Integrated versions separate subwoofer

Is there any kind of consensus on whether speakers with integrated subwoofers sound as good as/better/worse than a separate subwoofer?
My GENERAL opinion is that an integrated unit may be better if you have the space. Couple reasons:

- Physical placement is within the same "space" as the speaker, and there are 2 of them

- They are DESIGNED to be integrated well into the speaker

Again, a general statement, not perhaps universal. Integrated woofers may lack in deepest bass and air movement, something outboard sob's are especially made for.

Quantity or quality (or very high price)...

Go to a store and compare the B&W N805 with a sub to the N803 or 2.
Chams_uk I see. So a really crazy audiophile move would be to have a crossover for anything under 55hz and run that to a dedicated subwoofer, and also have integrated subs in the speaker.
No .. there's no concensus.
If your listening room is small a separate subwoofer can give more flexibility in placing the main speakers for imaging and the sub for optimum bass loading.
Either way good deep bass is quite expensive. If you get a separate sub then these cost $1000 up. If you want deep bass from the main speakers you'll need a much more powerful amplifier and physically large speakers.
Some responses to all:

- Pyite: this would be a crazy and perhaps fun move, but perhaps not audiophile. If you have an integrated subwoofer in a system, it'll probably reach well into the 40's, maybe 30's or even lower. Most MUSIC (unlkess you do pipe organ or synthesized bass a la Enya) won't go that low that much, so a truly dedicated sub may not be necessary, except for those listening with heavy bass. All that said, I use my VMPS 626R's full range, and cross over at around 40Hz to a Sunfire sub. Just for thast "foundation" :-)

- Sean: you are correct regarding space and subs, that's why I had my caveat about "if you have the space." Also, it may be some confusion over what is a "integrated subwoofer." A TRUE integrated sub (OK, at least to me) is one that is self powered, so the power demands of the REST of the speaker isn't that high. There are plenty of speakers with side-mounted or separate-enclosure mounted big woofers. THESE would definitely require that power of which you write; the self-powered internal subs wouldn't....

So I do stand by my general statement, with the clarifications added above, and the additional thoughts from Pyite and Sean.

But as always, it's only opinions...and everyone has 'em.
Pyite .. if you have truly full range speakers then I think you're wasting your money buying a separate sub and crossover.
By full range I mean speakers that are flat to below 25Hz ... there's not many of them, and I would think they would have to be 3 way designs of the "speaker plus integrated sub" variety.