I have the Logos, the newest hybrid amplifier from Pathos Acoustics. The original tubes are Sovtek 6922. Any good? I suppose I could get a much better overall sound if I upgrade to NOS tubes within the ECC88/6DJ8 family. Amperex (BBoy) and Mullard seem to be very good. But I really would like to know which are your preferences. Thanks. tgm
I changed the tubes in my Cary pre-amp (SLP-50B) and installed a pair of NOS Tesla/JJ 6922's purchased here on Audiogon. I was pretty upset when I blew a Sovtek 6922 that was less than a month old. The JJ's gave my pre-amp a little warmer and natural sound IMO.
A good place to begin your research is at Joe's Tube Lore. To get there, go to audioasylum.com, then to FAQ, then scroll to Joe's Tube Lore. My experience has been that the Sovtek 6922 lacks the dynamics, subtle inner detail and imaging of premium NOS tubes like the Siemens CCa/7308 or Amperex 6922PQ/6DJ8 Orange Globe Logo. Even the more modestly priced Amperex Bugle Boy/A Frame, Siemens 6922 w/gold pins and Mullard 6DJ8/6922 will offer much better sonics.
Yes, you have a whole lot of room for improvement over your Sovtek (one of the worst I've heard when comparing to some of the premium tubes that Mrwigglewm mentions). You are in luck that there are many excellent alternatives that were manufactured in that family. My preferences run towards the Siemens CCa's or the Telefunken CCa's. In my applications the former is more detailed and a bit more analytical, while the Tele seemed a bit warmer while sacraficing some detail. As with all tube recommendations (and many others in audio) YMMV. Do be careful in seeking out the premium tubes as there are also many counterfit and relabled tubes in that family. Buy from a reputible dealer and you should be fine. Check the archives here or on AudioAsylum for an abundance of further recommendations (enough to make your head spin) regarding the 6922/6dj8/E88CC family. Good luck.
Hi again Jax2. Yes, it's me again (from Portugal). I have started a new thread for a couple of reasons: first, the title of yesterday's thread was correct afterall (!): the tube family is 6922/6dj8/E88CC (and not ECC82 as I said later). Then, I asked Pathos Acoustics about the original tubes and they are Sovtek 6922. According to my readings (and thanks to you) I found out these are not so good tubes. About Portugal, I am glad you enjoyed my country. You talked about Fado and this would be a loooong conversation. One gold tip: do NOT listen to anyone besides Amália Rodrigues. Amália is what Fado is all about. Trust me.
Hey tgm...I didn't even notice that was you posting!! OK then, you've got even more choices than you imagined now. Plenty of great E88CC(a)'s to choose from and quite abundent as NOS in Europe. Try the Micronetics dealer or dealers in Germany as the German tubes in that family are outstanding. The Mullard (Britain) is good too, but I do like the German better (Mullard gets a bit too warm and starts to sound veiled in my experience and for my taste).
While in Portugal I did obtain a disc of Fado music performed by Maria Teresa de Noronha which is wonderful. Hard to find stuff by her here. I also very much enjoy Madredeus and Misia. On another thread someone strongly suggested I check out another contemporary,Mariza. What do you as a native think of the more contemporary interpretations that are exposing the rest of the world to Fado more than ever before?
Look up fletchj as he sells tubes and is very helpful, Stick with Telefunken falcons or Seimens falcons as these are some of the best! They are a bit more money but well worth it. The Telefunkens will be a bit more warmer as the Seimens will have a bit more detail and both are Killer tubes. Happy Listening!
I've found the relatively inexpensive NOS Sovtek 6922s to be much more liquid, detailed, dynamic, and airy than the stock Sovteks in my SF Line 2SE pre-amp, and much prefer them to Valvos, Brimars, Seimens, and some others. Cheers. Craig
Garfish, NOS sovteks in my line stage of my ARC SP10II work quite nicely, clean and very quiet. But, I can't stand the latest Sovteks - they have no warmth whatsoever. I'm trying some new Tesla JJ's in one of my amps and they sound very good. Warmer than the Sovteks, but not as quiet, though I generally prefer NOS Tesla's tonality. (I've got too much tube stuff going for too many hours to pay for the high priced spread.)
I bought a quad many years ago and they were too noisy in my pre-amp so I did not listen at length, but my impression was that they had somewhat less than a crystal clear tone. If I ever have an undemanding location I'll try them again.
I replaced the NOS Brimar 6922s in my power amps with Amperex 6DJ8s - first the Bugle Boys and then the Orange globe A-frames. Both were a *major* improvement. The BBs are a tad warmer and a little less detailed than the A-frames. I ended up running a mix of the two.
Find out from the manufacturer if 6DJ8s can substitute for the 6922s. The 6922s have a more"rugged" electrical spec than the 6DJ8s, hence the latter may not last very long in that circuit or produce sonic anomalies. The reverse is not true; 6922s can *always* replace 6DJ8s.
I've just decided to mod my Pathos Logos, and lo and behold, here is all the advise I could hope for, well from the remainder of my research the Telefunken e188cc seems to score the most merits, but for me now I've just got my hands on some JJ Tesla e88cc and am looking at some mullards next month, I'll keep this thread posted.
I agree the bass on the pathos is a tad bloated with my full range rig. The only other thing I miss since changing over from my CHORD SPM1200B/CPA2800 combo is the grin inducing dynamics, in every other department the Logos has it licked and then some. Any advise on regaining that'control' I sometimes pine for?
keep this thread active as I'm sure the Logos will attract many modders in the way them tubes are so easy to get at.
what's the advise on displaying tubes- mini wineracks:) testube holders;) or keep em boxed?
I am using JJ Tesla E88CC tubes on my Logos successfully,JJ tubes have good clearity with a bit warm tad and good dynamics mid band sound with enough body which many other brands mentioned sound lean (like a ss Krell sound)comparing to JJs the only negative aspect of jjs ,low bass a bit short and shy but I tamed this with Virtual Dynamics Master powercord,and now I never think to upgrade my amplification,even with famous seperates. Ben
A twist of fate meant that my plans to experiment with the JJ Tesla E88CC where put on hold and instead I procured a pair of Brimar CV2492 not CV2496 as I am wont of calling them. There are quite a few valves bearing this name, OEM issues withstanding their pedigree seems blurred with Mullards GECs and even Amperexes. They have a ring of studs on the shield that throw back a glow all around the inside of the tube and star like protrusions on the main body of metal work. Gold pins. The result, an outstanding improvement over the Sovtek 6922 although subjectively you might prefer the Sovtek bass in your system. Smooth and atmospheric with attack and great mid layering, revealing every nuance, highs splashed and tingled with focus and natural decays. In the first 12 hours they lacked a little menace but once settled in they could strike with bags of intent when needed. Brings older recordings alive and can make some modern ambient stuff sound down right eirey. What now? JJ/ Tesla are 1/4 the price, Telefunken, Siemens, Amperex are 4 x the price. Time to settle down for a few months.
Siemens 6922 - yes ben, you could say thin in the midband, like swapping your speaker drivers from paper+silk to ceramic+titanium. However they sound clear and strident and their direct attribute draws you deep into the music, holding the tonal nuance ever so well. Their bass rocks when asked for, remaining polite and controlled otherwise. I like them for the Goldberg variations, however the Brimars win on all vintage sounds.