Recommendation on power amp

You're welcome. IMO your posts read too much like advertorials.

One persons advertorials is another persons story and explanation of how and why something occured and testing experience. 

Would you prefer brand x good brand y bad 

Would you prefer brand x good brand y bad

Of course I would, if I valued their opinion - the more succinct the better. The value I place on someone's opinions is its motive. Is it a genuine conveyance of their knowledge or, is there an underlying veiled attempt at free advertising?

@audiotroy  the majority of your posts do seem more advertorial. You don't blatantly put down gear you don't sell but instead say something to the effect that brand X (that you don't sell) is good but brand Y (that you do sell) is much better. We all can read between the lines. Sorry but I'm one that could never do business with your establishment. 

I would consider not narrowing it down to those two.

Price does not dictate quality, I know $2000 power amps that outperform $50,000 ones.

Here are amps that are very transparent, so wattage is all you really need to focus on (normal listening distance with 87dB speakers usually don’t need more than 50W):

* Benchmark AHB2, can be used as monoblocks (as long as your speakers minimum impedance isn’t much below 3ohm).
* PS Audio BHK 300
* Arcam FMJ P49
* Parasound JC5, can be used as monoblocks. 
* ATI AT542NC

Dave/AudioTroy, Audio Doctor--

Nice job of trying to shuck and jive to try and take the attention off yourself. Won’t work with me, though. And, I think most audiophiles are smart enough that it won’t work with them, either.

You guys have one guy shooting a number out there, and then you come in with a higher number. The lower number was actually posted right in this forum. What you did, is, at best, bad business. I think it is closer to downright unethical. I still maintain my boat anchor, and my basement sound system are in better shape than the amps you are trying to hustle.

Regarding Jim Smith’s Book, "Getting Better Sound," several happy customers recommended it to me as a result of my inquiry specifically about getting better sound from my system. The cost? $30.00. I never heard from Jim Smith, until I asked him to call me. I have, however, heard more than enough from you-- all of it unsolicited.

Go back to the swamp with the reptiles and amphibians-- you’ll feel right at home.

I am certainly not alone in  calling out Audiotroll....

Deleted my post.  I'll just leave it that I consider Audio Doctor posts informative and from my point of view welcome.

Me thinks the poor OP had his thread hi jacked by Both sides of a running dispute.

Let it GO, please

Hi @newtoncr, I recommend trying Mola Mola Kaluga’s, we know that they work very well with a range of high end speakers such as MBL, Lansche, Manger and Boenicke. We haven’t tried with the KEF Blades but I think they would be a good combination.

Are you in the U.K.?

I am based in us, 
I asked John Atkinson recommendation for amp to pair with the kef blade 2 and he wrote back saying the ayre mx-r twenty would sound excellent in my current system.
i am now nearly convinced to find myself a pair of mx-r twenty .
will keep everyone posted on how the combination sounds 
thanks everyone 

@newtoncr

John Atinkinson isn’t wrong, but I see no benefit in regards to transparency over the Benchmark amp when monoblocked; the Benchmark has far lower distortion, especially at lower watts where you mostly will reside. The only negative of the Benchmark is the industrial look.

@mzkmcv As someone who owned the Benchmark AHB2 and tested the amp with the Magico A3. I was a little disappointed in the comparison with the Mark Levinson 585 and upwards gear. The ML gear trounced my Benchmark with regards to space between instruments, the disappearance of the speakers, and some other things that I cannot articulate now. I was bummed enough to sell the Benchmark almost immediately after that demo. The AHB2 is a very good amp (not great) and I miss it in my office relative to my current Peachtree Nova 150. However, for the Magico A3 it was not that special.

I am also looking to buy the Blade 2 once my toddler is a little older and I was thinking that the Benchmark AHB2 in monblock form would have been a giant slayer, it wasn't.

@yyzsantabarbara

You hear what you hear. However, I bet I could easily trick you into what amp you were listening to if you don’t know what you weren’t listening to. No one is immune to bias, even if subconscious, once you know the brand, price, and/or asthetic, measurements don’t tell you jack. Also, need I remind you of the $10K amp challenge.

“Space between instruments” has nothing to do with an amp besides channel mismatch and crosstalk, which neither of Benchmark nor the ML has issues with.

Also, the Blade 2 is excellent, better than most all around its price, and anything Wilson puts out, but due to its side-firing woofers, what room it’s in (or how much treatment you have) becomes a factor. Once you go far off-axis (50°+), it has huge dips around 500Hz and 4kHz and a large wide-frequency hump centered around 1kHz around 90°,  so I would suggest either a very wide room or a good amount of thick acoustic panels to the sides of the speakers.

Or, sell all your equipment, get the Dutch&Dutch 8C and dual Rythmik G25HP’s.

Of the amps I have owned (nothing top notch) I could easily tell which was which in a blind test.

1) Peachtree Nova 150. Decent mellow sound, not so clear on the high frequencies.

2) Benchmark AHB2. Clear and quiet (my fav that I owned) but the sound was coming from the speakers. The sound did not separate away from the speakers. I tried this amps with 3 speakers, Magico A3, Audience 1+1 V3, and KEF LS50 it had the same characteristics with all of them.

3) Various Bryston, 4B-ST, 7B-SST. I can always tell by the high frequencies.

4) Parsound A23. A veiled sound but not harsh

I am actually someone who thinks there is a lot of diminishing returns with higher cost audio gear. I think my bias are the opposite that you describe.

I am actively shopping for new gear and I recently heard the following 3 amps. Mark Levinson 585, SimAudio 890A, Lyngdorf 2170. I could easily pick out the Lyngdorf, but I would have a tougher time between the ML and SimAudio.

Unfortunately, during this recent shopping spree I am finding the higher cost amps sound better to me. There are many things I do not know but one thing I do know is that my hearing is incredible.

Hate to be a party pooper but our store has a room filled with amplifiers from $1,000.00 - $15k in one room and and if you add in the matching preamps you may be talking up to $25k. yes these amplifiers do sound radically different.

In our reference room we have $10k amplifiers, $19k, $14k solid state amplifiers and tube amplifiers from $8k to $38k

There are families of sound certain amplifier companies are in the fast, transparent and perhaps a bit lean or just slightly warm: Spectral, Audionet, Ayre, Chord, Sim, Bryston, Solution, T+A,  all tend to fall in this area

Then there are the warmer richer amps which may or may not accentuate the the bass with a more polite top end: Dagastino, new Krell XD, Parasound, Anthem STR, Pass Labs, Coda, Darthzeel, Thrax, Ypsilon.

then there are the very neutral punchy amplifiers Hegel, Nuprime, ARC, later CJ, VTL.

all of these are great amplifiers and will shine with the right components and system matching any brand not mentioned was not intentional. 

There are definatly increase in openess, resolution, the size, width and depth of the soundstage when you reach the uber amplifiers they just increase the sense of precence over the lesser amplifiers.

When we were searching for reference electronics for our Polymer and Paradigm Persona and Kef Blades we tried: CJ, Devialet, Chord, Thrax, Electrcompaniet, Manly Labs, until we got the T+A gear which just made the speakers come alive in ways that the other amplifiers just didn’t.

As per the OP please try the new Krell solo 575 XD based on your original post of wanting a more organic sound you might really like them, the Ayre amplifiers are very fast and are cleaner then the Krell’s but they lack the sense of flowing warmth and body that the Krell amplifiers do so well, as a Blade dealer we have found amplifiers with a bit of warmth tend to work really well with the Blades which have a very uncolored midrange and tend to like things which add a bit of warmth to the speakers.

Also the Krell are more powerful and are a lot less expensive to boot.

Dave and Troy
Audio Doctor NJ

I really like the way Audiotroy put those amps into categories of similarity in sound . Never seen that before . 
@Audiotroy I have a pair of Kingsound King Electrostatic speakers . Do you have a recommendation for a amp or monos that would delivery the perfect sound ? You know , great bass great mids and perfect treble .

I am going to listen the krell 575 xd before I decide . Yes they r much cheaper and lot more watt per $.
Reading the responses I felt a lot of raised eyebrows about the Jl Audio cr-1 and pair of Jl Audio f113v2 set up for the low end .
I would like everyone to read the below white papers that I am going to post a link to .
They r by Barry Oder “the Sounddoctor “, who I had the pleasure of spending 2 days with .
this is the link to the home page, you can navigate to the white papers. 
Trust me you will find the reading quite enjoyable and helpful 
http://www.soundoctor.com/about.htm

I can add something of value perhaps to the discussion. I think audiotroy mentioned he does not carry JL Audio subwoofers and now carries SVS.I cannot find fault with his statement but...
Quite a few years back, before SVS became a bigger company, I had driven to Ohio to purchase a subwoofer from them. I liked it for sure but a few years later it developed a problem. When I contacted SVS directly they flat out stated they would not fix it (even if I paid them) and suggested I buy a new one. They did not even suggest I buy one from them?? I would buy a REL, JL Audio, Rythmik or Salk subwoofer before SVS. My two cents...I think salespeople can be very helpful since they have much knowledge, but often they become arrogant when making claims about gear. I have bought gear from Don Better in Cleveland and he has been great. I think audiogon members sharing knowledge can be helpful and that is why I shared my experience here...

Lol don better is my local ayre dealer.

You say you are presently using a pair of Parasound Halo   JC1's.  Are you using these as monoblocks?  Read the specs and this is a really powerful amplifier.  Why would you need anything else?

@newtoncr
https://www.whatsbestforum.com/threads/blade-2-1st-na-dealer-demo-pair-i-heard-them.17444/page-2

Ayre + Blades

Now that they have severs hundred hours on them and are now driven by Ayre MX-R Twenty monoblock amps they are, in a word, awesome!!

I am biased. I think the blades sound great with almost any amp.

Newtoncr, have you tried calling Ayre's corporate offices?  I own an Ayre K-5xe pre-amp, your CD player and a QSB-9 DSD DAC.  Unfortunately, not the MX-R Twenty amps nor your KEF speakers.  

My point is that Ayre's customer support has been excellent in my experience.  They have been helpful in answering several questions and in making some recommendations.  Perhaps they can help you get the amps home for a test.  I would not hesitate to advise them of the response you got from your local dealer.  I agree wholeheartedly with those who have noted that your dealer should be happy to arrange a home demo, particularly given your past purchase of Ayre equipment. 

I did contact them and ask them about compatibility and they said it would sound very good and the preamp and speakers are all compatible.
i agree ayre has the best customer service I have encountered. They are amazing and that’s why I am so interested in their amps.
i didn’t ask them about a home demo but I am just waiting to listen to the krell before I decide on the ayre .
Then all I will need is to find a good deal in the mx-r twenties 

I would suggest auditioning a pair of the BHK 300s.  Really incredible power amps for the money.  They are about 15k, so in the price range.  

And, if you can't swing the $15K, their Stellar line (S300 and M700s) is next best. I have the M700s; finest amps I've ever heard.

From what I know the Parasound jc-1’s are a pretty fancy pair of amps.
Where do they fall short?

What sort of sound are you after?
What’s the size of your room?
Tubes are nice, but I’d go that route in the pre-amp stage, longer tube life, heat, power consuption - yada, yada. Good tubes are expensive, and in power amps, well, they can complicate things .... but that sound.
A/B amps .... bullet proof.
Class A amps ..... oh that sound, but - heat can be an issue, eventually some of them cook themselves after years of use. But IMHO Class A amps are sweeter.
Again .... what are you after?

Love class A but tough in the summer months...

Don’t get me wrong , the jc-1 are good amps. When I play my music louder the music seems to get congested. I feel it’s the transition from class a to class a/b operation. And also omg in high bias they cook. I can feel that the bottle neck are the amps and the speakers can sound better at louder volumes with an amp upgrade. 
and again it’s the upgrade bug and right now it’s the power amps in the spotlight
 
thanks everyone. I am sure there are very good amps out there but I have decided to get a pair of mx-r twenties. Special thanks to everyone who helped me make this choice. 
thank you 

 I have a pair of Blade 2's that I have owned since 2015. They work well in both mid sized and small rooms. I was shocked that they did not overload my 12' x 13' office. They are better in a larger room away from boundaries, but were surprisingly good in the smaller room. I have paired them with a Sonic Frontiers Power 1 (55 wpc KT-88 tube amp), Mac 6700 (200 wpm solid state receiver), Classe CAP-151 integrated,  Rogue Audio Stereo 100 & Atlas Magnum (both 100 WPC KT 120 amps), Parasound Halo A-21, Aragon 3002, Mark Levinson 532H (300 wpc SS), and an Emotiva XPA-2 Gen 1 SS amplifier.
 The best Solid State results have been with the Levinson and the Emotiva, which is somewhat startling considering it was $999 new and can be had for half that used. It is a 75lb 250/wpc beast! The Aragon worked well, but only through its single ended inputs. The best tube results were with the Rogue Atlas Magnum/ RP-5 preamp combo. Preamplifiers seem to alter the sound as much, if not more than amplifiers. I have used a Sonic Frontiers Line 1 SE, Line 2 SE, Rogue RP-5 & RP-7, and my Esoteric SA-50 player directly fed into the amplifiers. All combos sound different. Even changing from RCA to XLR in the same combos changes the sound.The Emotiva/RP-7 works well, due in part to the Emo's high (32 db) gain.
 I would like to try the PS Audio BHK amplifiers, and after reading this thread, recent Krell amps.

I would also like to hear them with the new Parasound JC-5.

Hello, your equipment sounds great.  the Pass Labs X series amps are fantastic.  May be the missing link.  

I own Krell’s 575 Solo XD. They’re excellent. Audiotroy did a good job in describing their sound in one of his posts. 

Have you listened to or thought about the Pass Labs X600.8 mono amps$26,000.00 pair compared to the Ayre MX-R twenty at $29,500.00 pair.

I suggest you I suggest you check out the latest Amos from Krell. I recently purchased the new Krell Duo 300 XD and they sound more musical than my FPB 400CX. Don’t know how they pulled it off given it’s a pure class A amp that draws only 1 W in standby. They’re driving Confidence C2’s EFFORTLESSLY. 

@notesaddict what speakers do you use with the krell xd 575 . 
pass labs I am not very excited about the heat . I find the jc-1 very hot running at high bias class A to  25 watts, the way I use them ... 
again the jc-1 sound very nice and right now listening to the rega the system sounds very holographic and clean. But I want the same sound at higher volumes . 
Will soon post on my experience with diff amps on my system and my final choice . The current leader is still the  mx-r twenty . 

Try a used DK intergrated amp

OP: the Krells are used with Martin Logan’s 13a. 

Off topic, but why so much hate against Audiotroy?  I have found their posts and experience quite helpful.  Especially when I agree with their assessment of certain gear that I have owned and lived with myself.  I think we need more experienced Dealers who actually know what they're talking about and willing to share.

dznutz, I’m 100% in agreement about the helpful posts of Audiotroy. I think what you will find is that those posting against them are jealous of Audio Doctor’s business success and equipment knowledge.

Their "protecting us against the evil salesmen" routine is rather stale.

What we need are fewer dealers whose every post turns into a lengthy infomercial.

Correction, twoleftears, if they are too informative for you and one or two others to process their content stick with the posts you are interested in. A lot of us find they provide insight into equipment matching and quality.

As I said above, your "protecting us against the evil salesmen" routine is rather stale. You sound like your jealous of Audio Doctor's professional success.  

I got a pair of mx-r twenties for my system to replace the jc-1.
will use for a week and let everyone know how they sound.
the krell sounded a little too aggressive for me . Made music sound loud not smooth and delicate. I preferred the ayre.
thanks everyone for all the advice and recommendations 

Another note, during the comparison I realized that the krell sounds very similar to the parasound jc-1 and I couldn’t justify the “upgrade”  
but that’s me .