Kii3 loudspeakers


Are there any stand mount loudspeakers that can compare or better these and why? Please list.
seadogs1

I would also look at the Dutch & Dutch 8c. 

Duke

There are lots to compare but none other than the Dutch and Dutch mentioned above that perform the same dsp phase correction and room equalization.  The Barefoot monitors are comparable to see what you like but they are a totally different sound.  The barefoot have a much more powerful sound, deeper bass and more volume capability but the kii have a certain 3d soundstage that is different than anything else in the market, some love what they do.  The kii arent my favorite, but I appreciate them greatly for what they are (ive only heard them a few times)

I forgot to give reasons for suggesting the Dutch & Dutch.

Like the Kii, it is a very thorough design.  In addition to what frostdotcom posted, I really like the waveguide that Dutch & Dutch uses for pattern control. 

As one who has mulled over competing in the compact high-end professional monitor market, the Dutch & Dutch intimidates me.  Usually I can put on my speaker designer hat and fire up my ego and see areas where I think I could make an improvement, but not when I look at the Dutch & Dutch.    

I am also of the opinion that the frequency response "goal posts" are in different locations for home use versus studio use, but that's a different topic.

Duke

theres no reason i see that the kii is a better speaker than a speaker costing alot less. The kii cheats by using dsp to fix room problems.
It uses no berylium or diamond drivers or concrete cabinets. Its just another box with drivers in them like every other speaker. 


ive heard a reasonable number of waveguide speakers that are supposedly superior. i heard the amphions. Absolutely horrible. i heard the new revel 2way. Not impressed. Heard the kef blade 2. quite impressed but not perfect. 


"The kii cheats by using dsp to fix room problems."

Among other things, the Kii uses DSP to generate a cardioid radiation pattern which helps minimize room problems in the first place. I don’t see how this could reasonably be called "cheating". Imo it is a very intelligent approach.

"It uses no berylium or diamond drivers or concrete cabinets."

Sometimes what you can’t see matters more than what you can.

Duke

the kii takes the degradation caused by room acoustics out of the equation making it appear as though its a better speaker. But the same potential for good sound is there in every speaker. The room is not allowing you to hear the beautiful sound that was there all along



"the kii takes the degradation caused by room acoustics out of the equation making it appear as though its a better speaker."

If the room is what degrades the sound of otherwise good speakers, then taking room effects out of the equation may be the smartest thing a designer can do. This would be solving a major problem that REALLY MATTERS. Doing so is of far greater real-world benefit than using exotic components.

Nothing wrong with using exotic components, but they are typically addressing problems that are minor compared to room effects. Marketing departments would have you believe that exotic components are solving major problems, when from a perceptual standpoint the elephant in the room IS the room.

Kii has found a way to tame the elephant.

Duke

(I aspire to compete against Kii in performance, but not in sheer elegance.)

the dsp8000 has been around awhile and is another box full of plastic drivers that sounds pretty good. Dynaudio is another company that uses plastic drivers and a, gasp, soft dome tweeter that sounds really musical. I would like to hear what several different speakers all using different materials sound like after dsp so they all measure the same in a room just so we could hear what the different materials sounded like all else being equal.
Duke, I take it that you have heard the Dutch and Dutch 8c and you like what you hear. Are there any other stand mounts with dip and internal amps that you would care to comment on? 

And to all that added a comment or two THANK YOU!!!!!
"theres no reason i see that the kii is a better speaker than a speaker costing alot less. The kii cheats by using dsp to fix room problems.
It uses no berylium or diamond drivers or concrete cabinets. Its just another box with drivers in them like every other speaker. "

Dude, you are on a roll,  piling up the most consistent number of eye-rolling, head-scratching posts in this forum.

"Duke, I take it that you have heard the Dutch and Dutch 8c and you like what you hear. Are there any other stand mounts with dip and internal amps that you would care to comment on?"

I've not heard the Dutch & Dutch 8c but based on my understanding of speaker design, it does an awful lot of things right.  I believe it to be an extremely intelligent design.

Since it's aimed at the studio market rather than the home audio market, you may be able to find a vendor who would let you try a pair with the understanding that you can return them if you don't like them.  My impression is that prosound dealers are more likely to be open to that sort of thing than home audio dealers generally are. 

Duke

Hey Duke, 

I have a client in Dallas who owns a pair but have yet to hear them.  If you were interested in getting your ears on them let me know and I can try to set up a demo with her.  I've been meaning to get to her place anyways.

Cheers,

Skip
Chiming in here (new to the forums).

I’ve had the 8Cs for about a month now, and continue to be blown away.

They’ve effectively unseated 3 other systems active in my home, and about 25 years of experimenting in this hobby.

Systems mentioned, include a pair of Kef LS50 Wireless, which might be on par with the Dutch in terms of perceived speed and coherence, but offer nowhere near the sense of scale and output, a full range, high sensitivity Oris/AER horn rig, sitting on a double stack of Lyngdorf W210 corner subs (the bass on the Dutch 8Cs simply outclasses the Lyngdorfs in every way, and the Lyngdorfs are quite good), and lastly, full range electrostatics, supported by a quad of 18s. The stats, given their dipole nature, play better depth of field tricks, but that again, are no where near as enjoyable to listen to as the Dutch and Dutch.

The 8Cs seem to defy physics, and provide a performance that outsizes my horn rig, in a package slightly larger than the Kef Ls50.

Game changing in my humble opinion.

If anyone is interested, I added some virtual system pics earlier today.