Looking for guidance with older VPI HW-19 tables

All bias aside, I like the way the HW19 looks. The platter on the MKIV is a better platter than on the Scout, for better rotational inertia. The 19 accomodates more tonearms than the Scout (try putting a linear tracker on a Scout), and allows you the flexibility of experimenting with different types of suspensions. Reread Sdcampbell's and note that his comparison was to the more expensive Scout Master. By many accounts the 19 gives a fuller, warmer, more musically involving sound (this part obviously a subjective thing), than the leaner sounding Scout.

Good luck with your decision.

I disagree about buying an unsprung table. In my experience, wether you like the sound of the HW19 with springs or not completely depends on what you are sitting the table on, and wether your floors are springy or not etc. Much harder to come by a set of springs after the fact than to get (or constuct) something to use instead of springs. So, if you have the option, get one with springs. That way you have the option to experiment. I owned one for many years, and switched from springs to pucks to cones and back at least four times; all depending on the setup.

The HW19 is a terrific table, and for the money just about impossible to beat IMO. Many upgrade options available. The HW19Jr is not in the same class as the regular HW19, specially the MK4 with heavier platter. The standard lead filled/cork bottom platter of the HW19 is very good.

As far as the bearing goes, this is a simple test that has worked for me: disengage the belt and give the platter a good spin. Put your ear close to the platter. You should hear NO grinding or swishing noises at all. The platter should take at least a solid minute to come to a complete stop; two minutes or more is ideal. Feel free to email me for more personal experiences.

Good luck.

The HW19, while an aesthetically "dated" design, is performance-wise, not a dated design at all. The Jr.'s main liability was it's inferior bearing/platter assembly. The original acrylic/lead/cork platter (not the Jr.) of the true HW19 is an excellent platter. Much superior to the Jr.'s lighter frosted acrylic platter. The bearing is also much better than the Jr.'s. While reconstructing the Jr. with a better plinth will most definitely improve the table, the improvement will not be nearly as sinificant as upgrading the original Jr. platter on the original Jr. plinth. The very best possible plinth material will do nothing to improve the Jr.'s problem with pitch instability, and PRAT as compared to the HW19 MK1,2,3,4. This problem had everything to do with the inferior platter/bearing. The upgrade to heavier TNT platter, combined with steel/acrylic plinth of the MK4 take the table to a level which makes it competive with many much higher priced tables. Not to mention additional possible improvements by way of SAMA, flywheel, SDS etc.

I started with a HW19 MK2 then upgraded the platter (very good in it's own right) to the heavier original TNT platter/bearing: tremendous improvement in solidity, pitch stability, PRAT.

Then to a full blown MK4 (acrylic plate) with the same platter/bearing and SAMA: nice improvement. Slightly faster, yet richer sound. But relatively subtle, and not nearly as great as the platter upgrade to the MK2.

Then I added a SDS: greatest improvement of all. Much better sense of control, improved soundstage.

Then to a hybrid TNT6. TNT6 plinth, Ginko ball suspension towers, TNT5 acrylic/steel platter, SAMA, single flywheel, SDS. More refined sound still. Quieter, improved soundstaging, slightly better bass extension.

The moral of the story (to me, based on my experience)is that if you accept that the VPI TNT is a contender for being one of the better tables around, a HW19 MK4 with SAMA, and ideally with SDS, when well situated and suspended, is not nearly as far behind as one would think given the price difference. BTW, tonearm was always the same ET2, and a variety of cartridges.