My first shunyatas were the 2 and 4 hydra...eventually went to the 6 and then v ray 8 and talos.My first experience hearing a difference was the 4.I had python helix cabling and was set.It just did something with sound stage,just sounded clean and right.No change of tone and dynamics.I have tried/had other more expensive and didnt care for them.Recently bought a mint hydra 4 for just cd playback,amp to wall.
The delta 6 would be awesome and give you a big slice of what the denali has to offer...i miss my talos but dont need all the outlets.
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I’m using the Shunyata Hydra Delta D6 with a Delta V2XC PC. I’m very happy with it, although I still plug my amp directly into the wall.
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@rhg3 You've got the right idea plugging your amp directly into the wall. I wish more people would try it. OTOH, I've bought a couple of amps checp beccause people were providing them inadequate power. but any time you add a power conditioner, listen to it a few days and then plug back into the wall. Many people may be amazed what they are missing.
If you want to clean up the power from a product that will not degrade current, a PS audio regenerator is the best choice. I recommend the last generation PP10. I have no affiliation with PSA and their power supplies are their only product I really recommend.
Jerry
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I’m using an Everest, which is nothing more than two Denalis. Look carefully at the technology difference and you will see why the Denali is more expensive, You want NR cables from Denali to components. The Denali is capable of drawing lots of current for short periods of time. You want one of their better XC cables to plug the Denali into the wall. The Everest and Shunyata PC were the largest single improvement that I’ve made to my system.
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Hiss is usually caused by components, especially tubed. And if you have very efficient speakers and powerful amp you’re going to be in for an unpleasant surprise.
Hum is typically caused by faulty parts in one or more components or a ground loop.
But…you can’t measure or hear the electrical noise in your line by putting your ear next to the tweeter when the music is not playing. You can hear you had noise in the power line when you introduce a good power conditioner and or power cords. Not the Pangea level but higher end stuff. The reduction in noise floor will be evident by “darker” background when music is playing, more organic less grainy presentation with more inner details and better clarity.
Shunyata power conditioners you mentioned work well. Again, you need to try it to see of you hear the improvement in the areas I mentioned above. You will know if the power line noise was reduced.
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I use Shunyata power distributor and Venom NR power cables and am pleased with the impact. I also have Kimber Kable bifocal XL speaker cables and KCTG XLR interconnects.
I started with speaker cables, the interconnects and finally power cables for what it’s worth.
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This is hardly a scientific experiment and please tell me if this is a stupid test.
You're not using science to test your cables or anything else either so go nuts.
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Thanks for all the comments so far. I don’t dislike my Furman Elite, it seems to just do its job and get out of the way. I am just very curious if higher end conditioners combined with higher end power cords will make an audible improvement to my system. All comments I read so far about Shunyata’s power products are mostly positive. So I am assuming and hoping the Shunyata Hydra Delta or Denali will perform noticeably better than my Furman.
There’s currently a pretty good discount on the Hydra Delta D6, and that’s what got me thinking about upgrading my entire power system. My head is telling me to go for the Hydra at a lower price point, but my heart is telling me to go for the higher end Denali. What would you do if you were me? 😀 The Everest is a bit over my budget, plus it only comes in a tower form factor which doesn’t work for me.
Hey @vonhelmholtz, may I ask you which Shunyata cable are you using for your Everest conditioner? I am currently thinking to pair the Hydra with the Alpha XC power cord, and the Sigma XC for the Denali, if I decide to go for either one of these conditioners. Thanks!
Hey @overthemoon, the Kimber Bifocal is a very nice cable over the 12TC. It has much better and spacious sound stage and deeper bass. One thing I don’t like about it are the WBT connectors. I went for the banana version and it’s a real pain to insert or remove from the connectors in my amp and my speakers. It beats the Venom-X on the sound stage, but a bit less articulated in the bass. I also got a pretty good open box discount on the Venom-X from Music Direct. It came out to be about $1500 cheaper than the Bifocal. so It was hard to resist on the price.
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I would recommend the DR acoustics
Antigone
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I own the Everest and it’s great. I have incredible power cables too. But honestly the significance in cable sound is much much more heard with speaker cables, then in interconnects. If you have your dream speaker cables and interconnects then I’d upgrade power afterwards because they will reward your ears the least.
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@xcool
Call Shunyata…. They are a small company and you will be able to speak with someone on the inside who isn’t going to sell you. Also, you can find their products at a substantially discounted price, but dealers aren’t going to broadcast this. All of my cable choices are listed on my virtual system. Regarding @brandonhifi claiming that speaker cables make a bigger difference, you can’t discount this opinion since it comes from an experienced source, but this was not the case with my system on my electrical grid. Perhaps, I didn’t spend enough on my speaker cables, or I should have gone with a different cable, but for me power and Ethernet cable to my streamer made the biggest difference.
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Get a home demo of the Puritan PSM156, I think you'll be impressed
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Hi @brandonhifi, I agree with your suggestions. I've gone through some upgrades on my IC last year, and I'm fairly happy with where I am at now with IC. I also just upgraded my speaker cable to Shunyata Venom-X as mentioned in my post. Actually the Venom-X was an accidental find because I had started auditioning the Kimber Bifocal XL, and saw an open box discount of the Venom-X at Music Direct. So I just decided to give it a try.
To be honest, I was surprised by the SQ of the Venom-X SC. I know Shunyata was very well regarded in the audiophile communities for their power line products, but I hardly read anything about their speaker cables.
Anyway, the purchase of the Shunyata SC has led me to consider upgrading my power cables and conditioners.
Hi @vonhelmholtz, actually I did start an email exchange with Richard at Shunyata. He's a great guy to deal with. But I started this thread because I want to seek some real world experience from members in this forum, especially those who had experience with both the Hydra Delta and Denali conditioners.
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It's hard to give a meaningful response to your initial question without knowing the details of your system IMO. The better your system, the more likely you'll be able to discern the benefits of better power conditioning and cabling. When audiophile cables and power conditioning first became a "thing" in the audio world, my system wasn't all that resolving and I was rather disappointed with my first purchases of cables and power conditioning. As the years have gone by and my system has improved the benefits of power conditioning and better cables has become obvious and easily discerned. By the way, one of the main misconceptions about power conditioning is the only thing that matters is if you have deficient or distorted power coming into your home. Audio equipment, electronic devices, and appliances in our homes generate all manner of electrical noise that can affect audio reproduction aside from whatever is riding in on the electrical feed to our home. What works best in one person's system isn't a universal "best" solution. My PS Audio regenerator sounds great with some of my equipment and my Shunyata conditioner sounds much better than the PS Audio with my Luxman preamp and power amp. Sometimes an amp sounds best plugged into a conditioner and sometimes it sounds best directly into the wall.
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Hey @markiew, thanks for your recommendation of Puritan. Their products look interesting. I’ll check it out!
and thanks @tatyana69 for your recommendation on DR acoustics. I'll check that out as well.
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Hey @photon46, thanks for a very well written response. I agree with what you're saying. That's why this hobby can drive you crazy through this endless search for the perfect sound. 😀
I've been meaning to update my profile with my equipments, but just been too lazy to do so. I'm sure I'll get to that one day.
Cheers!
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@xcool Post your virtual system onto your profile to see what we’re working with to give accurate advice according to your gear.
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@xcool
Wny do you think you need a power conditioner? Two houses ago I had audible noise and bought a conditioner, worked like a charm. In my current (😁) home all is quiet and the conditioner is a now very expensive 15 amp circuit breaker and no more.
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Have you ever considered an Inakustic Power Conditioner? I have one. German engineering is at its best.
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@curiousjim, if you read my original post, I kind of have the same thinking as you. I always thought that the power source of my home is pretty good. That led me to believe that is why I don't get the kind of sound improvement of changing power cords or conditioner. So long story short, I simply want to explore whether higher end power cords and conditioner will improve my overall SQ.
@willgolf, I've never heard of Inakustic, but will check it out. Thanks!
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I didn't think I needed cleaner power as I live in a modern home. I purchased a used Ps Audio P10 and the improvement was so vast I vowed to never be without one. Then I tried the Denali V2 and it was like I unlocked another level of detail and nuance I've never heard before. I called Shunyata to discuss the purchase before I made the leap and Grant discussed the benefits to me and explained to avoid making half steps with unknown mixing of cables from other brands and to just wait until I could buy a full Shunyata set up, I didn't listen. Originally I ran the Denali V2 with a 20A to 15A adapter as I didn't want to invest in the cable if the improvement wasn't there. Well that bested the P10 and only got better when I purchased a Shunyata Delta XC. I kind of figured what the heck and then moved to the Alpha XC and have found my happy place. The Denali is light-years ahead of my P10 and just plugged into the wall. My test record was Classic Records 180g Led Zeppelin III and after hearing the improvement, I couldn't and won't go back to running just off the wall. Hope this helps.
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Wow! Thanks so much @j-wall for sharing your experience! You have just pushed me closer to going for the Denali V2.
Sounds like you are happy with pairing it with the Alpha XC? I was originally thinking to pair it with the Sigma XC if I were to go with the Denali, and pair the Hydra Delta D6 with Alpha XC if I were to go with the Hydra. But if the Alpha XC is good enough for the Denali, then I’ll save myself $1K.
Actually another question if you don’t mind. Have you migrated all of your other cables for your components to Shunyata? and if so, do you hear improvements in SQ for your components?
Thanks!
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Is Grant sam still with company?...he was great info source.I think the thing is that nuances are the benefit.Those small things that have you saying nice,alright!...sweet.
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I began with a Puritan 156 and it was good. Then I had the opportunity to do a A:B test with the Shunyata Denali. The Denali was at least 2x better. Then I compared the Denali with the Everest. The latter was another 20% better. Importantly, the Puritan was using a Nordost Valhalla power cable, whereas the Shunyata had the Sigma XC.
I then tried the Everest with an Omega XC cable and heard at least 10-15% further improvement.
So, I decided to try and determine if this was "real" or listening bias. My local audio store (NOT a Shunyata dealer) loaned me their device that can actually measure noise on the line. The device plugs into the receptacle and gives both an auditory and decimal "read out" of the noise. I have a dedicated 20A line with a Shunyata receptacle. The device plugged directly into the wall read "450" out of a 1000. Plugged into any of the Everest receptacles, it read 0... yes 0.
I then went to a separate 20A dedicated line with a PS Audio receptacle. This too read "450" and in fact, I could at times hear actually voices carrying on a conversation! I then plugged the Shunyata into the wall and the testing device into the Shunyata.. again 0 absolute silence.
So, I saved up and bought the Everest and eventually upgraded to the Omega XC power cord. The improvement is not subtle. Note I plug everything into the Everest, even my Rogue Audio Apollo Dark mono amps.
I was so impressed that I sold all my Nordost Valhalla cables and bought Shunyata Sigma NR power cords for the components. Each made a significant difference.
I have recently changed the interconnects and speaker cables from Nordost Valhalla to Shunyata Sigma and am enjoying outstanding sound in every way.
Note: If you have a Denali or Everest, do NOT use Omega cables to components. Only use a Omega from conditioner to wall. The component cables should be Sigma NRs (or one of the lower versions).
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Wow! thanks @craig for sharing your experience! Another incredible story!
Everest + Omega is out of my reach for my budget. Also I don’t really have enough space to accommodate the tower form factor. I better start thinking about how big a dent is going to make to my retirement savings if I’m gonna go with the Denali + converting all my components’ power cables. 😀
Cheers!
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With limited funds, go with the Denali and a Sigma XC cord (or if you can, the Omega XC) to the wall. I have seen several of these for sale used for good prices (make sure to get the latest version of both the Denali and the cords). Then, gradually switch the other cords and cables in your system. If the system is "revealing enough", you will be amazed at the improvement. I thought I needed to upgrade my components, but after switching to the Shunyata, I realized I do not!
Incidentally, you can run a ground wire from your components to the grounding plug on the Denali and get the benefits of a "star-ground" system at no extra cost. Even a simple homemade ground wires help, although the Shunyata ones did sound better. (Several ground wires can be connected to each ground plug.) If you find you need an even a better grounding system, I recently got the Altaira ground unit and it really helped my system.
The cords and cables and Denali are expensive, but no where near the cost of an upgrade to the amps, speakers or preamp.
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I am using the Venom V16 Power Conditioner with their Alpha XC cable and it's incredible. That's at their low-middle range. I can only imagine the benefits at their higher range, especially with the more advanced filtering tech they use.
I don't think you'll go wrong with either.
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Thanks @craig, I'm thinking the same thing if I were to upgrade my power cords to a better conditioner (i.e. Denali). I think I probably going to start with my power amp first (Parasound JC5), and then follow by my preamp (Cary SLP-05), and finally my digital and analog sources.
Interesting advice on the grounding plugs. I know nothing about grounding, but good to know that Denali has a good grounding system. I need to read up on grounding in general.
Thanks @guakus for sharing your experience. What really interests me about Shunyata power products is that I don't think I've read any negative comments at all. I'm sure there might be some negative reviews out there, but I have not seen one yet.
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Hey @craig how's the Altaira grounding system working out for you? I was just starting to do research, but the info out there is very thin.
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The Altaira makes a significant difference, even with the Everest and Shunyata power and interconnects. The noise level is lowered which translates into a clearer more articulate bass, greater resonance and better "decay" for string instruments and piano, more separation and somewhat improved (or more noticeable) soundstage. I do not know how much difference there would be between the different levels of grounding cables (eg alpha, sigma, omega) since I have not had the opportunity to do this experiment. Hopefully, I will be receiving some sigma grounding cables to compare with the alpha cables I am currently using. I would think that the "best" ground cable should go from the altaira to the ground point (in my case, the Everest's grounding plug). This does raise the issue as to where the ultimate ground is located-- obviously need a good ground point for the altaira to connect to. If you have a Denali or Everest, use that ground plug.
As to connecting components to the Altaira, this can be done in several ways:
(1) If the component has a ground plug, use it, e.g. my phono amp's ground plug has both the turntable cable's ground and the altaira ground;
(2) Any chassis screw that with a ohm meter measures a "ground" between the third pin on the power cable's connection and the screw;
(3) Shunyata also makes adapters so you can plug the grounding cable into a RCA or XLR "port" or connection on the component. BUT, you should check that there is no current coming out from the connection. Richard at Shunyata has compiled a list of many components and the best way to connect them to the Altaira.
Of course, whether you will hear a difference does depend on the resolution of your system, and its constituents. My system consists of : AMG Viella turntable with Soundsmith Strain Gauge cartridge and its associated "phono amp", dCS Rossini apex DAC, ARC Ref6SE preamp, Rogue Audio Apollo Dark mono block amps and Sonus Faber Il Cremonese speakers. Now all cabling is Shunyata except the tonearm cable with is Cardas because Shunyata does not make a DIN connector.
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I’ve been using Shunyata products for years. I’ve owned a Hydra Delta D6, I currently have a Denali S6000 V.2 the Denali is way better. For me it’s probably an end game product. I use Alpha XC V.2 from wall to unit, Alpha NR V.2 for everything else, except my Sub I have an older Delta EF
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Thanks @axeis1 for the info, very helpful!
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Definitely home demo any conditioner as everyone’s electric conditions are variable. I have very clean and stable power, and whilst I have great success with Shunyata power cables (Alpha EF) l found the Denali simply smoothed the sound and reduced detail substantially. Fortunately I home demoed it so could send it back.
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Thanks @duckworp for sharing your experience. Interesting to hear that Denali smoothed the sound but reduced detail substantially. That's not good!!
It might work out for me, because I have tinnitus and very sensitive to high frequency sound. I try very hard to make sure every component (including cables) doesn't sound bright or harsh at the higher end.
Thanks!
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I had several passive ones (Bybee Sleuth, Cristal, Acoustic Revive…), but when I installed the Torus AVR16, the journey ended here.
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For many years, I ran an original aluminum box Shunyata Hydra 8. Got a good deal on an AudioQuest Niagara 5000. Could detect no improvement vs. the old Hydra 8. Returned it. Ordered a Shunyata Denali V2. A nice improvement over the Hydra 8.
As they say in the reviews... Highly recommended. Have a mix on Shunyata and AQ Hurricane power cords.
Hope this helps.
Bob
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Thanks @coppy777, seems like the consensus is the Denali is indeed a better conditioner than the Hydra.
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@xcool I'm a big fan of Shunyata technology as I have a full loom of Shunyata power, speaker, interconnect and Ethernet cables. I also have the Everest conditioner which you mentioned is out of your price range.
You may want to consider listening to Shunyata's Altaira grounding system. I've been at a couple demos letting us hear the difference where the Altaira grounding hub was enabled / disabled in the system and the SQ difference was noticeable.
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I've owned the original V1 Denali with Sigma V1 PC's for all of my components and liked it. When the V2 version launched, I've moved the V1 to my AV system and replaced the new V2 Denali and power cords in my audio. I like this much better, One piece of advise for power hungry amps: more often than not, going straight in to a wall socket works best and leave the Denali for your source components. Keep in mind that quality wall sockets make a difference as well.
Warmest regards
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I am a big fan of Shunyata Research products. Years ago, I purchased Sidewinder Gold and Venom Zitron power cords. My system at the time was not very revealing and the cords made little difference to my ears. In 2019 after several upgrades, I purchased a Venom V10 NR. This was a great improvement with lower noise, increased dynamics... Then I purchased a Delta v2 NR. Totally awesome! Much better than the Venom and worth the price difference! To my ears, my best sound is when the Delta is plugged into the DAC. The Venom V10 is on my power amp. The DAC and power amp are plugged into a Shunyata CopperConn wall outlet.
I also use Venom V14 NR power cords on my iMac and DDC. I currently do not have a power conditioner. I have a 3 Duplex outlet box from Connex (PartsConnexion) that I have upgraded. I also purchased an AC noise meter like Shunyata uses in dome of their video demonstrations. I plugged the noise meter into an unused outlet in my outlet box. Interestingly, I found the lowest AC noise was when the two Venom V14 NR cords were plugged into the same duplex outlet.
Happy listening!
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Thanks very much @bjack70jr for sharing your experience! Very helpful!
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I’m also a fan of Shunyata conditioners and power cords. I upgraded from the old Running Springs products (multiple Haley’s and Jaco). The Denali 6000 v2 came first with the Sigma XC cord, and everything improved in terms of detail, separation, definition and weight. Later I added the Everest with Sigma XC cord and changed over the power cords for my preamps and sources. (I have both conditioners in my main system, as I have a combined two-channel and HT system.). The improvement was substantial with the Everest. I recently changed the Everest’s power cord from the Sigma to the Omega XC and another level of performance was achieved. I would say that the improvement of the power cord was almost as much as going from Denali to Everest in my system. OP in your system, I think that you’d be happy with the Denali 6000 v2 with Sigma XC combo.
Many thanks to @craig for his input in this thread. I guess I won’t try a Puritan any time soon, as I’ve been curious about that conditioner as well. I am confused about not using a cord higher than the Sigma NR’s however. While I do understand the noise reduction in the cords, wouldn’t a larger gauge of the Omega’s be of benefit? I have a QR-s on my DAC and have been thinking about an Omega QR for my Coda amp. Otherwise I’ve been very happy with the King Cobra Helix CX’s on my preamps. I just picked up one of the two KC CX’s recently sold and am looking forward to placing it on my Aurender.
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If you have the Everest with Omega XC cord and you are plugging your components into the Everest and not the wall outlet, my impression is that Shunyata does not recommend the Omega power cords for the components as they are in essence redundant ("too much of a good thing"). Speak with Richard at Shunyata (he is extremely helpful and always seems ready and willing to advise and educate; really nice person).
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thanks @kmmd, i think i’m leaning towards the Denali 6000 v2, but not ready to pull the trigger yet. Cheers!
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