Yesterday I took delivery of my Magnepan LRS’s. I am powering them with a Rogue Audio Sphinx 2 through Stealth Audio MLT speaker cables. Sources are a Rega RP6 and an Oppo BDP 105. I know that these speakers have a long way to go to break in, but what great soundstaging, decay, depth and lifelike imaging. Can’t wait to see how they are doing in 6 months. This is my 3rd set of Maggies and I am tickled to have their sound back in my home.
I am interested in how the LRSs compare to the Magnepans you used in the past. What were they? Like many I started with MMGs and moved up to 1.7s. My Son uses the MMGs now.
I started with MG 2B’s powered by CJ P-V and MB75 tubed electronics, and a Rega Planar 3 table in 1980. Later. I got 1.6 R’s powered by AR electronics and a Basis table. These LRS are clearer and better imaging than either of my previous Maggies. I have a Goldenear Forcefield sub that I will try to integrate with them to take the burden off the woofer panel and add to the bass punch which, by the way, is pretty durn good already. Thanks for asking.
I received mine a few days ago. I would say at the price point it is the best choice if you are willing to spend the money on amplification. They are pushing my McIntosh Mc452 fairly hard.
I am running mine with a Parasound Halo integrated which is doing nicely. Definition, detail and imaging like I've never heard from a Maggie before. Really enjoying mine.
The frequency response is 50hz, but not sure if that is down 3db or down 6db.
If anyone gets a chance to play a 40hz test tone I’m curious if there is much output. Since there is no port I’m guessing they don’t roll off real fast.
I have MG12's on Sound Anchor stands and the LRS (sitting on shag carpet) still blows it away in definition, detail and imaging. In fact I can not think of any way the LRS is not better. The MG12 sounds tubby in the bass and splashy in the highs in comparison.
Glad you have both! I think Wendell D. did some magic this time, along with Magnepan R&D. There is something going on here that hasn’t happened with Maggies in my audio space before!
It’s now been 3 weeks since delivery, they are breaking in nicely, and I have added back ion my Goldenear Force 4 subwoofer. The LRS’s themselves are head and shoulders better than my old MG II B’s, and my old 1.6.R’s. With the Goldenear gently augmenting the Maggies my frequency analyzer shows I have a competent full range system with a few dips, but I am ecstatic at the reproduction. ‘Twas nice to see the LRS’s on the cover of the new Stereophile, but the fold-out didn’t do her panels justice (kidding). I am back in love with Maggies and their magic. They are an amazing match for my Rogue Sphinx II integrated and Stealth speaker cables.
Got mine mid-June. easy set up. Using the same stuff that ran my 1d's decades ago. apt Holman pre and Carver m400t with old passive m&k sub. can't imagine better sound but each day the surprise me. They are disappearing and the sound is ever more enveloping. Glad I did not buy all the recommended Schiit products. This is perfect.
I thought Magnepan and Stereophile didnt get along. Or I should say I didnt think they trusted Atkinson to give them a fair shake as incapable as he seems to be regarding understanding the limitations of his measurements. Not that they need an endorsement from Stereophile.
How here comes the conundrum-tweeter on the outside or inside? I have had them set up for three weeks with them on the outside. I liked the bass balance and depth on the soundstage. Moved them to the inside and both my wife and I feel like there is some giving up of depth and a tad more brightness (paradoxical). What have been your experiences and preferences???
You may not have noticed, but people on multiple forums are saying it’s at least a 2 month wait. I contacted Magnepan about a month ago asking what kind of wait to expect(told them I’d be looking to buy later in the fall), and was told 5 to 8 weeks. Perhaps some circumstances have delayed this even more. I've decided not to buy because of the low efficiency.
To be fair to Magnepan: when you have a huge demand like this it’s difficult to put an accurate number on a wait time. Parts and materials need to be ordered more frequently, and suppliers may or may not be able to meet the new demand.
I’ve seen some Magnepan customers getting bitter over this, and the truth is it’s just the nature of the beast with a smaller company like Magnepan.
Yes, I understand. The people I have talked to on the phone and via email have been great. They indicated that while production is hopping, they know that it would be an irresponsible long term business decision to expand production/hiring right now. Apparently, they understand the demand is temporary. As a business owner, I get it. So I have no problem waiting. Patience is a virtue. I view it as kind of like looking for a specific product on the used market. It just takes time, but worth it in the end.
I live exactly 6.2 miles from Magnepan , as speaker companies go it is a large company . More audiopiles use them than any other speaker .Their problem is two-fold , if don’t have an amp that puts out at least 400 watts a side @ 4 ohms you will never know what they can do .And they have always been a bit shy on dynamics, esp. with classical music . I have owned 4 pairs and switched to Totem for that reason . People I respect say the LRS has corrected that and I plan on gifting my self a pr for Christmas . God willing .
I suspect the reason they are not hiring is that Twin Cities economy is VERY good and the unemployment rate for those who want a job is zero . Twin cities is only place in USA where you can buy a real Hi-End system made where you live .
Whether tweeters are outside or inside, the tweeters should be further from you than the bass section. I have mine with tweeters on the outside but realistically with toe in it would be close either way. I suspect the brightness is you hearing more tweeter on inside puts them closer to you which is not what Mag recommends.
@gammonit_2000 , Good point. Though I would not rush judgement, as the speakers are breaking in. Though I know some may disagree, I, personally have noticed that speakers really do undergo a degree of change when being run-in when new. I know of another Agon member, Elizabeth, who owns Maggies. I would PM her and get her take on the tweeter issue. Otherwise, contact Magnepan directly. Bob
Just read the Stereophile review. Apparently Herb R. did the testing with tweeters to the inside, and in a small room. I would think the toe in angle would have to be severe in that case to get the tweeters further away from you. Some very odd measurements as well on the frequency response. Too bad too nobody dares to add a couple of subs to the mix, then cries about the missing bass. I think I'd rather hear how they sound with a couple of REL T5s oh wait that's my set up. At least he mentioned a sub or two in passing, while comparing them to literally a half dozen other speakers...
I was told the tweeters on 3.7i should be 6" further away which doesn't require that much of a toe in. I always liked tweeter in on 1.7 and 3.7 just seemed to present a more natural sound and better separation and visualization of instruments for me.
Because of the limited bass output of the LRS, Magnepan has been asked for their opinion on the subject of adding a subwoofer or two to the loudspeaker. In a post today on The Planar Speaker Asylum, Wendell Diller's PSA spokesperson Josh related the following info on that subject:
Wendell (and therefore presumably Magnepan) is of the opinion that a "normal" subwoofer (sealed, ported, or infinite baffle) simply can not be successfully integrated with any planar loudspeaker, even if implemented in a "Swarm". There are technical reasons why this is so, but you can read all about that elsewhere. This is not a new thought; plenty of long-time planar speaker owners have felt that way for decades.
What IS news is that Wendell is recommending one sub design---and one sub design only---for use with any Magneplanar: an OB/Dipole. I've posted about the Rythmik Audio/GR Research OB/Dipole here on Audiogon many times, and it is remarkable. Unfortunately, a pair of them costs far more than does a pair of LRS! And then there is the fact that it is available only as a kit, and you can't hear one before buying, requiring a leap of faith. So does the LRS, right? ;-)
I have never owned Magnepans, but am close to ordering a pair of LRS. Would someone please explain what you are referring to regarding the tweeters being on the inside or outside. Are the tweeters removable from the speakers unlike a conventional box speaker where the tweeter is essentially screwed into the speaker enclosure?
Well I am too naively integrating these new LRS with a couple of REL T5s. I didn't realize they weren't properly working and there is no hope of them ever supplementing the bass properly with the LRS. What am I missing here, I can't listen to the LRS with no subs, and no subs other than some fancy build your own subs will begin to work. I am sniffing some BS here. Help me.
@gammonit_2000: BS? On whose part? Have you bothered going to The Planar Speaker Asylum and reading Wendell’s quote for yourself? If you don’t believe it, you can give Magnepan a call and ask them. I don’t know if you can get Wendell himself on the phone, but it’s worth a try. Josh has no affiliation with any maker of an OB/Dipole sub, and doesn’t own them himself. Duke of "Swarm" renown himself gave the same advice to the owner of a planar who called him for advice regarding subs to use with his speakers. Planar owners have for decades bemoaned the lack of success they have had in getting any sealed/ported/IB sub to blend seamlessly with their speakers. This is NOT a new issue!
When Wendell says only an OB/Diploe sub can be successfully mated with a planar, he’s not saying you can’t use a sealed/ported/IB sub with the LRS, only that the OB/Dipole alone will meet the most stringent definition of "successful". The reason for him saying that (he’s not alone, or the first to say it) is a technical matter, too complicated to be answered here. The info on the subject is available, for anyone willing to put in the time and effort to find it. I mean, I and other long-time planar fans have known about it for years. Finnish company Gradient made an OB/Dipole sub for both Quads, the 57 and 63, which were met with some enthusiasm. You should be able to find reviews of them in TAS, which may include the technical rational for the design's use with planar speakers.
Wendell was asked for his advice on the best sub to use with the LRS, and he gave it. If you don’t like his answer, you are free to ignore it, or even disregard it.
I'm not saying you are wrong, but when you get into defining success as only one approach, it seems a bit limiting. I am new to Magnepan ownership so my definition of seamless may not be the same as yours. As I listen to the LRS with the two REL T5 subwoofers fed off of monoblocks, with the subs directly behind the speakers and close to the wall, it sounds pretty seamless to me. Occasionally there are some odd effects but for the most part the subs are more than additive. My theory at least is the 8" fast subwoofer with downfiring isn't "competing" with the LRS by firing horizontally. Further, a bigger subwoofer in this application will do zero and make for that more difficult integration. I did speak with Eric @ Mag and he pretty much agreed with my assessment as to subwoofer choice in this case. If Wendell wants to limit the subwoofer choice to one, then I guess that's his call.
I received my LRS a few weeks ago and changed my cables (since they were terminated for Vandersteen 2-series speakers). I am very happy with the new Magnepans. I'm using a Mytek Brooklyn DAC+ as the pre-amp and a vintage Classe Audio DR-9 (400W into 4 Ohms) power amp. I spent a fair amount of time asking for opinions on optimal positioning and I refined those recommendations based on my room. Right now, they're about 4 feet from adjacent walls, 7 feet from my listening position, 4 feet (measured from inner edge of the speaker to inner edge) between them and the feet are deployed (my ears are 33 inches above the floor). They're positioned with tweeters on the inside and angled in 2 inches.
With that arrangement, imaging depth is profound and the lateral sound stage is equally impressive. Sound quality is quite good but I expect that to improve as they're far short of a 100 hour break-in phase, as are my new Kimber cables. So, I'm reserving final judgement on that aspect for the moment. At some point, I may add sub-woofers and there's an unsubstantiated rumor that Magenpan may be developing a dipole sub of its own design to complement these. Anyway, I think they're very fine speakers and I have no regrets about the purchase.
"I'm not saying you are wrong". That's good, because it was not I who said it, but rather Wendell Diller, in a press release. Have you bothered to read it? Don't blame the messenger!
Whether I or anyone else agrees or disagrees with what Wendell said is not the point, and should be of no concern to you. But I would think what Wendell---the Marketing Manager of Magnepan---has to say on the subject would be of some interest to the owner of an LRS. I don't own the LRS', and it is to me.
The real best choice of subs for the LRS would be the bass panels of the Magneplanar Tympani loudspeakers. But they are long-out-of-production, huge (each of the two bass panels of the T-IVa is 6' H x 19" W. A pair is over 3' W! And that's just for one channel!), need LOTS of power (one Tympani owner on the Planar Speaker Asylum powers his T-IVa bass panels with 2,000 watts a side), and are rarely available for sale.
AWESOME post! Maggies win again, and always will!!!
To OP thomasj, Wendell Diller is a sales and marketing person. He started at Audio Research in the 1970's with Bill Johnson and moved to Magnepan later.
Jim Winey's son makes the speakers now last I spoke to him years ago when he refreshed my T-1-C's. No big deal, but thought you should know.
@kacomess- I am very interested in your post also being the owner of Vandy 2Cs and am seriously considering the LRSs. Please post more here or PM me. Thank you.
"there's an unsubstantiated rumor that Magenpan may be developing a dipole sub of its own design to complement these" NOW it all ties together. There's always a "catch". Of course this will be the "best sub", right? Wink wink. Right? And, it may be. Maybe dipole bass is the only bass that will really work well with these speakers. We can spend 4k on subwoofers quietly and proudly announce the mains were only 650 bucks. In the meantime, for under a grand for two (one is used) I will continue to enjoy these REL T5 that represent one of the better values in audio.
Elizabeth, thank you for the explanation of how the Maggie's tweeters can be arranged. It is pretty amazing that the LRS speakers can be manufactured and sold at such an attractive price.
jetter’s last post is on point. After reading the Stereophile review, they are terrific speakers for the price as long as your expectations are reasonable. They are sensitive to setup and amplification. But no matter what, the dynamic range is limited and no amp or setup will change the inherent limitations of the LRS. But for $650.00 it’s practically a moot point.
The Rythmik/ GR Research OB/Dipole Sub kit retails for about $1500/pr (that buys you four 12" servo-feedback woofers and two plate amps containing the OB-mandated dipole-cancellation compensation filter circuit), the flatpack H-frames the kits are installed in $500/pr. $2000 for the best sub in existence for planar loudspeakers seems reasonable to me. A $2000 pair of subs wouldn't be appropriate for the $650/pr LRS, but an OB/Dipole sub can be built for less than the price of the Rythmik/GR Research offering. True, that does require a sense of adventure and certain level of ambition ;-) .
thomasj, "Moved them to the inside and both my wife and I feel like there is some giving up of depth and a tad more brightness (paradoxical)." Also, you find that the LRS are superior to your previous Maggies. Many years ago, I had the Maggie Tympani 1D which was 6' tall and 36-48" wide each side, depending on the angling of the 3 panels. I ultimately came to hate the large, bloated imaging. Later, I liked the MG 3 series better because of the smaller, more focused sound. When I then heard the original MG 20, I hated the larger sound field and actually found the HF subdued compared to the MG 3, possibly because of more bass dominance from the larger MG 20 panel. Although I have not yet heard the new LRS, I believe that smaller is better if you value clarity and are willing to sacrifice low bass and dynamics. I don't like the marketing pitch which says that once you hear the LRS, you will have a taste of the supposedly superior performance of the larger 20.7 and the huge 30.7, which looks like the original Tympani 1D. The LRS still presents a medium size image predicted by its size, which is a good compromise for most any scale of music. Regarding the tweeter on the inside, that creates a narrower image but more focused sound because imaging is more dependent on HF.
viber6,How interesting when my largely unproven theories are "proven" at least from the perspective of your experiences. The LRS makes "perfect" sense from the size aspect. The appetizer theory is a nice try by Wendell but given the huge jump in prices, it's like a hot dog vs. buying an expensive meal for a party of 100. Or something like that. Now, the ribbon tweeter of the 3.7i would be of some consideration, but here again we are at 10x the LRS. As to what I would think makes sense for Magnepan, is to provide a bi-amped monoblock system for the LRS with powered OEM subwoofers made by REL or of their own dipole design. They need to get into this century with their connections and fuses and jumpers or whatever is going on in the back, frankly it's a bit odd. I mean what the heck. Provide the amps, the cables, the subwoofers, all set up to make those LRS sing, all for under 5k total. That's my marketing plan for Magnepan...
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