dont argue with an American over 55, they're all complete morons. they see everything as "team USA"..and the world map like it's 1985. everything slots into place according to that. audiolabryrinth is just one of these dried up overly proud Americans that is stuck in the past. I'm American, btw. I have to put up with it everywhere I turn. even if they've traveled it doesn't help. there's just something wrong with their brains. it's probably television.
btw, I'm had both Burmester and krell. there is no real comparison. Burmester is crystal clear music. krell is hifi. it's just different. and krell looks like trash. it's Porsche vs mustang. a mustang is a toy that goes fast. you want really good American brands that can compete on the global stage? Ayre and Boulder. even then, Burmester's sound is so clear, it doesn't sound like hifi..and yes, to the earlier comment. it's timeless. but the Ayre MX-R Twenty mono blocks are spooky good...
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Hi Meridian23, Yamaha is very good in my book, back in the 80's, I had a R-100 reciever, to this day, I have never heard a better sounding reciever at any cost!, A prime example of what I am saying is the dicovery of an ad in the music Direct catalog 15, newest one out,I was shocked to read and adore the Yamaha specs and cosmetics, Yamaha is not fooling around, The Yamaha cd-s3000 sacd player/dac $5,999.00, The Yamaha A-s3000 intergrated amplifier $6,999.00,, I bet this equipment would kick the crap out of some big name higher priced gear, you think? |
It very funny to read a tread from the Major league of Audiogon member. If you have enough fortune to own
a Krell or a Burmester power amp just rejoice and enjoy
the music!!! Me i just receive a Free Yamaha M40 to load
my AR 3 and i'm very happy. Or course as you my goal is to build the best high-end possible system. But sometime we
cross the valley of pain and in that period music is good for the soul. Until i get again to the top of the hill i said
thank you to every one sharing is time and experience to us
where Krell and Burmester is still a dream... |
I am neither German nor American, and I was not invloved in WW2. TO MY EARS AND HEART, I take a FULL Burmester system anytime! ;)
Having said that, if you like mix-&-match, SF speakers tend to match better with Krell. |
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Hi Audiolabyrinth,
thanks for your post. I'm totally agree with you. Sorry also for my side. No winners at all, but only preferences alike anything in the passions.
Cheers to you too ;) |
Hr1, Hi, I wanted to say I'm sorry for my conflict with you here, I'm not perfect, But I will be a gentleman and ask for you to please forgive me, I should have moved on instead of doing this with you, like I said, there is no winner here, preference rules the day, you are welcome to come to the cable thread called Tara labs cables, I would like for you to share audio there with us, you can talk about anything audio there, no such thing as staying on topic there, that is a snob deal that I do not care for, bloging is about shareing, in this case, everything audio!, cheers to you. |
Audiolabyrinth
Enjoy your modded krell 700cx. I don't own Burmester, but I hope to purchase one when I'll have the budjet. |
like I said, I do not stand alone here, The op himself said he preffered the krell over your over priced Burmester equipment,your the only one here screaming Burmester, My first comment was that I was not suprised of the out come of the preference by the op that he liked the krell amp instead of the Burmester, thats all intended to say, then you come along and blew all this up like burmester is the holy grail of audio!, again, another like I said, preference is at the end users tast, what part of that you do not understand, there really is no winner here, just preference, and that seemed to up-set you someone prefered krell over burmester that happened to be the op here, loud has nothing to do with it, as a matter of fact, I know set tube amplifiers that sound better than your beloved over priced Burmester, and for your information, since you know it all, I have listened to some older burmester amps years ago, it's not like amplification has done leaps and bounds with technology these days!, I know many systems with 20 year old amps that eat up most new equipment in sound quality!, krell fan has nothing to do with this, everything to do with your Bold statement of burmester is best and nothing else comes close! |
Audiolabyrinth
No make our discussion as personal dispute. First you said
if I'm a German and now you're supposing if I'm a delear.
Sorry but you're off road at all. As you're judging
something that you never experienced in listening and for
what/way you're reporting you seem that you're a Krell Fan.
Very difficult to talk with a Fun. For your kind reference,
I'm a music lover first and then I like very much the gears
that reproduce a very good sound quality near to live event.
For me Burmester and few gears more reach the heaven. As I
told you already I know krell amps/components since long
time. They're well known for their ability to drive any
complex load and to sound very loud, but their musicality
and overall sound quality is not at same level. Enjoy your
modded krell 700cx and please report if you'll listen a
Burmester gear. |
HR1, really, The op said the krell EVO 302 was better to him than the Burmester amp he auditioned!, Burmester is over priced Euro equipment!, there is no such a thing as best period!, Rather preference to the end user, you sound as if you are a dealer?, I tell you what, I will put my modded brand new krell 700cx amp against any Burmester stereo amp in front of a panel of judges blind folded and wipe the Burmester off the face of the Earth with sound quality my friend!, now you have no idea what is inside my amp that is not stock! |
Audiolabyrinth I repeat again you don't know what you're
saying. I am not german but I am a guy that know the hystory
and the present of hiend audio. Burmester is considered one
of the absolute best audio brand from usa magazine, like
stereophile, tas, toneaudio, ecc. Any burmester components
is far superior to any krell. Any Burmester component is art
for the ears and the eyes. That's the true. You've mentioned
the kps 25c. Do you know the combo 969-970 or 001? I refer
to these models only because playing in the same period of
Krell, because now there is the reference 069's that is
sonically a world apart. Listen and then refer. Burmester
docet. |
HR1, that is your opinion, are you a german?, them guys always believe what they make is better than the U.S.A. makes, That's why they lost w.w.two!, an example as to why you are wrong is the now Obsolete Krell KPS 25sc, Burmester, Really?, get out of here with that noise!, Burmester has never made anything to the quality of that krell piece alone, hey, and what about the Krell Master refference mono blocks, you got to be kidding right?, seems you really do NOT know anything about krell with a claim that you made! |
@Audiolabyrinth
You have to listen first a Burmester power amp and until now
for what you wrote seems that you never experienced yet. So,
what we're talking about? I know all the Krell line nearly
and listen in controlled manner all their products and at my
ears are just good. Every few years an entire new line of
products by Krell are released and the previous are already
over. I invite you to listen a Burmester first and then
judje.
Burmester is Burmester and the difference with Krell and and
any audio product in the market is huge for the German's for
a lot of reasons: sound, reliability, build quality, design,
craftsmanship, state of the art equipments. Yet Burmesters
products withstand the test of time. You simply cannot sense
the age of these carefully crafted designs. In fact, this is
one of the classic trademarks of Burmester products. Like
other luxury goods, such as Rolex or Patek Philippe watches,
Chanel or Hermes leather goods, Burmester products share
similar characteristics as these luxury goods are uniquely
different from other products in the industry. Burmester
positions all its products as audio jewelry. Unlike other
home stereo products, Burmester does not fall into the
vicious cycle of yearly or bi-yearly product releases.
Burmester focuses on bringing products to the market with
the best craftsmanship, quality and design, to last a
lifetime rather than focusing on pushing out new products
every year to entice user to upgrade. This also results in
exceptionally high retaining values of their products,
similar to other luxury goods. |
In general, Krell makes far superior amps than Burmester,you just have to through the History and pick your flavor of sound, each model, and model within the models sound different from one to the other, Burmester cannot make such a claim. |
I Know very well the Krell EVO 302 and it is a great amp
especially in driving complex loads. But the Burmester combo
956 Mk2/011 at my ears is better all the ways and especially
It is more refined, transparent and sound very musical. In
such comparison I've no doubt to choice the German gears. |
That does not suprise me in the least bit that the krell is a better amp than Burmester, krell does not get a fair shake like you gave it, really an unfair shake, try that krell EVO 302 with a Krell Phantom pre-amp and it's over! |
Thank you for your thoughts.I have found a 956 mk2 amp, and brought it home, so I had few months to compare both amps. The preamps were 011 and 877 mk2 xlr,both Burmester.I would like that I have had an Arc preamp to test it with Krell, because this way the synergy of components is probably on Burmester side.However, with my speakers , and with music that I listen, 50's and 60's jazz I have come to this conclusion.Imho Krell Evo 302 is much better amp in terms of bringing the actual feeling of presence of the recording, the performers are actualy in the room, you are not seated in the 3rd or 5th row, they are there, and you feel like the stage is right in front of you. That feeling however comes with a price, if the recording is less than good,you will cetainly hear it, and that can be an issue on longer run. Like I said, I had no chance to try Krell with tube preamp, maybe than the things would be different. On the other side, the Burmester is realy refined amp, no fatigue, and maybe better for listening of music that I have mentioned, everything is there, resolving almost to that last partical but never unpleasant. Certainly not bright, warm in comparasion to the Krell. Finally, an amp should be observed in combination with speakers, and I think that now I can say that anyone who has Sf Guarneri should try them once with the Krell, and than after decide whats best for him. For the present moment I have chosen Burmester,but if I had to say which is better amp per se, and without the context of my personal situation, Krell Evo 302 is a clear winner. |
A Burmester amp with the rest of your gear should sound amazing. There is some serious synergy with their equipment, especially if you use balanced interconnects! |
Burmester and Sonus Faber is a match that sound superbly. The
956's is a very refined and musical amp that with preamp 011
composes a great combo.
Regards. |
The speakers are Sonus Faber Guarneri Homage. Krell and Sf are combination often used, but I guess that Burmester would not be a missmatch either. Like I wrote, I am more concern aboutt Krell amp and Burmester pre amp combination. So, again, any information from someone who has heard both amps or compared them would be greatly appreciated |
I think you'll need to factor in the speakers. Depending on what you have, the Krell may be a better match even though you have the Burmester front end. |
