Is there a point of diminished returns with amps and Harbeth 30.1s?


I’m currently using Herron M1As with my 30.1s and I’ve upgraded the rest of my system (Aries/Fatboy/SUT/DL103r and Lamm pre and phono) and each upgrade has been VERY satisfying. So is it going to be worth spending $5000 or so on the used market to upgrade the Herrons? Any thoughts as to whether I’ve reached the apex of amp/speaker performace for the M30.1s?
dhcod

Showing 7 responses by jjss49

agree with @twoleftears

to me the mon 30’s have a particular sound and tonal palette, those who love it will generally not prefer more tonally balanced and extended-range speakers that don't accentuate and emphasize the midband as much

good solid state amplification with some tubes earlier in the chain is the best way to get them to sound great
There is always a point of diminishing return on spending more for pretty much anything. For those speakers.you probably hit it for most once you get past $5k for an amp I would estimate.


i would agree with @mapman on his comment above, in particular for normal sized listening rooms
agree 100% w @chayro

can’t pay attention to alan shaw and his blanket ’truisms’ on amps cabling stands etc for his harbeth speakers, as good speakers as they are...

he just wants you to spend as much as you can on the speakers, don’t pay much attention and just make do with the rest...

cabling and amps, stands too, to a somewhat lesser extent, matter...
first i will say harbeths are excellent speakers, even great speakers

that said, the man behind the company is a first rate capitalist (no shame in that), uses many modern tools of marketing to maximize economics of his venture... including setting up a ’user group’ that effectively sings praises of his products (and quashes negative comments by and large, as well as useful discussions of ancillary gear)... he personally ’moderates’ the group, and posts actively as a participant, so it is heavy hand employed there

as for the ’offer’ of a blind a/b test, it would have been one that he controls, so grains of salt taken there

finally, a few years back, i have personally (with help from my son and a good hifi bud) done a blind a-b-c test, which took some doing, with my son doing the switching and db level match, using two sacd tracks - comparing an audio research vt-50 tube amp, audio research 100.2 solid state unit, and a w4s class d st-500, running into harbeth shl5+’s ... we could pick out which amp 6 out of 6... treble detail and imaging was different, bass tightness was different, midrange articulation was different...

bottom line, excellent speakers, pedantic and self serving owner, the user group is kool aid drinkers only (dealers, inexperienced or lazy fanboys), other discriminating, experienced, intellectually honest/curious folks usually find the b-s factor too high to stomach

I agree that this is potentially problematic, but to be fair, such tests are not about preferences, but differences. In other words, can the listener simply and consistently distinguish between components, irrespective of which they may prefer.


@whipsaw is exactly correct

a-b tests, done correctly, first establishes that a difference can be reliably and consistently be heard, then comes an assessment of the nature of differences, and then, perhaps, a judgement about preference might be made ... one step at a time

a-b tests don’t replace longer term listening in fully assessing gear and their sonic attributes -- but is an important tool in the tool kit, so to speak

there are some who profess that all amps, all cables, all connections, sound the same... thus a proper a-b test is needed to dispel (or confirm) these notions
As far as I know there has not been a single example of a blind listening test where differences between cables, digital sources or even amplifiers were identified.


@cd318
can evidently type... but he can’t read... amazing how that can be... usually even rudimentary literacy works in both input and output modes

i just cited in a my earlier post that i did a rigorous a-b-c test of power amps on super 5’s, and for myself, dispelled this kool-aid/nonsense

seriously...🙈🙉🙊
@whipsaw

i think we are better off not wasting our breath

published studies, measurements, ’verification’

sheesh... missing the point of what this pursuit is about it seems

enjoy the tunes, and onwards...