Mogami wire quality?


Say compared to Cardas? 
ptss
Mogami is high quality wire. Many love it and those that do seem to stick with it and forget about wires. Others try it and move on to other brands, usually saying its a bit dull or lifeless in their systems. I like it a lot for pro audio and for connecting instruments to amps but havent tried it in my stereo system yet. 

Cardas is generally much more expensive and has many fans. 

I would like to compare the budget cardas 101 to Mogami but havent yet. the higher end cardas is in another league. 
Mogami is a very high quality cables suitable for pro-audio and home high-definition audio applications.
Cardas  has also good built quality and also suitable for hig-def home-audio, but it's more boutique and fashion than performance you're paying for extra. Same applies to most of high-end home-audio wires.
Cardas has many products at many price points, Mogfami not so much...

This is sort of an unfair comparison.  Mogami is a good manufacturer of pro-audio cables (which is a different industry).  In this industry, the goal is to make a durable cable that works well in live or even recording studio situations.  They are not after the ultra-high end sound that most audiophiles are chasing.  Also, the wire material is basic OFC copper that is stranded.  All this is decent for what you get.  They are generally less expensive (under $150 in most cases, unless you are getting a multi-channel snake or something).

Cardas has a very specific manufacturing method where it uses a very high purity copper and does a slow draw when forming the actual wire strands to make a long grain copper conductor (this is approaching OCC or Ohno Continuous Cast).  Also, much of their product uses litz technology where the individual strands are coated in an insulating enamel that makes the "stranded" wire act more like solid core conductors.  There is less capacitance since there is no delayed charging of the innermost strand.  All these make a much more expensive wire and this can have significant differences in the end result, for those who are critical and can hear the differences.

Auxiput,
+1 for sure. Well written, honest and accurate description. Solid performance and very good value? Yes. Can one exceed this level? Yes! If you don't hear a difference or believe that none exist then by all means purchase the cost effective Mogami.
Charles
"Cardas has a very specific manufacturing method where it uses a very high purity copper and does a slow draw when forming the actual wire strands to make a long grain copper conductor (this is approaching OCC or Ohno Continuous Cast). Also, much of their product uses litz technology where the individual strands are coated in an insulating enamel that makes the "stranded" wire act more like solid core conductors. There is less capacitance since there is no delayed charging of the innermost strand. All these make a much more expensive wire and this can have significant differences in the end result, for those who are critical and can hear the differences."

Actual specifications do not bear this out. For example, Mogami 3103, for example, has capacitance that averages about  26 pF/ft vs. the stated capacitance of 278 pF/ft for Cardas Clear. The Clear, on the other hand has much lower inductance than the 3103.

Mogami does make a lot of different speaker cables, some of them incredibly inexpensive and others, like their better 3103 and 3104 just relatively inexpensive.

Personally, I think Mogami makes some very good wire. I replaced some Kimber 8TC  (about $20-$25 ft.) with Mogami 3103 ($3 ft,) a few years ago after preferring a Mogami based tonearm cable to one constructed using Cardas wire. I've cryoed and burned in virtually every piece of wire in my system as I've found that to be cost effective and advantageous in terms of enhancing performance. 

I would never describe the Mogami I use as being dull and lifeless but I would say that it (the 3103 as speaker cable and the 2534 based tonearm lead I use) is a neutral cable, and I don't mean neutral in a denigrating way. It just gets out of the way. 

There are some very favourable comments on 3103 and 3104 on Arthur Salvatore's High End Audio site from a user who has, from the sound of it, spent substantially more on high end cables. But he clearly states that you need to look at that product in the Mogami line, as opposed to their less expensive offereings. . 

 
I have heard good things about Mogami, but not yet tried it. I use the pro-audio alternative, Canare; specifically L-4E6S, a starquad configuration, for interconnect. And ETI connectors, always ETI connectors.

Love my Mogami wires. Check my system details. Never tried Cardas. 
A bit off topic, but related. I'm making up a replacement cable for a Grace 707 arm. The stock one bit the dust and anything will be an improvement. I've purchased a Cardas DIN and am planning to use Canare (solder connection) RCAs. I was considering going with Cardas "Golden Selection Stranded Lutz" but was told it's a pain in the ass to work. Previously I've used Monogamy (and Canare) microphone wire in recording studios and it's been fine. Obviously a HiFi and pro audio are quite different applications. Any input on cable and connectors is appreciated. I figure I can always upgrade the cable down the road if I'm not satisfied.
Should I connect the ground/drain wire at both ends for a TT?
auxinput241 posts11-07-2016 4:16pm

This is sort of an unfair comparison. Mogami is a good manufacturer of pro-audio cables (which is a different industry). In this industry, the goal is to make a durable cable that works well in live or even recording studio situations. They are not after the ultra-high end sound that most audiophiles are chasing.


Did you learn that from audio hi-end magazines or dealers or nooz?
Mogami wires will humiliate most of high-end wires at fraction of price, because they're part of substantially more honest industry than high-end home audio. If you learn to read mind behind each written or spoken word, you'll understand what I mean.

I'm gonna have to agree with @czarivey twice in one week. Damn! 
Cheers,
Spencer
@czarivey speaks the truth here. Belden, Canare, Mogami, and I would add Kimber PR series, are all very high-performance for audio, at a reasonable price. They are actually so good that you do not have to lift them off the floor.
It is true that high-end home audio cables are in another league, but not in terms of performance, in terms of budget and non-sense.
No one on earth has proven that super high-end audio cables enhance the performance of a hi-fi system.  The opposite has been proven over and over.
co, according to the physics (Maxwell's Equations), capacitance is the great enemy at line level, while inductance is the enemy for speaker cables (because current is so much higher at the speakers). So low capacitance for tonearm wire and interconnect. That also goes for connectors, and ETI is the best alternative IMO.

Connect the shield to the RCA shell at the amplifier end ONLY. That avoids one source of ground loop.

I always make sure that the tonearm is grounded, so yes, I connect the drain at the tonearm body, and at the preamp ground. Both ends.

I think that your approach is by far the wisest one: use microphone cable and then let another cable prove it's superiority before buying. I have never upgraded from Canare Starquad, and my system is high end.

i use mogami w2497 high end single ended interconnect from amp to preamp. this is mogami’s audiophile interconnect; look it up. it is very quiet and sounds great. plus it’s made in japan, not china or a third world country.
".....Chrisr
187 posts
12-07-2016 2:46pm
"....
No one on earth has proven that super high-end audio cables enhance the performance of a hi-fi system. The opposite has been proven over and over...."

Chris r..... NOT SO. The opposite has indeed been reported as highlighted below. 

http://novo.press/taves-consumer-electronics-show-2014-now-we-have-a-ces-north-part-2-by-george-de-s....

Nordost

I had a chance to sit in on a couple demonstrations in the Nordost room, giving my feet a well deserved break. I’m very familiar with the benefits of high quality cables and use a full Nordost Heimdall 2 loom with my reference two-channel setup. That being said, I always find the Nordost demonstrations to be an “ear-opening” experience. Michael Taylor from Nordost demonstrated the significant sonic benefits of replacing an OEM cable with a Nordost model – in particular 1) a swap of a single USB cable, from OEM to Nordost Blue Heaven ($250/2m), to Heimdall 2 ($500/2m) and; 2) a swap of a single RCA interconnect, from OEM, to Blue Heaven, to Heimdall 2, to Tyr 2 and finally Valhalla 2. Along with convincing the audience in the room that cables DO matter, I’ve now got the bug to upgrade..."


@hdm 
From the Cardas website...
http://www.cardas.com/clear_ic.php

Capacitance reported for Cardas Clear Interconnect 
RCA Capacitance: 16 pf/ft
XLR Capacitance: 8 pf/ft

Measurements for Cardas Clear Speaker Cable
Capacitance: 278 pf/ft
Inductance: .0176 uh/ft

Correct me if i'm wrong . Wasn't Nordost busted for playing a cd with the same tracks recorded to play back inherently louder and they would swap cables in and the higher up in the line the cd track played louder and seemed better quality therein ?
The reason Mogami does not have ten different models i believe is the consumers of their wire realize that paying more money for copper wire is foolish and unnecessary .They cant make anything carry a signal better so they cannot charge more for "different" wire.
Cardas is too rolled off and/or soft on top for my taste.
Score so far:

Total Posts: 20
Posts with actual comparison of Mogami with other wire: One (hdm)
Posts recommending Mogami Wire without comparison: Two
Posts theorizing about why expensive cable should sound better: Five
Posts ridiculing the notion that expensive cable can sound better: Six
Posts stating something not directly related to topic: Six

Conclusion: ????

Dave
Talking about wires often raises ires.
I'm one who would purchase exotic cables if I had a super expensive system that would merit such. Not because of sound improvement but more for aesthetics. If I owned a Ferrari, I would not put Craiger wheels on it although they would probably perform adequately. If I had a 2 million dollar house, I probably would not have Target furniture even though a chair is a chair. 

With that said, I always did wonder the sonic benefit of owning cables that are much better than the cables used on the majority of recordings we listen to. 
no need to wonder, it's easy and free to compare and find out...
@dlcockrum interesting summary. 
Please add me to the "Posts with actual comparison of Mogami with other wire" category.

I've previously owned Cardas Golden Reference in both speaker wire and interconnects. They've all been sold as my system has evolved away from components where the manufacturer recommended and demonstrated gear using Golden Reference(i.e. Merlin, Joule Electra). One of my changes was to longer balanced cables and I chose Mogami(partially on suggestions from Atma-Sphere) as I was connecting his amps and preamp with long balanced runs. So it's not apples to apples, but I can say that balanced Mogami cables are natural, neutral and quiet. Do a great job fighting noise and don't really call attention to themselves. The Cardas were warm and lush helped tame hot tweeters, etc. In a more neutral transparent system I wouldn't think they'd be the best choice.
Since then, the whole system has changed, but the long balanced Mogami cables have stayed, and I've added another pair for connecting DAC to preamp. If they dressed them up in fancier jackets, changed the name to Indulgence by Mogami and tripled the price, they would sell more to the audiophile crowd. Cheers,
Spencer
Definitely adding you to the first category, Spencer.

I can't resist completely agreeing with your assessment of Cardas cables (excepting their litz tonearm wire). Veiled on top and best avoided if transparency in a priority.

I guess that makes this post an add to the last category. lol

Dave
Do any of you know where I can purchase a short length (4 meters) of Mogami 2803? Alternatively 2497? I've only found rolls for sale. Thanks

@dlcockrum 

Say compared to Cardas?ptss
...Is there any difference between "compared to Cardas"?
Factually, I think there is where at this particular post Cardas had been taken as an example, so comparing to OTHER high end cables with Mogami is also RELATED.

With you on that czarivey. The score was calculated that way. Any post stating that there was a direct comparison of Mogami to another brand of cable was counted in the first category. Before sbank, the only one that stated that he actually compared Mogami to another brand of cable was hdm.

For the record, both also stated that they preferred the Mogami to the other cable.

Dave


I currently use interconnects made from both the Mogami 2534 and Canare L-4E6S cable.  I am using both in my system and have never got around to making comparisons.  But no complaints and I do prefer them over my Cardas Neutral Reference and Museatex Meitner interconnects.  

I use the Canare 4S11 speaker cable and do like it a lot.  Can only compare it to Belden speaker cable and Goertz Alpha Core MI-2.

Posts with actual comparison of Mogami with other wire: 3 (hdm, sbank. jetter)

All three preferred the Mogami to the more expensive competitor.

Dave
but I can say that balanced Mogami cables are natural, neutral and quiet. Do a great job fighting noise and don't really call attention to themselves. 
I have Mogami older (about 12 years old) balanced cables in my home studio connecting my audio interface and Yamaha monitors. My old, cheap "guitar center house brand" run of the mill cables were a bit noisy. When I switched to the MG, night and day. Really quiet and neutral sounding. After 12 years, not one issue. I believe I am running 6 feet each channel. 

I may try a pair of Mogami RCA interconnects when I get a new component. I am really happy with Blue jeans (Beldon) on my main system. Plus, I am running Canare Star Quad as speaker cables. I'm thinking about trying a pair of ZU Event cables.


akg_ca , if there’s an audible difference, they are increasing wire thickness and/or reducing cable length with each ’upgrade’. Monster cable has done that kind of demo well before nordost or audioquest.

Thanks for the link by the way... it's a good read.
Chrisr

I was there among the masses in the actual demo ..... it was a straight swap in swap out with no cable length change

As the A-B swapin swap-out exercise moved up the cable model selection, there was a steady audio performance improvement from bottom to top.

When you examine the cables (ICs and speakers ) either in person or by way of reading on their website, FOR SURE there is a progressive improvement in build materials, silver content, resultant weight, and Especially in the progressive design improvements and increasingly difficult and improved manufacturing processes.

Over the three days, we then visited most of the audio demo rooms by all the exhibitors. It is a large show. What we saw was that The VALHALLAS , by far, comprised the highest number of selected cables used by all unrelated independent gear and speaker brands with demo rooms in the expo. Assuming they are all putting their proverbial best foot forward to draw attention to their own product, Draw your own conclusions.

What that tells me is the obvious and the intuitive --  system synergy matters and one-size does not fit all. 
Choose wisely
Mogami is great stuff, and very high in the performance for money. I would say that if you cannot budget around $1K for some interconnects, you won't do much if any better than Mogami. IMO, YMMV....

It does get better though. Zenwave Audio makes cables using very nice wire that compete with anything out there at any price. Build quality is better than any other cable I have tried as well. This is truly cutting edge stuff.
@co_jones I bought some at Redco
Mogami is really, really good for i/cs or speaker cable. If interested, I suggest you contact 10audio or zenproaudio who are Mogami experts. They can advise you as to the appropriate Mogami cable series for your i/cs or speaker cables (very nice folks as well).

Mogami W2552 is also good for headphone cable. Cardas 4x24 is my favorite for headphones.  If on a very tight budget, Canare L-4E5C star quad is likely to be an improvement over most factory supplied headphone cables.

Just saying ...
Even if one wants to pay more for boutique cables in certain applications, the Mogami Gold Studio balanced cables are an insane value at about $40 for a 3' pair (from Sweetwater, Musician's Friend, Guitar Center, etc.). Great for subs, surround sound, home theater, systems with Atma-Sphere electronics ;-). 

Also, the wire material is basic OFC copper that is stranded. All this is decent for what you get. They are generally less expensive (under $150 in most cases, unless you are getting a multi-channel snake or something).

Cardas has a very specific manufacturing method where it uses a very high purity copper

Just a FWIW: if anyone tells you that their wire has greater purity than 99.99% (for example the myth of 'six-9s' copper) turn around and run as hard as you can.

No-one anywhere has copper purity greater than 99.99%. This is due to the facts of extrusion- you can certainly start out with something more pure, but by the time its actually safely in the insulation its no more than 99.99%.

99.99% is what is known as 'OFC'.
Just watched a video link in a thread for a Moon 888 amp . At the end Micheal Fremer asks what the wire inside this $120,000 mono amp is.  Guess what it is ?
It was over on the Dan D Agastino thread . What is pretty funny is Fremer starts saying look at the size of the power cable . Saying people will be up in arms over the efficacy. Then he asks the Moon president "whats this wire brand in here ? The guy says Mogami . LOL  
An fyi to anyone interested.  
Recently purchased a pair of these from Musician's Friend:
Gold Neglex Quad Microphone Cable for Studio Neutrik XLR 3ft

$79.90 for the pair
Free shipping
45 day return period
Post removed 
Right you are gh, it's $39.95 for a single, not a pair. I got the 15' version for $54.95/ea, and 25' is only 5 bucks more.
I used two 20 ft pieces of Mogami Blue Neglex 2477 (coax OFC copper) to my pair of KLH Nines. 1992 - 2015! Sounded excellent and never felt compelled to change! Cost was $1 a ft (1980)! 
Mogami is a very sound choice for premium wires. Very high quality products that work and sound great. Only an audiophile could find fault. Not that all wires necessarily sound the same by any stretch.
Wish I had tried Mogami ICs sooner. Mighta saved a bit of money. A pair of XLRs are sounding very good with less than 15 hrs on them running between DAC & pre-amp. Excellent extension of highs and lows. Very transparent sound with impressive detail & imaging that support a big sound stage. Not harsh, not grating (not so far, anyway). Decent amount of mid range warmth. Great value. Better to my ear than the BJC Belden 1800F balanced ICs I got in around the same time (~40 hours on those). The Beldens don’t have the same clarity or tonal neutrality. They seem to have a bit of a bump in the lower midrange/upper bass. Bass is fatter. Treble a little rolled off. Warmer than the Mogamis but at the expense of clarity.

I use a Mogami gold stereo mini to dual male rca wire (~$90) to run my Chord Mojo DAC into my Audio Research preamp.  The sound is exactly as ghosthouse described.  Absolute top notch in every way, both inform and function. I love the fact that the wire is so very pliable and easy to route as needed. Couldn't be happier!   I'm a Mogami fan boy now for sure. 
Joseph Levy of Tempo Electric told me the same thing the atmasphere stated. 4 nines of anything is all there really is unless you get into exotic jewelry (the kind you wear). He went on to say that it's actually 99.975 for silver due to the fact you simply can't get all the impurities out during manufacture. The same may hold for copper as well.

All the best,
Nonoise