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I love my Proac Response 2.5 speakers but would like a little more 'body' to the sound and deeper bass. I'm also very interested in the ribbon tweeters that are said to be much 'sweeter' and extending.
Could you comment on these and any other differences that you experienced when upgrading to your D40r's from the 2.5 response's?
Thx so much,
At their best, ribbon tweeters can supply amazing, effortless, shimmering highs. I'm definitely a fan. However, ribbons' native impedance is usually so low that they need especially careful integration into the rest of a speaker system. Often a conversion transformer is required, and the crossover(s) also require intensive analysis.
What this means is that it's next-to-impossible simply to switch out a dome tweeter for a ribbon in an existing speaker. You're much better off selling those speakers and purchasing some which have a ribbon already integrated into their configuration.
"more 'body' to the sound and deeper bass"
It looks like you are using a tube amp with medium to low power. The Proac 2.5 is very inefficient, but can produce deep bass (see the review in Stereophile). You should borrow if possible a fairly powerful solid state amp (high damping factor and 100-200 wpc) to see how that works with your speakers.
It looks like you are using a tube amp with medium to low power. The Proac 2.5 is very inefficient, but can produce deep bass (see the review in Stereophile).FWIW we sold our M-60 amplifier to a lot of Response 2.5 owners back when the speaker was in production. You don't need a solid state amp to get good bass on that speaker- you just need an amp with bandwidth (the M-60 is full power to 2 Hz). A solid state amp is not likely to get a 'sweeter sound' that is also sought.
For many years I drove my 2.5's very successfully with a Cary SET 300B amp putting out about 13w max. This combination was recommended by Arnie, the guy who founded Audiogon years ago. It was rumored that Denis Had used Proacs when voicing his amps.
@mozartbrain If you read a lot of review of the 48R carefully, you'll see that they say that the ribbon is well integrated, better than most, but that if you system is already fairly revealing, they may give too much of a good thing. I've tried in vain to find feedback on the D48, with the dome tweeter.
Thank you all for your comments.
On Thursday I auditioned the Proac D48r’s.
I brought along some vinyls - MJ BAD ; Messiah; Nat K.Cole etc.
1. Whilst we warmed up my Diva 25w/ch amp we listened to some CD’s (Eva Cassidy). We found the sound quite engaging: smooth, rich LF, nice mids and very smooth HF. However, we still found the overly ’warm’.
2. With the Diva connected on the 4Ohm taps and to the SS Pre - Phono - TT we listened to Nat K.Cole. Oh dear - sounded screechy and thin. We listened to some MJ and after a minute swapped the speaker wires to the 8 Ohm taps. This was much better. However, not the control of the bass and overall lost some integrity and coherence in there sound. We listened to some more vinyl with the same conclusion.
3. We swapped out my Diva for the shop’s SS Amplifier (100 w per channel) and everything was better. Control through all frequencies, smooth and engaging. The only thing we didn’t like was the slightly over ’warmth’ that is maybe a signature of these speakers.
So our conclusions:
1. My 25w/ch Diva is not capable of presenting the best that these speakers are capable of.
2. If I want a speaker of this ’ilk’ (2 woofers + Tweeter and crossovers) that needs serious drive power then I would need to purchase a new amplifier. However, I would rather investigate other speaker options so that I do not need to change my amplifier.
Today we auditioned the Tannoy Turnberry GF. Wow! My amp had no problem driving these speakers. Whilst the specs say that the bass only goes to 40Kz it was a much more musical and real. The sound stage is huge and 3D (compared to my Proac 2.5 and the D48r's) Clean sound and transparent too.
My wife liked them but was concerned I might be playing them at the same volume as we tested today. I said, "not quite - just seeing what they can do through my amp" I actually took my SUT, Phono, Pre and Power amp. All great except for a hum which I think was just the set up in the shop environment. Would speakers cause a hum? The hum increased with the volume control. This doesn't happen at home.
The shop use their turntable, tonearm and cart. They produced a very high Rez and resolving sound. I think my Garrard and ebony tonearm would mitigate the slight brightness that we heard and suspect was their t/table, arm/cart combination.
2. If I want a speaker of this ’ilk’ (2 woofers + Tweeter and crossovers) that needs serious drive power then I would need to purchase a new amplifier. However, I would rather investigate other speaker options so that I do not need to change my amplifier.As a general rule of thumb, if you want to get the most out of your tube amplifier, its in your best interest to avoid 4 ohm speakers- and this includes speakers that are rated at 8 ohms but have dual woofers such that the woofer impedance is 4 ohms.
So when I see dual woofers I make sure to find out what the impedance is at the woofer frequencies! If its 4 ohms its going to put your tube amp (regardless of the tube amp) at a disadvantage.
Now its also a simple fact that most amplifiers regardless of technology make less distortion into higher impedances. So 4 ohms means in general you will be hearing more distortion- and the ear converts all distortion into tonality, so this usually means 'brighter and harsher' with less detail than the recording itself. All in all its worth it to seek out those speakers with higher impedances- for one thing it means that the designer is listening to his product with a more discerning ear.