Is Paypal safe?

I can't access to the Paypal site all day today, and some one have just deposited some money into my Paypal account yesterday. Is it safe to use these type of services? and will there be any protection for the members if the services close down some day?
I had my CC # hacked thru PayPal.

There were about six subscriptions to porn sites put on my card by someone in, I believe, NY.

I dodn't think PayPal is safe.
I've has no problems. But it is getting more expensive. eBay has the Billpoint system, which is the same. eBay is big enough now to stand behind stuff like this.
As far as not being ripped off, it is the same as sending a certified check by Fedex. Once the funds are sent, there is no guarantee that you will receive merchandise. Also, I am fairly certain, that there is no credit card protection, as many mistakingly believe. So, is it safer? No. Probably, riskier, as your credit card and bank account numbers are out there, although the sight is secure. That said, I have used it, without any problems.
Yes, Paypal IS safe. It's just slower in many cases / not all. The fees instituted on 1/16/01 and loss of most of the fraud protection, now make it cumbersome at best. Yes, if both parties have funds in their account already,it goes fast.Beyond that,an overnight MO will be faster and offer the same am't of protection.(minimal)
I've been using PayPal probably a couple hundred times or more since near the time of it's inception, so I'm speaking from alot of experience.

Your credit card and money are as safe as it can get sending it by internet, and if your card number ever was stolen, PayPal guarantees you and covers any unauthorized charges. The only problems I've every really had were during times of expansion, where the server load could not keep up, or during maintainence on the site, which made it temporarily inaccessable.

It is also much safer than sending money orders overnight, for instance. If the account holder you are sending money to is VARIFIED, you are GUARANTEED to receive your goods...not nessasarily in the condition expected, but you are guaranteed to receive the item(s) described. Be especially cautious sending money through it to unvarified accounts--there's little reason for them not to have varified it, unless they just began with it.

It is a VERY fast and convient way to send payment, if both parties are already signed can send money in about a minute. Signing up can take about 5-10 minutes, and there's a $250 limit on new accounts, until your account is varified as real with your bank.

Jeff Delman
Value Audio
Forget PAYPAL- Avoid the hassle- Use USPS money orders and wait it out. Saving time w/PAYPAL etc. isn't worth the potential hassles
Paypal was part of the single worst experience I had purchasing an item via the internet. It was on EBay.

I've never had a bad experience on Audiogon. Using Audiogon which I think is a superb site as well as its ancillary services, I've purchased equipment all over the USA and Canada.

Once the party who had the goods I won as higest bidder was paid through Paypal, I never received the merchandise. Complaint after complaint was filed. At one point Paypal wanted all of my e-mails with this person. They asked me to send them as attachments. I attached numerous files for their records and was then informed that they could not open attachments. On and on it went, until Paypal kicked me out for being a bad customer. Me?! I was the victim. One of the things that made them mad was that I cancelled the credit card to this person after nearly two months of first excuses and then silence. A silence that continues to this day some 8 months later. Paypal is so screwed up that recently I received a message from them that they were going to work on getting my money back. This after they informed me several months ago they could not, kicked me out and after I subsequently got my money back through my credit card company. Bottom line, there is no reason on this earth that I will ever use Paypal again and under no circumstances can I fairly suggest you do.
I just wouldn't leave my $ in there too long. Have them transfer it to your bank account. It takes 3-4 days.
After reading somewhere around 100 posts about Paypal over the past 6 months, my impression of their service is certainly not very favorable. I understand that the majority of people that use their service do so without a hitch and tend to be pleased with them. However, there do appear to be enough folks out there with bad experiences that I'm a little wary of using the service myself. Issues such as double payment if you hit the submit button twice, unsatisfactory resolution of bad transactions, and failure to respond to customer complaints in a timely manner are among the most common complaints I've read. Its enough to make me feel a bit edgy about executing a large transaction through them. That said, does anyone have experience with other escrow services that offer a different level of service? Is Paypal pretty much the best there is for managing Internet transactions? Information about alternatives would be extremely useful. Thanks, Ken
If you manage the transactions responsibly, as we should, PayPal is merely a very convienent way to pay quickly. As in any deals, make sure that you know who you are dealing with and hope for the best and PayPal should be fine. There are no guarantees and we take a chance every time we send $ out there, no matter how we send it.
Hi Puubie,

Our system has not been hacked. There are some general precautions that users can use to prevent account access.

1. Do not use the same password that you use on another site.
2. Do not click on any links in emails that direct you to a site other than The web url would read We have no variations on this (save when you login it goes to an https:).
3. Do not share your password with anyone.

There are some additional guidelines, but those are the important ones. I am interested in you sending me your information to so that I can have this looked at.

Kjg- I have completed several transactions thru paypal with no serious problems; however their customer service does leave a lot to be desired. I have used iescrow once and found it to be quick and easy. It certainly provides better protection than paypal. In my case, seller requested it and offered to pay fee. Seems to me that this is an item that could be negotiated and is probably the most equitable way of protecting both parties. Anyone out there have any problems with iescrow or other escrow services?
I don't know why it takes four days or more for Pay Pal's Customer Service to answer a question. I am currently having this experience with them and stayed tuned for how long before they reply to my email. I would say that apart from any problems or frustrations with their service, which there are some that I have, their customer service is so poor as to cause me to consider going elsewhere.

Sorry to hear of your delay in getting a response. Customer service currently has a backlog on emails, but we are bringing additional staffing on to assist. Feel free to send me your question/problem to
I am sorry Mr. Paypaldamon, but if it takes 5 days (current tally and still counting) for Paypal to respond to Customer Service questions, you might as well just close up shop today because you are not going to be in business long. I know I am not the only one to have such an experience since the person I was trying to send money to had the same. After 4 days, the response he received was not even relevant to the question. In my case, I tried to send him a payment for an Audiogon auction. After 5 days, in which the payment stayed in a status of "uncleared", I finally gave up and canceled the transaction. It took about 24 hours for the money to be remitted to my Paypal account. Why did it take 24 hours to for me to receive control of my money after canceling the transaction and why would a transaction not be completed for 5 days on an account which has been used to complete several transactions prior? Finally, how would I get a reasonably prompt response to these questions from Paypal (other than directing my questions to Damon on the Audiogon site) such that this response would be received and acted upon before either one party or the other to the transaction simply gives up and sends/demands a money order to complete the transaction?

I have had a theft from my checking account through a fraud on my Paypal account which I notified Paypal of immediately and they ignored it for three days. Rather than stop the check they drew, I notified them of an unauthorized payment from my account, which I received no notification of, and only learned about as a result of logging onto my credit card account. The way a verified Paypal account works is that upon authorization of a payment, Paypal makes a temporary hold on the payor's credit card which is on account. They then draft a payment to themselves in the same amount and upon clearance of the check to them, they release the hold on the credit card.

I noticed a hold was on my credit card, then investigated the payment and found I had not made it. I contacted the recipient who acknowledged it was not due them. They had opened the account the prior day. The recipient professed to attempting to return the funds, but claimed that Paypal couldn't do that and I immeidately notified Paypal of the theft. To date, I have been jerked around for nearly three weeks without any human response. As a result of this post, I have corresponded with the Customer Service Manager of Paypal, Damon Billian.

Prior to this problem, I have touted Paypal as the best means for payment by a lazy man. No travel, no wires, no expenses, no time. Now also, no $910!!!

Bill Eichengrun
May I make a suggestion? If anyone has questions or needs help regarding PayPal, that they take it offline by email or phone with the rep from PayPal. You can just click on the name and begin an email discussion offline. Just a suggestion.
With regard to my complaint, I purposely did not want to take it offline. Sorry, if my personal troubles bother you, but I thought some of you would want to know. The part which I found outrageous is that they don't answer the requests for customer service on their own site. Mine, entered last Sunday, still hasn't been answered. Yet, the Paypal Customer Service Manager, if that is who Damon is, feels that it is effective to make himself personally available on the Audiogon site to handle/answer customer service problems/requests on the Audiogon site. It is the height of ludicrousness in my opinion.
Hi Angela,

When I posted to this thread, I believe the question was, "Is Paypal safe"? Would you clarify for me what you believe I was writing about other than the question? My concern is for others to be aware of the pitfalls that can occur to an otherwise excellent process when customer service and concern are cut to the bone apparently in the search for profitability.

Thanks in advance,

Bill Eichengrun
Hey, I wasn't implying anybody or anything.
General discussions about issues people are having is one thing, but going through a 1:1 discussion with a PayPal rep is another. I just thought that any personal detail about situations could be worked out; outside of these public forums.

We have had problems with PayPal as well, but worked out details directly with them.
We did express our concerns here publically, but then took it offline with Damon once he responded to the post. Damon was actually able to help and we got fast resolution after months of trouble. I believe that Damon is here because he was asked to take a look at some problems that people are having. At least he is trying to understand and help and I don't see how publically badgering someone helps. I have always found that working with someone to solve a problem is more effective. That's all I am trying to say.
I felt that the original intent of the thread began to side track into one of those *sick the dogs* threads and I was just trying to get it back on track. No harm intended.
Sorry Angela,

But I am not here to sic the dogs on anyone. In order to make my posts regarding the lack of timeliness of the customer service responses of Paypal more relevant to the title of the thread, I offer that if one did have a serious problem like Bill Eichengrun did, would it make you feel even more content that it might take 5 days or more to reach someone in customer service? As far as Damon's presence on Audiogon providing a circumvention around the morass which appears to be the present state of Paypal's customer service, what about those Paypal customers who have problems and don't know about Audiogon? Damon should be working full-time to fix the Paypal customer service problem, not hanging out on Audiogon fishing for Paypal problems here. That seems obvious to me. I don't have that type of attack dog personality and none of my remarks are meant to attack you in any way. If I seem a little upset, it is because their lack of responsiveness, above all, has pushed my buttons.
I agree. I believe that customer service, or rather, the LACK thereof, will be the downfall of PayPal.
We, personally, have not had any pleasant experiences dealing with the customer service reps; getting passed from one to another (HOPS) or never having any answers (you’ll have to call back – WHAT?!?) - all being incredibly indifferent.

I sincerely hope that Damon is taking this feedback here as seriously as it really is and hope that they hare appropriate measures in place to improve their service. Things like # HOPS a call takes until resolved, # days calls are open unresolved, % of calls that are resolved to the CUSTOMER’s SATISFACTION. With corrective action plans to get this fixed and keep it in control.
If not, then I believe that they will go the way of so many dot-coms – great idea, but no concept of how to run a business successfully.

If Providian has really entered the arena with PayPal, then they have an even longer road to travel, since Providian has a long history of customer fraud and deception.
I totally agree that these kinds of issues should be raised here.
I took a peek at iescrow's web site (I believe its called Tradenable now) and they appear to offer quite a bit of protection, but charge significantly more than PayPal. It'll be interesting to see if more business might bring down the price a bit.

Also, it appears that PayPal is getting a big boost in the arm from the investment community. Hopefully, this will help them fix up whatever problems they're having and become a first class outfit.


cheers, Ken
Haven't had any problems so far. Every now and then their site is hard to access... maybe high traffic?
Hi Rayhall,

Thanks for your comments.

Customer Service is tackling many of these issues and our recent funding is going to allow us to make additional investments in the Customer Service Operations arena. Some software changes are happening and additional staffing is coming aboard.

As it relates to your transaction---

If the transaction was placed on a credit card, the credit is placed after you cancel it. However, the credit appearing on your credit card account can take several days to post because of the clearing time.

Sorry for my delay in responding to this, but I generally hit around twenty different areas looking for specific concerns and I do not work weekends. I usually visit audiogon every couple of days because it is not as trafficked as the other sites I go to.