is it possible to make digital audio sound like vintage vinyl
My ad hoc tests with audiophiles says otherwise, however, you start from 2 false premises. 1) that a turntable has not already thrown away information. It has thrown away a ton of information. 2) That given a turntable has already thrown away a ton of information and the ear/brain has some limits i.e. bandwidth, can a digitized system collect all the usable information on a vinyl system such that the output is indistinguishable from the input. You haven't presented an argument that that is not true. Indistinguishably? No |
I think that you feel this way validates the importance of this thread. Can you recreate this in digital, at least for those that prefer this presentation. but it's easy to find a digital file and vinyl pressing from the same tape master, and when you do, the vinyl will sound better than the digital file almost 100% of the time. |
One problem is see in your comparison Mike, is you have chosen a DAC that euphonically matches what you prefer in vinyl. For you, that is the best sound possible, but to make the most accurate comparison of digitized and played back vinyl, a DAC that is as analytical as possible would be the most faithful. Your DAC may be implementing "tricks" that create a very pleasing audio result, especially for those that prefer vinyl. However if you record vinyl and play is back on that DAC, the result is likely not as technically accurate as possible. |
I am still going to go with "far exceeds". Note I used hi-res digital as my comparison point:
That RIAA equalization is of course akin to "compression", akin to basic Dolby noise reduction. As has been pointed out, digital copies of vinyl can be nearly indistinguishable if not indistinguishable from the direct vinyl output. I don't think anyone would say vinyl sounds like digital though, not even if the mastering is exactly the same. The big variable is crosstalk, and even that varies considerably from system to system and out of phase crosstalk can do some interesting things acoustically. I personally don't think the OP is on the right track for recreating vinyl from digital. My main impression of the applied filter the op uses is reverb, which will give a more 3 dimensional feel to the music, a not uncommon mixing and mastering technique. However, I don't think the exercise of recreating vinyl from digital is unwarranted. One can consider something like crosstalk a format limitation, but one could also consider it a mathematical function that may be beneficial. |
I respect his personal opinion, but as pointed out, we don't know if the MSB DAC is programmed to be technically accurate or true to the signal. I remember some tests of a very high end MSB that showed significant IM distortion, not something one would expect with the figures they were presenting. I am not knocking its sonics, just pointing out incongruence. If it is tuned sonically, not for technical accuracy, then it will color, however minimally, whatever goes through it. I would give credence to Mike Lavigne’s listening experience. Having only digital, I liked that he once said his new digital setup is "staring vinyl in the face". He may find digital to be really good, but when he goes on to say that, after a high level of commitment in his system to both formats, vinyl still cannot be equaled, his findings deserve respect. |
Keep at it! If nothing else, it is a lot of fun, and if you come up with a formula that improves your listening enjoyment, then you have accomplished something and perhaps others will enjoy it as well. guitarsam OP29 posts05-19-2020 6:52pmsam here when i made this post i was referring to a very specific sound that vinyl creates and i don’t care what kind of turntable setup you have there is an indefinable sound and that’s what i was trying to create. no i don’t think i’m there yet however i will keep trying and posting my before/after results to get feedback from the experts. i suppose if i was less nieve i would just accept the facts and move on however i can’t help but believe i will one day hit on the magic combination friends. |
rbstehno, but this is not a thread of which is better, it is a thread about achieving a vinyl "like" sound which the op has a personal preference for, and which many have a personal preference for. There may even be some poorly understood underlying technical issues why vinyl (likely the channel separation issue) is more pleasing to some. |
Instruments sound, in my honest opinion, much more "real" on a well recorded digital. You may not like it, but it is more "real". tony195417 posts05-22-2020 10:24amIt seems to me that the goal isn't to make digital sound like vinyl.The goal is to make digital sound like real instruments and human voices. |
