Hi Dan_ed,
thank you for your thoughtful input.
Though, the key word here might just be --- IF --- or?
:-)
Axel
PS: IF that distance is way out, as some carts seem to be, the stock adjusting templates e.g. SME can become pretty useless. You suggest to buy a new custom template for each new cart ---- IF that distance we talk about is truly KNOWN! A lot of IFS... |
Hi,
looks like Herr Schroeder (Tonarme) got it right.
I won't post his take, it'll blow the lid of some folks, nursing other opinions...
In short, don't get hang up on all these variable measurements, since you can't change them. Learn how to tweak what you have i.e. use your ear :-)
The maths is correct! But life seems to beat it all the time.
Fine by me, and what a relieve to learn it from a highly regarded Tonearm maker (and German Watchmaker by trade to boot). Something to learn here, methinks.
Axel |
Hi Daniel,
maybe I should have REALLY mentioned his first name, it's Frank and not Gerhard, ja bitte!
I think he IS too busy making his product(s), and of course selling it. Don't know if he has a shop at the Reichstag, though? So he would have forgone this endeavour for repairing watches, I would too.
But as I said it was his 'trained' profession, didn't I?
Greetings,
Axel
PS: A lot of people are crazy about his stuff. Having seen it at the RMAF I can see why --- and it sounds very musical too, so? |
Tz, tz, tz, Daniel, I see what this is here.
Now don't tell us Herr Dr. Feickert is also part of the no discussion theme?
I met HIM promoting HIS player at the RMAF, and he had little time for the SME products, he resides way above such non-scientific aberrations, oh yes.
He has a following that tries to enlarge on Herr Schroeder's, so at least my impression.
Note: Everybody has to pay his rent :-)
Axel |
Jloveys,
>>> Speaking of Dr. Feickert, doesn't his alignment device measures the exact distance between the needle and the pivot point ? This is the question of this thread isnit ?<<<
Dr. Christian Feickert's device might do exactly as you say, but we are on about the shorter distance between stylus-point and the centre of the cartridge mounting-screw-holes.
All being equal (which it mostly is NOT) this aught to be 9,52mm or 3/8 of an inch.
This measure has of course a MAIN influence on the other measurement you ask about i.e. pivot centre-to-stylus point.
You might find a MAJOR discusion partner in "DerTonarm" (forum member's alias) to help you with your inquiry.
Take care,
Axel |
Hi Dan_ed
you say:
>>> If you change the cartridge, all you need to is move the cart in the mounting holes until the stylus hits the arc again <<<
You obviously didn't take note of, that we are talking about a SME V in my specific case, and the case I've been talking about i.e. ... "IF" my p2s comes to 233.15mm! plus +++ No need to mention the arm, since that spec is too well known by now, or? :-)+++
Seems there was a need to mention it after all.
In the case of 'fixed' arms there is no: "move the cart in the mounting holes" therefore one HAS TO RELY ON some reasonable proximity to 9.52mm s2mh...
You are OF COURSE right, that for arms other than that, it could be considered a mute point ---- until your mounting holes run out of adjusting space i.e. with some arms using an e.g. a Dynavector 17D3 Karat Cartridge.
Greetings,
Axel |
HALLO!!!!!!!
Welcome to the world of sharing :-)
It just shows that it helps to keep things level.
I for one did not know that Frank was alias Berlinta (Berlin TA --- ah, so!).
Well at least I only had nice things to say about you Frank. And having met you, if rather shortly, at the last RMAF made my impression of a most approachable and VERY dedicated Audio professional (it was just great to what you tweaking your arm set-ups :-)
Now you shared some more, thanks to Herr Kurt's little bantering (not to call it indiscretion). So every cloud has a silver-lining, one man loss the other man gain, hm.
I was actually trying to find out, what it was that caused this less then enthusiastic assessment of the Schroeder arm(s). Alas now I guess we will have some difficulty with this, I guess. Or what say you Daniel?
It also shows that sometimes this 'aliasing can be cause of embarrassing moments...
I myself put my foot in, when questioning Dave Slagle (THE trannie man around here) about his postings being 'oddly reminiscent' of some other originator(s). As it turned out most of it was of course his own -- under his non alias!
Well, Daniel, Frank, embarrassing as thing can be at times I still have to THANK YOU both very much for your valuable contributions, even if they do not converge...
This puts some spice and flavour in this 'blogging soup' :-)
Thank you for sharing,
Axel |
Hi Dan_ed
I'm not all the way with this adjustable p2s (pivot-to-stylus) protractor.
It obviously is not the 'fixed type' that you warn about below.
>>> So, check your numbers before ordering a custom protractor. <<<
The issue with mh2s is that it is part of p2s, and in any fixed mh head-shell arm of some pretty high importance to know, i.e. certainly no mute point --- lest your overhang AND zenith are out = more distortion.
So, your warring is BETTER well headed!
In the meantime I will stick to my stock alignment, since I DO NOT KNOW as yet what my PW's mh2s actually is.
"IF" my p2s comes to 233.15mm (please note the .15! part of it) I should be in the pound-seat.
No need to mention the arm, since that spec is too well known by now, or? :-)
Axel |
Oh my,
if a s2mh is a mute issue to you, so why do you bother at all?!
Isn't it YOU that is now promoting a particular arm concept, which then makes this enquiry NONSENSICAL?
Sounds like some ego trip to me. Closed case for you, fine. I was just trying to get you to understand that it is NOT a mute issue - yet.
There are OTHER 'fixed' arms made in this world then SME e.g. Linn and Origin Live I'm told.
You make the issue mute, I say not so, unless you come up with something more convincing than 'mute issue' because it's not your case... or you just want to right?
Please kindly consider this at least.
Thank you,
Axel |
Hi Johnbrown,
I truly do not intend this to be some 'navel gazing' :-)
I initiated this thread after there was quite some discrepant information coming about in some of the other related threads on set-up and arm geometry.
It was Frank that made me start (of sorts) when he mentioned some pretty widely spread measurements of a variety of carts. I have no problem with the notion that with a 'variable' head-shell type of arm this to be a mute issue. Not EVERY one might agree, but I certainly do.
If an inquiry into that subject comes to "pseudo-intellectual meanderings" I not so sure.
Look, if carts vary from ~ 7mm - >10mm s2mh it may be good to know. Particularly if as a result the off-set ability of ones arm is past it's limit. Let me hasten to tell you, it just so happens to my case...
I don't know if that makes it more acceptable for you understanding the underlying motivation? Having just spend $5000 on an otherwise good tonearm doesn't make me go out and by yet another one just because I'm a bit lost with these cart variations, that happen do result in increased IGD.
So let see if this will make it a bit easier for to accept our 'meandering navel gazing' :-)
Axel |
Hallo,
transmission break? Where is our man from Utting? Taking a break? Subject exhausted?
Frank, will it be a fair question for you to let us have the various makes' measurements of the s2mh posted?
Thanks,
Axel
PS: s2mh - stylus-tip to mounting-hole. |
