Monitors for Pass Labs 60 INT


Hello,

I am looking to upgrade my KEF50's. My setup is strictly digital (NAS>Aries>Vega>PL 60INT) in a relatively small room (8x12). I was considering the Raidho x1, but didn't like how the two paired.

Can anyone make recommendations for some monitors to audition in the 10k range?

Thank you! 
udisa
I own the KEF 50’s in a second system and the EA MMMicoone, so we may like the same things. I use all class A amplification as well.

I would recommend Evolution Acoustics MMMicroone, Vapor Cirrus, Dynaudio C1 Sig, Sonus Faber Guarneri Evolution or Olympica 1, and the LaHave Audio CFR.

Good Luck in your search!
What was it about the X1's that you objected to? 
I felt that the amp was too warm and not fast enough for the x1. they craved speed. I haven't tried the c1.1s. not sure if those will be any different. 
tom, the Evolution Acoustics MMMicroone seem interesting, do you think I have enough power to truly make them sing?
I would agree with your assessment of pass labs and raidho - i've owned both.  perhaps the wilson duette?  not quite as electrostatic like (fast) as the raidhos, but a tremendous speaker. 
indeed, but out of my budget at $22,500... any thoughts on harbeth 30.1 or joseph audio pulsars?
if you're willing to buy used, you might be able to find a pair of gen 2's in your budget.  certainly you could find a pair of original duettes for well under your budget.  i've got a pair of the original duettes and they are spectacular.
@ udisa, I think that 150 wpc at 8 and 250 to 300 wpc at 4ohm would be sufficient to drive them. Minimum imp is at 3.7 ohm. They are very special speakers. Check out the reviews and youtube videos.
Tom, my amp is rated at 60@8ohm and 120@4ohms. you think that's sufficient? one pro reviewer mention that these are hogs. 
I felt that the amp was too warm and not fast enough for the x1. they craved speed. I haven't tried the c1.1s. not sure if those will be any different.
The C1.1/D1's will be very much like the X1's but with a bit more low end. Dynaudio C1's come to mind with Pass.
Jonathan Tinn had a pair of 3mmm's for sale@$2800+.
Meant 3M's.
@Udisa, No. Your amp is not up to driving the EA miccroone’s. In fact that amount would only serve speakers that are 90+ efficiency. If you have been using that amp with the Kef 50’s you may not be hearing all that they are capable of. I am using SimAudio Moon i3.3 dpx with my Kef 50's. The amplifier is rated at 3dB for DYNAMIC HEADROOM, which means that, on musical peaks, it outputs 200 WATTS PER CHANNEL INTO 8-OHMS AND A WHOPPING 320 WATTS PER CHANNEL INTO 4-OHMS. Inside, this is one of the most beautifully crafted amplifiers I have seen. It is like a work of art. The Kef’s are great speakers as well, but they need robust watts to drive them with authority and aplomb.
thanks tom, that's very helpful. I talked to a knowledgable dealer and he suggested Joseph audio pulsars or wilsons duette.. the latter are outside my budget. 
No consideration to the KEF Reference 1 ? 
good suggestion, I am curious since I am using the ls50s now and Tom mentioned I might be short on juice already if I'll be in the same position with the ref. 1?
Looks like the reference 1 has an 85db sensitivity.

Pass recommends as per their site the int-60 to be used with speakers at 87db or higher.

I actually own the same amp and enjoy it greatly. It’s my first real high end piece of gear. Having upgraded from emotiva seperates the pass integrated blows them away sound quality wise.

For me I plan on bringing my amp , dac and laptop when going speaker shopping. If you can try this with your integrated. Might be the only way to truly know for sure how the combination will sound.
@mdp632 can you send me a link to the pass site with the info? I can't seem to find it. 

i agree, maybe I am being lazy, but that amp weighs 100+lbs. 
@udisa I thought it was on the web site but , rather the press release.  Please see below for the article.

http://www.ultrahighendreview.com/pass-labs-announces-new-int-60-and-int-250-integrated-amplifiers/

@mdp632 thanks! interesting to note, the same pr also writes "The INT-60 builds upon the INT-30A’s legendary “You are there” soundstage, offering spectacular realism, even with difficult speaker loads such as electrostatics or planars"



Can i suggest the harbeth M30.1 ?is efficient enough to Give juice from pass.

I think you need to move up,the Pass Labs line and buy more watts per channel. All of your favorite speakers, including the Kef's are not going to sound their best with less than 150 wpc at 8 ohm and 275-300wpc at 4 ohm. Anything less than 90 db efficiency is a tough load and probably has an impedance drop below 4 ohm if it is a two way speaker.
You may want to consider Focal's as well .  I drive a pair of 1008Be's with XA100.5 mono blocs with very good results. They are efficient enough where the INT-60 should do fine for most music at reasonable volumes. You may also want to consider the Focal Diablo.
Big mistake to not try Revel M106's. Just great speaker builders with huge budget for R&D. Just my opinion as a two pair Revel owner. 

What sound reproduction/speaker characteristics are most important to you?

udisa, have you spent any time with the Joseph Audio Pulsars?  I love that speaker and would be on my short list if I went to monitors.

@4425 i have considered them, but it wouldn't be much of an upgrade from my LS50's...   http://www.stereophile.com/content/tale-two-speakers#IzXHGLX8CZ7UmAQv.97
@soix i tend to gravitate towards warm, not too mellow, sweet treble/midrange, not too concerned with bass.. I sit fairly close to them in a smallish room.
@pops I have not, but very curious about how they would pair with my amp. I don't have any local dealers to demo them. The reviews seem to note these are fairly easy to drive in a small/mid room. What's your experience with them? 
@honeyooi I have considered these, but thinking they are slightly too large (physical size) - i sit relatively close to speakers. Size aside, do you have experience with these and pass?
Udisa:
Size wise M30 not too bad,even own bigger C7 on my small room,mine 10x9 similar to yours.
Been driving them with tube at 80w ,enough power!
Been own pass labs INT-150 ,yours pass will drive harbeth with easy.
Is size matter maybe I've try the P3 ,smaller in harbeth line.
You can see my set up on system,mine can only take from angle side cause I can't take from front cause too close about 6'.

I think you should consider the Wilson Benesch speakers. No relation to seller, but there is a pair of Discovery for sale on Audiogon at a good price. About 88 db efficient and should be a good match.
Haven't seen Sonus Faber mentioned. Some great used available plus newer monitors. 
Sorry. Just saw them mentioned. 
Udisa my experience with them has been at 3 separate shows and each time they made a big impression on me.  They are on the side of accurate, revealing, and big sound, so your Pass (which is believe is slightly warm) might be a great fit.  Amplification I heard behind them was lower powered tubes - I cannot remember the particulars but they were in the room with Devores Orangutan speakers and Leban integrated amps which are highly efficient and low power, respectively.  There were no big power amps present.

I would look at Penaudio Cenya Signature. I have heard them with the Pass 30.8 and 60.8 and was stunned how good the combination sounded. Stein Music also mated nicely but at a considerable price increase.

@cellorover That's a great suggestion... i was a little worried that at 86 dB, my amp wont make them sing. Moreover, TBS described it as "Darker overall character". Which is similar to how the pass is characterized. is it going to be too dark?
Udisa, I would call the sound more warm than dark. There was a fullness and richness to the sound. Maybe not the soundstage I like the best, but no real complaints...it would be splitting "thick" hairs. I think with a better preamp (maybe tubes) the sound would be "lighter" and faster. I heard them with the bottom of the line Pass preamp and also played direct from a Resolution Cantata Music Center.  There were good points about both set ups.  I recently added a CJ ET5 to my system (it took 2+ years to get there) and I am most pleased with the sound.  Hence, my suggestion to consider a tube preamp.  I also ended up going back to all tubes but kept my Resolution M100 mono blocks versus buying Pass.  They could be a good alternative to the Pass amps, depending on the rest of your system. 
Alright... i have a scheduled demo for the Focal Diablos... the dealer seems to think they will pair very well with my amp.
Keep me posted and Happy Listening!