I'm new to the forum, at least in so far as posting goes, but I have used it for reviews in the past. I recently made an equipment upgrade, and hence decided to do the same to the cables. I'm not sure if I notice a difference, other than the money that is no longer in my bank account. First, the back ground.
My last speakers were a pair of Sonos Faber Venere 2.5, which were hooked up to a NAD M3 amp. When I first paired these pieces of equipment, I was using 3 meter length, High Diamond 2 cables, bi-wired (2 pairs of cables, hooked up to the four pairs of terminals on the amp). The rest of the pieces in the system were the NAD M5 SACD player, the NAD M4 tuner and the Gold Note PH10 phono preamp. My turn table remains the impressive Acoustic Solid 111 Metal placed on top of their dedicated isolation platform, and paired with their WTB213 tone arm and fitted with the Benz Micro Wood L cartridge. The interconnects that I was using were High Diamond 2 RCA on the SACD player and the Tuner and Cardas Iridium RCA on the phono stage. Initially, I was using the stock power cables for everything, plugged into a run of the mill, $20 hardware store power bar. At some point in that systems' history, I upgraded the speaker cables to the Cardas Parsec bi-wired (also 3 meter), and bought a Cardas Iridium power cord for the M3 amp. To be sure, I noticed an improved difference in the sound, which I attributed to the Cardas speaker cables, more than anything, though it may have also had something to do with the Iridium phono interconnect as well..
Fast forward to this past fall, and I came into some money so I decided to upgrade the speakers to the Sonus Faber Olympica III speakers, the Simaudio Moon 700i V2 amp, and the Simaudio Moon 650D CD transport and DAC. Initially, I kept all of the cables and power bar the same. They remained in place from October 2019, until yesterday. I think that time frame gave me plenty of time to get to know the sound of the system, and for everything to get broken in.
Yesterday, I decided that with the obvious jump in improvement with the three pieces, I should take the plunge and upgrade the cables and power bar as well. I purchased Cardas' Clear Cygnus 3 meter, bi-wired speaker cables, two 1 meter Clear Cygnus interconnects, one RCA for the phono stage and one XLR for the CD transport, two Clear Cygnus 1 metre power cables, one for the amp, and one to connect the impressive Cardas Nautilus power strip to the wall. The Cardas Iridium power cable that I previously had was moved to the 650D CD Transport, and I used the stock power cable that came with the 700i V2 amp for the NAD M4 tuner.
What has surprised me most, is that lack of difference in overall sound that I have noticed. To be clear, those cables and power strip cost $8000CDN, plus tax!!! (inset appropriate emoji here). Is it my ears?
@jaredpurdy - A couple of thoughts. I think there are several reasons why might not be sure you’re hearing a difference with the new cables.
1. Stress. Anxiety. Misgivings about having spent all that money. Stress WILL have an effect on your hearing. It will cause the smallest muscle in the human body - The Stapedius muscle - to tighten up. THIS WILL AFFECT YOUR HEARING.
2. Cardas cables take a long time to break in. They will continue to improve for up to 200 hours. Leave them where they are for a couple of months.
3. Expectations - no one can say what your expectations were/are with these new cables. If you do a google search on the Kano Model you’ll see how expctation & performance & satisfaction are related.
You didn’t ask for advice, but I’ll share my .02. Relax. Have no doubt. You bought a loom of killer cables for your system. They will soon sound amazing. Yes, this is my opinion and others have a right to disagree. But I am very confident that you’ll come to love the improvement in your system and that eventually you will recognize that is not subtle.
Quick A/B comparisons are very unreliable for detecting differences in sound. And even less effective at clearly identifying differences that are improvements and that contribute to the listeners ability to "hear into" the recording to understand the musical intentions of the performers. In my experience your Cardas cables will eventually help you do this. You’ll find that they are different, and that they are an improvement, and that they allow you to enjoy your system much more.
My experience is that cables make extremely subtle, nearly inaudible differences. If you buy them because they appeal to you aesthetically, or to feel like you’ve ruled out a weak link, and it makes you happy by all means do it. Why not? But expecting dramatic differences imo is very much overstating what cables can do. Which frankly isn’t much. But thats just my experience. And, I’ve tried expensive cables. Maybe not the insanely expensive ones but I’ve compared in my system a $175 pair of speaker cables to a $375, to a $1200 pair. If there are differences, they are so subtle I can’t reliably tell. And my hearing is fine, and my system is easily “resolving” enough. Cable money imo is far better spent on improving speakers and room acoustics. And imo high end cables are 95% marketing and 5% reality.
Needless to say if you can spend 100k on cables and still have unlimited $ left to throw at speakers or acoustics then my hat is off to you. :)
OP -- What has surprised me most, is that lack of difference in overall sound that I have noticed. Is it my ears?
You need a clean sounding reference system to hear the sound difference. All audio systems in the world sounds dirty and distorted. Also, the reviewing cable (or gear) sound noisy and distorted. Therefore, it is harder to hear the sound difference of a noisy cable in noisy system.
My system sounds clean and I live-recorded 4 power cords with my system and the sound difference by cables is clear. Click these times (4:46 JPS), (9:50 Zentara), (14:38 WT v2), (18:53 WTPC) to hear different cables.
All audio systems in the world (except mine, my system sounds like a right speaker) sound like the left speaker in below video which sounds distorted and noisy.
Test your system if it is noisy. Speak anything while your system playing. Alex/WTA
new wire break in, about the break in period, believe the break-in period for cables to be in the 100 hour range, 150 hours of use and non-movement of all cabling for the system to settle in, for cable breakin. 150-200hrs is somewhat standard, 200hrs of signal thru the new cables, give them around 200 hours to really settle in..
Good team work. So you trolls don't use 'burn-in' anymore that's an improvement.
@jaredw03 - I’m afraid it’s a bit late to ask qiestions after a purchase, because the answers may not contain good news.
You’ve probably done some due dillicence in looking for cables based on reputation and price, but this is where the cable industry throws you a curve ball, unless you really know what to look for in a good cable, they can baffle you with "science"
Fact is, most cables do not deliver amazing results unless you really know what to look for.
Take a look at this thread, which provides some basic info on modern cable design approaches.
It covers modern design approaches by top cable brands
You’ll see three brands that I recommend, of varying budgets - all three will deliver noticeable improvements in any system.
One other thing to be wary of - High Capacitance speaker cables can drive high current solid state designs to a point of failure, especially if you are using low impedance speakers - so choose your speaker cables wisely
e.g. TOTL Cardas speaker cables have very high levels of capacitance
Yeah, I’d give them around 200 hours to really settle in, and then if you still have them put the old cables back in and see what you think (let the old cables settle in for a few minutes before serious listening). I’d think you’d hear a meaningful difference, but whether it’s better or worse, well, that’s cables for ya. I’m betting you’ll be pleased though.
Get 200hrs of signal thru the new cables then re-evaluate. Sometimes the difference is more apparent when you go from best to worst and you realize what you’re missing.
Also, few additional items to consider-
1. bad room acoustics will mask differences between cables and even between components. Any reflective surfaces like tiled floors, windows on the side of the speakers…anything that will cause the sound to bounce or create slap echo will impact what you are able to hear.
2. speaker placement and listening chair position relative to speakers - if not properly setup it will negatively impact your system performance and will most likely negate any gains possible with cable upgrades.
@lakI did the same on mine, but mine is even wors.. I added the XLRs end to end so I would have them burned in too at the same time. Now I did have my Valhalla broken in already since I had them for a month already and left my equipment on 24/7 for a few weeks and then 3 days with the burn in cd. I currently adding more XLRs, Power cords, and USB Cables. Next week my DIY xangsane 9003ag speaker wires will be in, and the following week my Odin 2 Gold speaker cables will be in.
Gonna be some serious listening going on to see which combo of wires I like the best. Then start allover again with the surrounds.😀
A few comments that I'd like to make and I agree with your conclusion other than I have no idea which cables made the largest impact. IMO it takes perhaps 150 hours of use and non-movement of all cabling for the system to settle in. I know this is a debated theory but you know what I have found to be true for myself. It's very had to tell what differences the cabling makes if you made more than one change at a time. I realize when we purchase new cabling etc no one wants to wait for one item to break in before we add the next new piece. I truly believe with a lot more hours of playtime you will hear an additional improvement.
After having run the new cables for most of yesterday and all of today, I can definitely say that I now hear a difference. I'm not sure what adjectives to use, but there is even greater clarity than what was there before.
Given the number of cables that were changed simultaneously, it would be difficult to say which one made the most impact, but I'm inclined the think that the speaker cables and the phono pre amp cable are likely the biggest contributors to the improved sound. I can only imagine that with additional break-in, the sound will improve more. I believe the break-in period for cables to be in the 100 hour range. If I'm wrong about that, please feel free to chime in.
Trying first was not an option. However, you are right about the break in period. With the exception of the Iridium power cable that I connected to the 650D, which I doubt would make that much of difference, and the High Diamond 2 RCA interconnect that I continued to use on the NAD M4 tuner, everything was brand, spanking new, and cold out of their respective boxes. Yes, time will tell.
It was an incredible sounding system two days ago, and remains one today. I'm just not sure what I'm hearing. However, I can say that I have peace of mind and no more lingering questions as to whether or not I should upgrade the cables to something more appropriate to the level of equipment that I have. I believe, if nothing else, the system has simpatico.
Try before you buy and be independent enough to judge the difference and render an honest verdict. At least buy used where you can recover invested funds. Lastly, be patient and let the new wire break in.
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