The S5 can play extremely loud without any strain (all reviews and listening sessions confirm that), but you do need an amp that can drive it at high levels. The amp at the NRC probably can’t drive the S5 properly; the impedance is rather low above 2K. There is no other logical reason for that (it is a Scan Speak based Revelator tweeter, one of the best around).
You seem to, rather strangely, concentrate on one thing, did you not see the astonishing lack of THD above 70 Hz (-50 dB for loudspeakers is more than plenty - and most likely impossible to measure outside an anechoic chamber). Feel free to look and compare to all the other speakers they measured; I do that for fun ;)
BTW, that is all history anyway, the S5 Mk2 is superior in all ways to the Mk1, and as you can see from the reviews, it is much easier to drive above 2KHz)
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The measurements of the S5 are exemplary, the lowest THD measured at the NRC . The legendary Martin Colloms from HIFI Critics, the last word on loudspeakers design, said (and bought), about the S5: “Just for the record, … the overall distortion never exceeded 0.1%. For 80% of the span below 20kHz it measured just 0.04% second and 0.03 % of third harmonic. These are amazingly linear results” “For the science-based reviewer, it is great to see theory so accurately translated into the listening experience. While the S5 MkII may not immediately impress with whizz-bang auditioning, it has power and majesty, excellent resolution, natural timbres, deep, dynamic, authoritative and very well timed bass, combined with huge well focused stereo images. Easy on the ears, you can listen for hours on end to this rhythmically involving and highly musical design.” http://www.magico.net/images/Reviews/S5/Magico_S5_II_complete.pdfIf you want to compare the "cheap" Magico to the Focal, someone unbiased already did (to the Sopra 2, which to my ears sound better than the 3 which have way too much bass). https://www.soundstageglobal.com/index.php/product-debuts/magico-a3-december-2017/739-magico-a3-loud... |
You are right on the money (and if the speakers are new, you heard nothing yet). Once you get it, there is no way back.
Forget about the Alexia (or the Alex). Wilson models just get worse as they get bigger.
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You should go back to the Magico before you make a final decision, you are getting smitten by the things that will ultimately drive you crazy (excessive bass). The mid bass regain on these is pumped up, that will be cool on some pieces, but try female vocal or chamber music (: I am also surprised you are not offended by the grainy top end, the S5 Mk2 tweeter is substantially better.
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It is a good analogue, where the road, and all the other inconveniences you describe, can be viewed as your system upstream. However, unlike the road, you do have control over your upstream, and you can ‘fix’ it, so your ride will be as smooth and cool (or choppy and hot if you wish) as possible even at 300 Mph. Magicos are incredibly transparent, they allow you to hear MUCH better what is in front of them. That is all. They don’t push nor mask information, or EQ the sound, they just let you hear what is coming in (Contrary to some reports they are not demanding at all, if you feed them right). Why would anyone want to mask this uniquely, clear window as opposed to start clearing up what’s in front of it?
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Here is Myles Astor review of the original S5, he WAS a big Electrostatic guy (ML to be exact): https://positive-feedback.com/Issue74/magico_s5.htmElectrostatic loudspeakers are a thing of the past. With today technologies, an adequately dynamic multiway design will have all the benefit (and then some) and none of the shortcoming. |
@shadorne
Why are you keep misinforming the forum? You clearly don’t know what you are talking about (but, I already explained this to you...), and even more important, IT IS NOT THE SAME SPEAKER. The S5 Mk2 has a different tweeter than the Mk1, and a different XO (easier to drive).
I am pretty critical on nonsense, but even I try not to rain on anyone parade, especially not with false information. Just a bit of courtesy for someone who is enjoying his new speakers.
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@whitecamaross...I believe the Magico tweeter is awesome but it is not built by Magico. It is built by Scanspeak with Magico’s specs... That is not true. SS build the S series tweeters (which is a lot cheaper).The M series tweeter is a proprietary 28mm tweeter (vs. SS, 26mm) with a much bigger motor system, definitely not built by SS. I own the M3 for some time now, never had issues, but a friend of mine M2’s needed a tweeter replacement due to mischievous grandchildren. It’s more tricky to replace, but a good technician or a set of good hands can do that easily. Magico was very helpful in that and provided him with a step-by-step manual on how to do that. Of course, one will be better off sending the speakers in, but that may be the case with any tweeter. BTW, I find Nordost speaker wire to be a bad match with the M3 (or any Magico I have hard). They seem to chock up the lower region, giving you the impression of more detail. I think they were designed with ported speakers in mind, where you may want to tame the bass somewhat. YMMV
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You have not lived with the M3, if you did not set it up properly.
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You will find out once you take them off the wheels! |
Now you are talking!
BUT, you shouldn't listen to the M3 on wheels. They don’t work as intended like that. Also, make sure you tighten the rods. Once you do all that, you will not miss the Focal as much 😊
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@kren0006 all equally disadvantaged I suppose. Not entirely, a sealed design loudspeaker floor coupling will be more critical, but yes, all speakers should be given a proper setup. Not giving the products the basic proper setup care is not a serious attempt at a meaningful evaluation. Not everyday one gets a chance to evaluate such an array of fine products, one should at least make the effort of setting them up properly... I am losing interest :( |
There is nothing "there", not a word about any "new" tweeters.
You should actually read it... |
Good to verify, it can save you some disappointments!
I am just reporting what I hear. To me, the Focal tweeter is a bit crude (I have listened to focal many times). It’s not just the level, it’s the quality. If you look at Focal tweeter measurements, you will see that the breakup is rather low (~25KHz), and that is probably what I am hearing, a slight but constant coarseness. It’s fatiguing. The M2 tweeter breakup point is much higher (~50KHz), it is much smoother but perhaps less exciting to some. I had the M3 for almost 3 years, trust me on that, without proper set up, you are not beginning to hear what this speaker can do.
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Can you please point me to some information on the new stella EVO
tweeter? I couldn't find any references to that anywhere.
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So you are 70 plus years old, and playing music, perhaps in an orchestra, which will expose you to +100db of sound pressure on a regular basis for 60 years?? That is a lot of wear and tear on the ears, maybe you like your highs boost 😉
I am only in my 50’s, right behind you buddy (if I am lucky), will probably like the Focal more soon, LOL. |
I have seen that, not seeing anything about tweeters, can you be more specific? |
@viber6 Also, FWIW, John Atkinson reviewed a Vimberg speaker for $31K and hinted that they have more HF air than the Magico M2 he reviewed a few months before that. Perhaps, but you forgot to mention that it is the M2, not the Vimberg, who got his vote for loudspeakers of the year, and by a wide margin (https://www.stereophile.com/content/stereophiles-products-2020-loudspeaker-year). There is a lot more to good sound than a splashy top end, which the Focals are notorious for. Not all ears are tuned to that (you can look at measurements, if you don’t hear it). In fact, some will argue that they gave Beryllium the bad rap it has. The magic of Magico is their balance. If set up properly (which our gracious host did not bother to do ☹), nothing stands out, for better or worse, yet it is all there. Some can find it boring, but for longevity, mostly if you listen to ’mildly’ engineered music like Classical and Jazz, they are in a league of their own.(https://www.stereophile.com/content/stereophiles-products-2020-editors-choice) |
Sure, will go with that...
Heard the Grand Utopia EM with the big Naim amp. Also, a good friend has the Scala. All using the same tweeter as your Stella, I believe.
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@viber6
That is not how it works. Once the breakup frqs are excited, the entire tweeter goes into a convulsion. That is why you want the breakup frq to be as high as possible. Like many metal domes, the Focal tweeter is coarse sounding due to too low of a breakup point, and as I said, even though some don’t hear it, it does not mean it does not exist. |
You excite the breakup regardless of SPL, it is part of the driver ’sound’ (Sure, graininess will be louder just like the rest of the sound as you pump the volume up).
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@techno__dude
+1
The Wilson way. LOL
@ kren0006
The reason Wilson stays longer is the pursuit of the so called “promised” good sound if the setup is right. It takes some time to run through all options available and then realize, there is no such thing 😞
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