Pioneer M-22 or Pass Aleph 3?

Anyone have experience with both of theses amps? How do they compare?
I'm not sure your going to find someone that has experience with both, as they keep different company.

I did have the Pass Labs Aleph 30 that Nelson liked better as it is an upgrade to the 3. Tighter bass, more dynamic, pristine clarity. I loved mine and it is still one of my all time favorite amps.
I had one of Nelson' Aleph stereo amps plus I've owned several M-22s and M-25s. I would place the M-22 above the Aleph stereo primarily due to the "magic" factor. The M-22 is one of the greatest low powered amplifiers that I've had the privilege to own and audition. Its magic is based upon a to-die-for liquid midrange coupled with simply holographic image placement. I prefer it to the excellent Classe DR2/3. The Aleph did nothing wrong, it just did not have that certain something we all strive for. It is not remembered as classic. Just a good basic amp. The mono blocks bettered it.

Good to here your comments on the comparison. But I disagree that the Aleph series are not classics. They sure are and have a following all the way thru Nelson Pass' kitchen table projects. The Aleph 30 is one of my all time fovorites.
When I talk classics, I mean amps such as Nelson's SA-1s, Krell KSA 50 or 100. Amps that transcend the normal. Again, I'm referring to the Aleph stereo model that was square in shape. I don't believe these particular stereo amps are as "collectable" as the SA-1s, or an S-500. Mind you, they have a following, as many of Nelson's products do, but those who like them perhaps may not have heard SA-1s. The Aleph monos are though, very very good. I have a dear reviewer friend who has them singing in his Wilson based system.

Just my thoughts,

Thanks Peter. I was considering the Aleph 3 as a replacement for the M-22 I have but I think I'll keep it! Exploring higher power class A amps and thinking of adding a Luxman M-05 to the collection.

Try a Pioneer M-25 if you want to experiment (just don't sell that M-22 to do it). The M-25 has more punch and edge definition a-n-d gobs of power, less magic but that's ok. And shhhhhhh, about the M-05, one of the world's greatest amplifiers. I'll leave that to a Stereophile article.

Hi Peter,
If you had your choice between an M-05 and a KSA 100, which would you choose?

But both are great amplifiers.

Thanks !
As to the Aleph 3 being a classic, I think if I'm not mistaken that Stereophile said this amp was so revolutionary for its day that they would have to reshuffle the whole A-rated Amplifier section of their rating system as this was so good it disturbed all previous ratings given to amps at over 10X the price.

(And Nelson typically only had one very small ad and I don't think it even ran in every issue, so don't give me any nonsense about its all about the ads! It might be some of the time, but this time it was about the amp :) .)
You are so correct. I'm glad you chimed in. It was considered the best amp at the time by many. The Aleph series sound right.
Thank you!
Dear Peter, When you mention an "M-05" amplifier, are you referring to the PIoneer Exclusive M5? If so, can you tell me what you know about it? I have a chance to purchase a pair of Exclusive M5a monoblocks but no chance to audition them, as they are in Japan. From what I can read on Vintage Knob, they should be/have been extraordinary. The M5 and M5a appear to be identical save for the fact that the latter offers balanced inputs.
Whoops! I see you refer to the Luxman M05. By bad.