mbl - is there a problem?

In general I will not buy any expensive product that does not have a solid support system behind it.

omni sound in general and mbl specifically done well is radically different. IT can take some time to get it. But I I believe once you do many will never look back at anything else.

It's almost like throwing a switch in teh way you are trained to listen, once you get it, which can take some time. Once thrown, its hard to go back.

I owned OHM Walsh speakers since ~ 1982. Also, Maggies and various more conventional designs. WHen I upgraded to the newer Walshes recently, it took me several months to tune in properly and be able to hear what the newer and more refined Walshes were doing, despite all those years of exposure. Once the lightbulb went off, that was it though, save for tuning the system to maximize the performance of what I was hearing further. Its an apples and oranges kind of thing.

I've heard mbl sound very good in a proper dealer setup (10-12 feet of space behind the speakers and not a typical rectangular room configuration back there, rather the width tapered down further back)) and also sound very mediocre at shows in more conventional setups. THere can be a huge difference. WHen they sounded good, the soudstage and imaging overall was practically in a league of its own, especially in terms of soundstage depth and precise location of musicians or recording elements within the large and deep soundstage. I think that is the mbl sound's unique claim to fame. The extent to which this is realized is largely what will separate mbl from others soundwise. Otherwise, there are many ways to skin the cat out there, many of which are no slouches in the imaging and soundstage departments either, just not to the extent of the best mbl setup I have heard.

Heavy stuff! Expensive too. My mbl demos have been brief so I cannot comment based on extended exposure, but it is a quite unique experience that could take some time to process.

If one had to ship large mbls to GErmany for support, that would be deal breaker for me especially in conjunction with the overall cost of ownership for mbl gear. There appears to be a lot of technology that goes into the mbls. Maybe they are relatively low maintenance in general though. Dunno.

WHen I heard a good mbl demo, it sounded like an orchestra playing in the dealers showroom more so than any other demo I've ever heard.

Not hifi. Real sounding! That demo set one of the highest bars I've heard.

In that demo, the vinyl bested the CD and the RtR bested the vinyl and sounded more realistic.

I'll suggest that if an mbl system does not sound good, its not because of what the speakers are capable of. IT may take more time and expense than many are prepared for though to really get to the point where one can push them to their absolute potential. These are exceptional speakers that require exceptional setup and equipment (and expense) up front to do what they are capable of doing.

It's all too much for me. I'll happily stick with my OHMs for now.

THe smaller mbl monitors might be more manageable than the larger full range floorstanders. I need to hear those sometime.

String,

Can you elaborate a bit on how the German Tanks sounded?

DId you detect very accurate location of the tanks within a large and deep soundstage?

IF not, then something was not right.

mbl done right is a unique experience. It might take time to retrain your ears to hear what's happening if not used to it. That has been my experience with omnis in general.

mbl done poorly sounds like an unimpressive hifi system. That is what I have heard at shows even when done by the same dealer that did it right in their showroom. That tells me that it is very hard to get the setup right in most rooms.

"the bass is very boomy with no depth or space at all. If indeed it is the room, then it very well may be a design flaw if this expensive equipment also needs a special room.

Speakers always have to be rightsized and integrated properly into the room for best results. omnis are no exception except having distance from the rear wall in particular is generally more important with omnis.

If the bass is boomy and undefined more likely a design flaw by whoever integrated the system into the room, not with the speakers.

String.

"Don't you think that an outlay of this much money would be designed so that the room or speakers aren't that critical of each other?"

No clue.

What dealer?

The good mbl demo I heard (mbl 111s) was at United Home Audio in Annapolis Junction, MD. in a good sized showroom. Bass was not boomy.

"or could it be that the bass is boomy and undefined and the right room can suck up these flaws??"

Not sure any room can make a bad sounding speaker that is inherently boomy and undefined into one that isn't?

Rather, a good setup is key to bringing out the best in whatever is played in it. Results are usually only as good as the weakest link in the chain.

Holographic presentation is the unique strength of mbl. If that is important to you, definitely do not buy until you audition mbl. Otherwise, you may not care so much.

Having heard a lot of top notch systems over the years, I'd say without question mbl is the champ at doing holography on a large scale. "On a large scale" is key. You have to have a large and well set up room though I think, at least for the larger floor standing models.

Other aspects of their performance compared to the competition is more debatable in my mind. I would say they are very solid in most every other regard as well assuming proper setup and matching to room, but other lines might easily be preferred in certain regards depending on personal tastes.

I can see where the larger mbls would easily overpower smaller rooms which does not make them a good choice for many.

Anybody know how the mbl 121s perform in smaller rooms in comparison to the larger floorstanding mbls in larger rooms?

I have Dynaudio Contour 1.3mkII monitors tuned in very nicely currently in a 12X12 listening room. I often wonder if mbl 121s could work well in a room like that. I think I have the amp needed to drive them (Bel Canto Ref 1000m monoblocks) in that I understand they are extremely inefficient.

Marty,

Thanks for the info.

I'd love to try smaller mbls sometime in comparison to my Dynaudio monitors in the smaller room. It would probably require a significant additional investment to do it though, so it may be awhile with two kids to still send to college and all.