Nothing useful. Just reinstalled the Revel Studios in the system as the (unnamed) review speakers are moved out to the MCH system. Lovely! Over the years, I have swapped the Studios in and out as others were auditioned and I am always gratified when the Studios return.
Did you do a comparison of studio and salon? I currently own the Studios but wonder if the Salon is much better. My listening area is about 16 x 25 which I think mght be too small for the salons.
Do you think Revel will ever upgrade the drivers in the Studios?
The Revel Studio is on my short list of speakers that I want to audition to decide what to pair a SImaudio P-5/W-5/Nova with. I hope to listen to Dynaudio Confidence C2, Contour S5.4, Wilson Audio Sophia, JMlab Alto Be, Diva Be, VR 4jr, and Verity Parsifal Encore as potential speakers. The room is roughly 23 by 13 with 9 foot ceiling. I listen to mainly alternative rock, alt.country, rock. I like to listen to stuff loud.
Any personal experience using the Moon W-5 with the Studios ? Any regrets or is this a must audition combo ??? Unfortunately, this will mean travelling, as I don't have a Revel dealer for 1000 miles or so.
I have never had the Salons in my listening room although I have been impressed with them at other sites.
Part of my decision not to try the Salons is the visual factor since my stereo listening area is also my living room. This space is 15x26 with open continuity to a large foyer and a dining room.
As for upgrades, I assume this is inevitable but I do not hear it as a pressing issue.
The Moon W-5 is a nice match even though I prefer the SF Line3 in my particular setup.
While I await my own chance to audition the Studios, many reviews (editorial vs. personal internet-based) seem to frequently address the bright tweeter, need for turning down tweeter setting, and the over revealing nature of the speaker. I don't know if you saw the review in HiFi News, but the reviewer spends most of the article harping on how the speaker suddenly picked apart the differences between vinyl, radio, and CD. Then, with CD playback, he was concerned that until he listened to many discs with the Studios, he never realized how unlistenable these were.
I just read a personal review of someone who traded in their Studios for VR 4 jr. Among the reasons (WAF, needed a change), but the speaker being too revealing and bright were his main concerns.
Can anyone comment on these possible faults of the Studio. Having spent a few hours listening to the JMlab Alto Be, I was impressed how nonfatiguing it was. Sure it was revealing, but not to a fault. And the tweeter is sweeeeeet. I really don't know whether the Studio will match these qualities from what I read. Probably has more impressive bass. I need to also review Sophia, and Dyn C2 in that regard. Also, Verity Parsifal Encore and Focus Audio FS-888.
I have a pair of Salons. I find that the rear tweeters need to be turned off otherwise the higher frequencies are too irritating. I believe that the tweeters on the Studios can also be turned off. These speaker do need a large listening room. I realize that my room is not ideal, but nonetheless, the Salons are superb.
I agree that the Salons are very revealing, but not to the point that CDs sound bad. Having said that though, bad recordings are evident.
I haven't compared the Studio to the Salon, but I have auditioned the Studio at my dealer's showroom. I was very impressed with the performance. Is the Salon better? Is an upgrade to the Salon a good move? I don't think you can go wrong with the Studio.
I have a question: which speaker cables are people using? I'm using Cardas Golden Reference but I'm wondering if there is a better match. Any comments? Your experiences and input would be greatly appreciated.
Well, I've heard the same rap from some regarding the Revel F-30, which sounds more like the Studio than you might imagine.
In my experience with Revel F-30's, I found set-up and room treatments to be even more critical than I had anticipated. Having treated my room properly and spent a LOT of time with set-up, I believe that the rap on the F-30's "brightness" may be due to folks failing to spend the many hours required for set-up.
I suspect the same holds true for the Studios.
Of course, just my opinion.
Having owned f-30's until just recently and now owning revel studios, it has been my impression that the highs are definitely more revealing on the studios. the midrage is to die for and that the bass did not have the "wow factor" i was hoping for.
I have to be honest, i really liked my f-30's (they are a GREAT value!!!!!!) and I do like my studios. I do not know if i LOVE the studios yet. Granted, I have not yet spent the time required for proper set-up. That will be an evolving process. I do believe that the studios are really honest speakers- they exactly reproduce what you feed them and this is true for the original audio signal (cd) as well as equipment upstream of the speaker. To be honest, when i first got the f-30's i was underwhelmed as well but after a lot of set-up time i came to love them more than any other speaker i had owned. I do think placement is key as just a little movement in these speakers has made a huge difference in soundstage, etc...
room treatment is also key and i have yet to go down that road.
in terms of how they sound compared to the salons. a friend of mine has salons and they are a no holds barred unbelievable speaker. i think that paired with subs, the studios hold their own against the salons but they lack the dynamic "slam" that the salons have. keep in mind that for both of these, you do need a big room.
both of these speakers can be somewhat tiring on long listens-at least this has been my impression. i think that once you start down the revel line- many people are mistaking "brightness" with merciless reproduction of the presented material and this can be fatiguing. Personally, i find the b&w nautilus line to sound a lot more "bright" and tinny than the revels do.
i have just started experimenting with turning down the front tweeter and have noticed a huge difference as of yet.
the rear tweeter is key for the sense of "air" that these speakers can reproduce and a such i would be hesitant to turn them down.
I would love to hear others thoughts on amplification (tube versus solid state), placement and components (including cables).
in terms of cables, i am using alpha core mi 2 veracity biwires- they are ok but i have heard nordost and analysis plus are excellent matches for this line.
I've got the Revel Studios with the Ayre V-5x amp, ARC LS 16 MK2 preamp, Cary 306-100 cdp. I did hear the Salons with the top ML components at a store in Manhattan. The Salons are huge and sound amazing. Price and space constraints prevented me from getting them. I love what I've got. Now I'm looking to upgrade my analog rig from the MMF-5 I currently have. The Ayre amp is smooth ! That being said I don't consider myself enough of an audiophile to get into soundstage and imaging and the like.
I compared the F30s and the Studios in my reviews. The biggest differential is the midrange in clarity and integration.
I own Salons, so please forgive the slight digression.
Brightness. I do not agree that they are inherently bright. In fact, they are rolled off somewhat above 12,000 Hz. (mine measure that way, my friend's measure that way, and John Atkinson's measurements revealed a roll off as well). The Revels are very accurate and transparent, and like with the better silver cables, they will merely let you know if your upstream components are doing something wrong, e.g., grain in solid-state gear.
Solid-state vs. tube. I am biased, as it is my experience that no solid-state amp can layer sound or portray timbre like a good tube amp. I use VAC 140/140's with zero feedback with my Salons in a big room, with great results (I do have dedicated 20 amp lines for each amp). I have heard the Salons with SF Power 3's, and there is great synergy (excellent choice). I have a close friend using CAT limited edition monoblocks with his Salons (awesome). The Studios and Salons like current, and you therefore need a tube amp with really high quality power supplies and high quality output transformers that can nail the voltage-to-current conversion (this is way more important than continuous wattage ratings, although wattage certainly helps).
Speaker Cables - My dealer, and a second dealer whom I trust and who does not deal Kimber, both said that Kimber Select is THE speaker cable to use with Salons. Two weeks ago, I spoke with another dealer (whom I do not know) who said that Voecks used Kimber Select when designing the Salon -- I do not know if this is true. I use Kimber Select 3038, the all-silver version, with great success.
The Salons (and presumably the Studios) are what they eat, i.e., very accurate and transparent, and just pass along the signal. I can and do listen all day -- no fatigue and only pleasure.
Nice thread. Thanks.
interesting about the cabling
I wonder if 8tc would have some of the same sonic characteristics if one had needs for a long relatively affordable run?
Any thoughts on how rogue audio tube mono-blocks may mate with the studios/salons?
As for 8tc, it's supposedly great for the money, but I understand that Kimber's Monacle XL, used, can be had for a very reasonable price. It uses the same basic design as Kimber's Select cables. I have a friend who uses it between a Bryston 4BST and Revel F30's, and I think it sounds superb. You would need to get the Kimber Select all-copper jumpers to run to the low frequency posts on your Studios (the stock jumpers supplied with the Salons/Studios are junk).
Thanks for the reply and email Raquel
I am going to look for that series of kimber
i am currently running bi-wired so the jumpers will be a must!
Any ideas on room placement for these monsters?
I have a very strange dedicated listening room/ht
i will attempt to draw it out and see if anyone has any thoughts.
i just spent 3 hours scouring the net for advice and trying to implement it to no avail (ie no huge difference in sound)
the thing that i have been surprised by is the lack of deep bass slam i was expecting
i have a rel storm iii sub so it is not that big a deal but in dedicated 2 channel listening, i can thelp thinking that i shouldn't need it
plus my wife says the rel bass sounds bloated in comparison
c # ************
e # *
approximate dimensions are
screen wall (widest) 17 feet
maximum length 22 feet
length to first 2 foot cut in on right wall - 10 feet (equipment rack are)
length to next cut in = 8 feet
ceiling height 9 feet
now i have 2 sets or risers with 4 cinema loungers each
first riser is 4 inches high and 15 feet back from
screen wall (middle 2 seats here are "mine"
second riser is 12 inches high and 20 feet back from
the front screen wall
the studios right now are 54 inches from screen wall
the left studio is moved into the room from the side wall by about 5o inches
the right studio is about 65 inches in from the wall behind the equipment rack
the speakers are about 11 feet from the primary listening position
and are about 8.5 feet apart from each other
i think thats about it
please feel free to post with further details
i have got to get these things placed optimally!
thanks in advance everyone!
Here is a link to a thread I posted about placing my Salons. Hope it helps:
I am running a ht system with Studio's, Voice and Embrace
for surround. Revel sub-woofer delivers kicking base. Powered by Bryston 14b SST and Krel KAV 3250.
Lexicon mc-8 balanced and RT-10 on the front-end. Cabling is pure note cerulean which I used to replace transparent ultra and ultra xl. Sound is awsome - my wife constantly makes me turn down. Have thought about replacing the RT-10
with something else. I heartily recommend the Revel Studio.
Pure note makes a great companion to these speakers.
Great thread, thank you everyone.
I'm just about to purchase some Studio's to use with my Pass X350, Exemplar modified Denon 2900 and EAD 8800Pro processor/pre amp.
Now all I need is some cables to tie it all together.
What cables work well? My bank account has taken quite a bit of a poundiong lately so I'd rather not go mad and a full set of valhallas!
Do the cheaper silver cables like Pursangs, Bogdans, RSAudio ect work well with Pass/Revel speakers or should I look for something warmer sounding?
I'd love to use my existing cables but they are all 1m unbalanced cables and I now need 2m balanced for the pre-power amps so I need to buy something to make it all work.
I read the Kimber select silvers were used in voicing the speakers but these are out of the question price wise for the time being.
thanks in adv. Ian
I highly recommend Audience AU-24. Don't let those little things fool you- they kick ass!
Hi all. I am a studio owner and my right speaker just died. I love them and am hopeful it is a simple rather than box it up and send it back issue. Has anyone encountered this before? If so what was the fix. Obviously my first thought is "fuse", but I would not pop the box without discussing with Revel first. At this point I am just looking for reassurance to overcome the angst.
Ksales, I'm having my dealer come out to replace the two 6 1/2 drivers on my Salon. Rather than chip the red paint (the drivers are a bitch to remove) or ship them, I opted to pay 500. bucks(!) for a service call. The dealer's drive would be about 5 hours roundtrip and we all know the chances we take with shipping, so this really doesn't seem to be too much of a cost.
Definitely talk to Revel though, as they may walk you through a fix. That is, of course, your Studio is out of warranty.
After removing the side panels and grills to see if I could replace the speakers myself, I will now have the chance to hear them grilless. Every speaker I've owned sounded much better (open) sans grills.
Good Luck, Richard
Ive now confirmed my order for a new pair of gloss & aluminium studios and black b15 sub. I plan on using a voice but funds need to recover, besides I can use a phantom centre with my ead8800pro for the time being.
My question is relating to advice for surrounds. Im only using them for movies as my music listening is two channel only.
Im thinking of saving some cash and going for a pair of m20s, would the f30 be a better choice or am i being foolish and should i just save and get the gems or the embraces?
any opinions welcome on rear speaker or centre choice. thank you in advance
Thanks for the input Rzemkoski. I did contact Revel and I believe I have resolved the problem. Sending them back is about as desirable as ripping my nails off.
I read so many interesting posts, concerning the Studio's. I have owned mine for about a year and I must admit they get better with age. My Studio's were my dealer's tweeked pair(he didn't plan to sell them). He had removed all the drivers and treated the rear part of the cones with the tuning "dots" for resonance purposes. The dots were also added to the inside part of the binding posts. Tom at Advance Audio in Cary, NC is a guy that knows set-up and tweeks. He did other tweeks that I really don't know how to explain, except that my speaker sounds great.
The amplification used is the Jeff Rowland Model 12 Mono Blocks with a Jeff Rowland Synergy IIi Preamp. It's a very smooth and polite sound with no edgy or zippy highs. It's a very revealing sound with great dynamics. I am very happy and I plan to do another system using the Salon's when I move to my new home. I will stay with the Jeff Rowland products with my #2 system while trying to create life-like sound. Oh yeah, I will need the Tom Hoffman mod when I get my Salon's. Get ready Tom!
I would recommend the Revel Embrace for rears especially for movie. I have a 7.1 system setup that is very similar to your setup. The main speakers are grey Studios, center is Voice, side is Embrace and rear is M20 and sub is B15. I also used a pair of F30 for the rear ar one point but it was an overkill. My processor is also an EAD but it's a modified 8000 Signature.
thank you for your feedback. I think im going to go for m20s as it will facilitate an easier move to surround music if i go down that route in the future.
Can I ask if you tried a phantom center at any time and if so, was it any good?
How do you set your studio/b15 x-over point?
thanks in adv
I have not tried using phantom center. I set the crossover at around 40-45 Hz. The Studio can go down to about mid 30's in the low end. I would suggest using the Revel cd that comes with the B15 to find the optimal crossover for your room and sub position. The B15 takes a while to break in so it might some to find the proper xover point.
The phantom centre question is now mute as I ordered a matching Voice and M20s for rear duties. I have also just ordered a set of Argent Pursangs but Ric says he uses 1/4inch spades, do you know if these will fit over the studios and voice binding posts, 1/4inch sounds small to me. I'm sure my previous B&Ws were larger than that.
I measured the binding post with a caliper last night and it measures 8 mm in diameter so it's a litte larger than 1/4 inch.
Ok, the big day is nearly here. The new room is almost complete and the speakers are currently winging their way towards me.
I'm currently trying to decide on 'rough' placement for the b15 sub, and this decision may depend on if I just use it for thumps & bangs with movies, or if I use it full time including it in my critical 2 channel listening sessions.
I will be using ETF software and my ears to fine tune placement once everything has broken in.
A question to my fellow Revel useres is, is the b15 sub good enough to use for critical two channel listening or should it be kept for movies only?
thanks in adv.
The new Audiopoints Model 2.0 AP-1R.75 made especially for the Revel Studio and Salon speakers have now been released.
Just heard a pair of Studio's last weekend and thought they were amazing. Almost laughably better than everything else I heard that day. They were set up in a large HT room driven by all Lexicon electronics and the salesman gave me a funny look when I asked for straight up two channel in direct mode without the sub. I can only imagine them in a more appropriately sized room. You guys are lucky to own these speakers!
I have a question about storing my Revel Ultima Studios. I'm moving out of state for 2-3 years and will not be able to take the Studios with me. I don't want to sell them because I enjoy them so much so my question is if I pack them up in their boxes as they were originally will anything be degraded when I eventually unpack them?
Careful packing and storage in a cool, dry place should be fine. Make sure that the plastic bag moisture (and pest) barrier is intact.
Alternatively, you can lend them to me for the interval in order to complete my MCH system. ;-)