad yesterday, Putin’s Russia is a very real reason of concern for me, you just never know! And btw, if really interested, give Mike Sanders of Quicksilver a call and ask him what he thinks. I didn’t feel the need to as I heard for myself but from others I’ve garnered that he likes this tube quite a bit.

just to let you all know i did pick up the 150's.  not in yet but going in tomorrow. i will let you all know how it works out.

now about the remarks on the not yet here kt 180's,, kt200's,  kt250's  and so on.  i did mention in the past that since we have the kt 90,kt100,kt120 and now the kt150,  we would all assume somewhere in the works is a new tube.  why not??  why stop at kt150.  just a conversation piece for now.  sort of a joke if you know what i mean. but lets just imagine.  all of a sudden there it is, the new kt200 capable of 100 watts per tube. all yours for $150 each. i can see it down the road. and we are all going to run out and buy them.  just the nature of the beast.  technology doesn't stop, we all know that.  so who's first  for the new future tube. 

I compared the Tung Sol 6550s (stock with the Jolida 502p) and a set of Sovtek Kt88s to the 120s and the 120s were better sounding, although the other tubes sounded pretty damn good…note the front end tubes were swapped all over the place until I wound up with a Gold Lion (12AX7)/NOS Mullard (gold pin 6201/12AT7) combo that works well…the 150s sounded much better than the 120s but the 120s were on their last legs anyway.
well,  i  installed the 150's today.  had both amps running for an hour before one amp shut down!!!.   usually when that happens its for a reason.  it happened to me once before when a 120 blew and took out the fuse with it.  so i was expecting a blown 150 for some reason.  i started the amp back up and it stayed on.  after 20 minutes i reset two of the tubes bias. was below 500mv.  all are at about 550mv. so i shut her down after about a half hour. we will see what happens tomorrow when i want to run them again.  so i will say with the one hour i have on the tubes they do sound good right out of the box. cant say they blow away the 120's right now. that will need some time for break in.  right now i would just like to see the amps stay on for more then an hour without shutting down.   since others are running 150's in their jolida's why shouldent i be able too.  dont worry, the 120's will go right back in if there seems to be a problem here. 
Quoting the immortal Harry Pearson: "If it works the first time, it's not high-end".
want to be more specific on that dweller.   you said i need more confidence. well i spent the big bucks and installed a set of the big and fancy kt150's.  one amp shut down in an hour.  so now what am i supposed to do??   hope for the best and its never going to happen again.  a friend of mine said to me a few years back when i was asking about getting a tube amp tube trouble. you know, i think he's right. had about 10 different ss amp's over the past 30 years, never any problems.  now i have problem's, go figure.   ok, so the jolida is not $10,000 bucks but it should be good enough to work without shutting down every hour.  tomorrow is another day.  the amps go on in the morning, the bias will be checked on all 8 tubes to 500mv like they want. throwing in a cd, crank it up and let see what it could do. i dare it to shut down again.  so there,   big tom here
folk's,   amps ran for 3 hours today.  all ok.   so with 4 hours on the kt 150 tubes all i can say for now is they sound good.  nothing spectacular here.  its a funny thing but when i change out gear to me there are always little improvements here and there.  not the big changes i read about in just about every post on audio sites. i think its just a little to much bs on most peoples part. yes, everything sounds different but to hear huge amounts of differences????    maybe folks want to hear a big difference because of the money spent.  to me,  it just seems to almost sound the same.  something different here and there  but no big WOW   the bass is tighter,  the mids are smother,, the high's are higher.  my amp came with 6550's  they sounded good.  put in 120's  they sounded good.  maybe a little better,hard to really hear. now 150's, they sound good also.  can i say they sound twice as good as the 120's?   no,  not right now anyway. am i expecting a big improvment down the road.  according to everybody who has 150's i am.  we'll just wait and see.   to me you want a change in sound, change out your speakers. that will do it. 
Don't forget the 753 hour break-in period (heh…). I can sympathize regarding sonic attributes of tube swaps as the differences are obviously subjective and often subtle. After all, it's the same amp…I can say that the 150s in my 502 have stayed absolutely static (no sonic degradation I can hear) over thousands of hours, and I rarely adjust the bias (generally only when it "seems" unbalanced, but this likely has more to do with the unstable electricity in my house, and my propensity to fiddle and burn my fingers). I expect thousands of hours more from these tubes as my 120s lasted longer than I expected anyway…we shall see…Also, I wonder why they don't produce a gold pin version of these things.
i hear you wolf.   750 hours to go.   i have my amps (four of them) on a dedicated 30 amp line (no problems with power here).   bias held good today, no adjusting. you know i spoke to mike and another feller at jolida about bias levels and was told you can go 600mv's no problem if you want to.  thats with the 150's.  said it wouldent hurt a thing, just give them a little more kick.  i tend to run a little over the 500mv level.  all at about 550.  i can sure say the 150's look nice.  not sure why one amp shut down the other day after a hour but if it dosent happen again that would be great. 

Hey Big Tom. Sorry to hear about your trouble. Most of my high-end adventures involved tube amps (ARC Classic 60, VT-100, Vt-100 III, Almarro 205A & 318A). I've switched tube tube front-end and SS main amp as I feel tubes homogenize the sound and make everything too smooth (even when it shouldn't be). These KT150s have me interested in tube amps once again and I may try in the future.

I've never had problems with tube performance. When I traded the VT-100 for the MkIII, the dealer told me that one of the tubes wasn't working due to a blown transistor. I didn't notice anything wrong with the sound.

My hell-pit is mounting phono cartridges -almost went crazy when the phono lead broke off and no one in this country wanted to fix it (including the manufacturer). So don't feel picked on (by fate) we all have crosses to bear.

Good luck... 

Post removed 
Jump at it NOW ...  Call Andy ASAP ... Do not pass Go. Do not collect $200 ...  What a MAROON!  LOL!!!!!!!!!!!
Post removed 
thanks everyone for chiming in.  all seems to be good now.  everything working ok.  8 hours on the 150's now and the mid/tweeter panels seem to be singing.  my cd player just lost its right channel, go figure.   a cambridge 840.  good player when it was working.  but i guess their all good when working.  looking at the net I see they have problems that have popped up and i guess mine has some of them.  and that what happens when you buy a $1,200 cd player,  they shit the bed like everything else. and getting it fixed is not going to be cheap.  o well
I switched to KT 150s from KT 120s and while I prefer the 150s all around, it was not the huge improvement I expected. Had I known, I would have waited till my KT 120s were fully used (they only had about 800 hours) before making the move. Changing capacitors and power cords had a greater effect to my ears.
Rogue does not endorse the use of the 150s in any of their amps i wonder why