Potential Pair of Great Bookshelf Speakers for Sale!
What are they? That is the question. I have a pair of Totem Sky's that I really enjoy. But, for aesthetics, I just purchased a pair of Harbeth P3ESR's in Olivewood Ash. They look fabulous! I haven't had much time to break them in yet, but my first impression of them is positive. But I think the Totem's have more realism in the mid and low bass area. I find my ears perking up on certain music and I'm thinking to myself how great that sounds from a small'ish' speaker. And, I'm not driving them with anything spectacular. I use an NAD AVR with 60 watts per channel and that seemed to be more than enough to get that wonderful sound. Anyway, we'll see how the P3's do in the next few weeks. As to the title of this thread, I'll be selling0 one of these pairs soon. Any comments are welcome.
What you have in your speaker direct bake-off, depends entirely what you have them paired with upstream.
(1) The philosophy is clear. An affordable speaker with high-end amplification and source makes more sense in audio performance, than an expensive speaker with a cheap amp and source.
(2) Short-term outlook versus Long-term challenge: Your mid-fi AVR will be significantly bested by even a modest quality-build hi-fi integrated amplifier. If you have a future amp upgrade in your budget, then the HARBETHs will be finally able to perform to their significant strengths, and I am quite confident they will prevail in my personal experiences, having owned both brands.
Listen to the Harbeths for a month, swap out the totems and make your decision. Likely both will have pluses and minuses and you just have to make a choice.
Both the wharfedale diamond 225 and the old elac B6 have some of the best bass I’ve heard in a relatively cheap speaker. I would have to agree, pair either one with some high end Amp and source and prepare to be shocked. The other way around tends not to produce very good results.
I'm in a similar position. Currently have Wharfdale Jade 3 bookshelf speakers and have been considering Harbeth P3's. The Jade 3's are really nice in my small room but the P3's shine in the mid-range female vocals that I prefer. Is it worth switching? Don't know. I may have to buy some P3's and live with them for a few months.
Driving the Jade 3's with a Cambridge CXA-81. Better to keep the Jade's and move to a better amp or DAC? Just don't know. PM me if you decide to keep the Totems.
Decisions, decisions! My next step is calibrate my NAD Dirac Live for the new P3’s and listen to them with and without Dirac and see how I feel. I’m hoping the Harbeths are the keepers but so far, I’m not hearing what I used to hear on the Sky’s. ;(
Well, the Harbeth’s run the signal through about 30 POS network components, so long term, they have a ceiling. You’ll never be able to upgrade the network without running it as external. Just not enough room to make a double-sided PCB network rack in there inside the speaker. The super cheap, bottom of the barrel, components are smaller than those that are considered to be audiophile quality. Some would say this is not a problem because the speakers produce a pleasing sound. However, these types of network components have an absolutely undeniable negative affect on the signal. The drivers, in the right hands, have much more potential than they will ever show here as configured by the engineers at Harbeth. But don’t shoot the messenger. Much more well known and respected network engineers have said much worse about what’s behind door numbers 1 and 2 on the Harbeth Show. Of course you remember Let’s Make a Deal?
A strange way to go about things. You have the Totems that you like, so you go out and buy a pair of Harbeths. Now you can't make up your mind which you want to keep. But if you sell the Harbeths you will do in nearly half the money you just paid.
To see what a bad move this was, imagine you had gone out and bought 9 new pairs of speakers and you are listening to them all with a view to selling off 9 of the speakers you now have.
You can't go back but next time the right way to do this is to go out and listen to a range of different speakers. When you hear one you like get a loan of it for a week or two to listen in your own room and system. If you prefer it to your present speakers, buy it and sell the present ones. That way you will be sure you prefer the new speakers before you lay out your hard-earned cash.
Driving the Jade 3's with a Cambridge CXA-81. Better to keep the Jade's and move to a better amp or DAC? Just don't know. PM me if you decide to keep the Totems.
Why when you have this? Is that because you do not like Sabre DAC inside cxa-81 or some other reasons that dissatisfy you?
lanx0003 - Your question is spot-on. Truth is I very much like the Jade 3's paired with the CXA81. Only limitation is a certain muddiness or lack of crispness in the 500hz region, especially with piano music. I'm guessing that is a room acoustics issue. I've maxed out the WAF with a pair of tube traps, panels, heavy curtains, etc. I purchased a miniDSP SHD streamer with Dirac Live to address remaining room issues. The SHD is up and running but I haven't implemented Dirac Live yet.
Yesterday I auditioned the P3's at Decibel Audio in Chicago. The magical midrange was quite evident. Combine that with excellent imaging and soundstage gives one great sound. Better than the Jade 3's and worth the extra $? I don't know yet.
Same sort of issue with the dac. Moving from a Bluesound Node2i to the dac in the CXA81 was a major improvement, and for my use I am very satisfied with the SQ. Why consider something else? Well, it's the nagging feeling that even better SQ is within reach. For example, I've read good reviews and agon comments on Chord, Denafrips and Schiit dacs, just to name a few within my price range. Would I notice an improvement in my room with my music, etc.? Would I consider the extra $ worthwhile? I don't know, but over time I intend to find out. In the meantime I will continue to enjoy the Jade 3's and the CXA81 because, as you imply, there is really nothing wrong with them. Regards.
Sounds like great speakers. I don't live in the US so shipping would probably be to expensive for me.
One thing I can add is that my old speakers sounds WAY better after I changed the integrated amp from NAD and then Rega Brio to Schiit Ragnarok (much more expensive). So changing the amp may make any of your two speakers sound a lot better. You may want to try a new amp with the old speakers before choosing the new ones.
Well, 8 months later and I'm still running the Harbeths. They've grown on me. The key is I have to listen to them at above-average volume to get the sounds that make me take notice. Saw a teaser about new Totem Buffalo speakers but still nothing on the Totem site. So, for now, I'll heed the advice you've all offered and look to implement a dedicated amp/integrated amp with a home theater bypass. On top of that, I'm looking to replace my Bluesound Vault and external Schiit DAC with one of the new HiFi Rose streamers with the Sabre DAC.
The testing/auditioning continues. If I had an unlimited budget it might be much easier!
(1) The philosophy is clear. An affordable speaker with high-end amplification and source makes more sense in audio performance, than an expensive speaker with a cheap amp and source.
@akg_ca, I guess that is the philosophy I basically went with.
I agree. But that means sacrificing HT if one is to really do it right. I know I would miss it occasionally, so I’m trying to find the right amp with HT Bypass that gives me the (almost) best of both worlds. Parasound and NAD I think would be my best bets but haven’t been able to demo yet. Soon I hope.
I have the 30.2 XDs and use them as mains for my Yamaha RX3080 AVR for HT and just swap the speaker cables for 2 channel from my Raven Osprey. Best of both worlds.
Take a look at the Raven Nighthawk. It will power the P3ESR’s nicely and they offer a 45 day trial. They sell direct only, no dealer margin, so IMO you get more bang for the buck.
I like the Osprey so much I’m now lusting for the Reflection...hopefully I have a good year $$$$.
I use a Schiit DAC so I’m familiar with the direct to user economics and I support that. Don’t think I want to get into tubes at this point though. Wonder if you compared the P3s to the 30.2s and you thoughts if so. I like the P3s of course. Wonderful mid-range. But I need to pump up the volume before they sound right. Thought the 30.2s might be a better fit for lower (less than 70 db) volumes. Any experience with both?
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