Install A Dedicated AC Line at home

A licensed electrician?

with experience on Install A Dedicated AC Line to home

What does experience garner on top of being licensed?

You might consider first asking friends if they know of any electricians that have done good work for them in the past. If you've never tapped into nextdoor.com, you might also consider posting on that website and asking for suggestions on reputable local electricians in the area. You definitely want to hire a certified, insured and bonded (if possible) electrician to perform this work. 

If you are going to go to the trouble of running dedicated 120V lines & audiograde outlets to your listening room, may I suggest this:

You may elect to make it a DIY project, but you

a) might require a local jurisdiction electrical permit, and

b) most likely  require an electrical inspection to meet local building codes  regardless.

That is why hiring a licensed electrician is the preferred pathway here.

without an inspection to satisfy local building code terms for a DIY  job, or alternatively hiring a licensed electrician , you are at high risk of violating your home insurance policy and leave yourself at high risk of your insurer refusing coverage in case of an event . 

I recommend you read response #1.

This is the best upgrade I’ve made. Not a subtle upgrade by any means especially if you have a power hungry SS amp. I did not know the capability of my Coda #16 amp until I did this. I wished I had done it sooner.

OP,  you might reach out to the local audio club and ask them who has done work for them. They'll cut down the time you'll take random looking for an electrician who knows audio well.

https://sanfranciscoaudiophilesociety.com/

I grew up in a construction family.  It boggles my mind how many people think it is as simple as hiring a guy with a license.  

There are many people here on this site that are well educated and have zero understanding of electricity.  

A high school education isn't required to be an electrician.  Formal training for an electrician is very limited.  Electricians generally learn as an apprentice and it mostly involves figuring out where to put what colored wire.  No understanding of the physics behind it.

So if you think anybody with a union card understands the nuances of providing power to a high end electrical system I wish you luck.

you need to get someone who understands what you are trying to achieve to design the circuit and then hand the plan to the electrician. Then provide oversight to make sure he does what is on the drawing.

Jerry

Great tip Jerry.

I hired my regular local licensed electrician. I showed him the JPS outlets and cable and he smirked but did the work anyway. At the end, he told me that the JPS cable was the easiest cable he has ever worked with and asked me what it cost. When I told him, he walked away laughing.

No problems with those lines now going on 25 years.

Most sparky's will just want to argue with you and tell you why you don't need to do this and if you insist they'll say your crazy and anyone that says you need to this is just plain nuts! I would Study enough electrical handbooks and diy. It isn't rocket science and can be most enjoyable. You'll want to run two or more home runs to your room. 

This is a @jea48 , question.

Bob

I installed my own dedicated line and I defy you to tell me which line I did and which was the original wiring. It’s really just a mechanical process as long as you turn off the main breaker. One suggestion is to pull your own wire if you can and then have the electrician wire it into the panel. Pulling wire is pure grunt work. Use existing holes in your floor joists if you can and if that’s how your home is constructed. 

Berkeley local here, 

  Give Din at Electrical Installations a call. He’s a electrical contractor  in Oakland, licensed, and bonded. Worked with him a bunch, he knows his stuff. Just tell him you want a dedicated circuit, he’ll do the rest. 

Find someone who can do it for cash on the side. You live in CA. If you go by the book you will need to pull permit, have three inspections, and an environment impact study done before any work. You will be in at 5K before they touch any wire. Might want to have the file for permit claiming it is a plug in station for your electric car then the state and city will pay for it snd also give you a tax break. I don’t and never ever will buy an electric car but put in charger as it was free and a 6K tax credit! Nothing better than beating libs at their own game!

I have had two installed in my house (20 years apart). You just want to find a licensed electrician… not that you can’t do it yourself. Expect them to look at you like you are crazy. Just tell them to do it. You will be very happy. You want two, one for your main components and a separate for your amp. Go for 10 gauge Romex unless you want to get really fancy with special wire. Use hospital grade duplex receptacle unless you buy audiophile ones.

But running 2 10 Gauge Romex direct lines will significantly improve the performance of your system. Well worth it.

@sgreg1 >>>You live in CA. If you go by the book you will need to pull permit, have three inspections, and an environment impact study done before any work. You will be in at 5K before they touch any wire.<<<

An excellent point indeed. I've heard all about it on Real Time with Bill Maher (how he tried to install solar power, and all of the hoops he had to jump through).

We haven't heard from Zee (zensview) in a while, so we really don't know how capable he (assuming here) is of doing this work himself.  

Carlsbad, obviously you don't know anything about electricity and being an electrician, all you have to do is run a wire from your panel connected to a separate circuit breaker and then to your outlet it's not rocket science it's pretty simple actually you don't need an electrical engineer planning it out for you. LOL

Carlsbad, obviously you don't know anything about electricity and being an electrician, all you have to do is run a wire from your panel connected to a separate circuit breaker and then to your outlet it's not rocket science it's pretty simple actually you don't need an electrical engineer planning it out for you. LOL

I lucked out on my current room--the company was both residential and commercial and I tapped the commercial guys when I explained I wanted to install a 10kVA iso transformer as part of the package. These guys were used to doing all kinds of stuff, from auditoria and sports arenas to other big commercial projects. Their work was impeccable. Unfortunately the commercial group splintered off shortly after my work was done (no, I was not the cause) but I found another top tier electrician who did work on our kitchen reno and when I mapped what I wanted to do with a bypass for a Generac, he totally got it-- sort of the Fremer problem (though nobody else I know with a system and Generac has had problems). 

Anyway, it is luck of the draw. I've had some terrible vendors over the years as well. My absolute favorite guy was not a licensed electrician- so I could not have him do any electrical work but he was an airframe mechanic for cargo jets. Man, that guy was so overqualified. He was ostensibly a plumber, but maintained this elaborate boiler system we had in our last house back east. 

If you get somebody good, your life will be improved immeasurably. :)

Or, at least you won't be tearing your hair out. 

I use a awg10  lowest resistance , my Electrician,Audiophile installed a 4 wire 

2 grounds ,one common ground ,the other a insulated isolated ground on a separate Copper buzz Bar, amd a 2 inch  4 ft long ground 

contacts bought commercial 30 amp breaker heavy silver plated copper breaker.

these streamers I tried this ground setups totally eliminated the need ,A little green computer , and uptone audio ether regen is excellent ,the only better 

then the Uptone audio Ethernet hub ,is the synergistic research but is expensive around $2k.   Streaming sounds so much better and buy the Motorola modem router combo it’s $270 on Amazon but excellent.

Would seem you need an electrician and a game plan. A simple question is can I get Dedicated 10 or 12 gauge wires from my fuse panel to my listening room. at this point it does not matter what you’re doing with it, you just want dedicated line information and possibilities. How many outlets you need depends on your equipment now or in the future. You do not have to listen to what crap others have and or why. No one online knows the electrical layout in your house, suggestions on what to buy… speculation, confusing, and a waste of time.

Cheers

Hi Zee,

Was a residential electrician/contractor several decades ago.  Also in Berkeley.  Here is what I would do if I were doing it for myself:

Run 12/3 (#12/3  conductors) metal clad cable (MCC) from the first electrical panel in the house.  That 3rd conductor allows you to create what is called a 3-wire circuit.  The 2 hot wires share the neutral and allow the loads to cancel each other out.  So if say you have 8 amps on one conductor and 5 on the other the neutral will only have a 3 amp load.  This reduces voltage drop as it shortens the return path for 5 amps of the load.  You have to pay a bit extra for the extra conductor and another circuit breaker but I think it's worth it, especially if you have or ever plan on betting monoblocks, you can put one on each circuit.    The MCC provides a metal sheathing around the conductors that is grounded which will prevent any EMI or EMF from radiating from the 120V conductors.  Not really sure that this is of any real concern but it gives some peace of mind.  I would also install the outlet in a metal box as opposed to plastic for the same reason.   Also a metal receptacle plate.  And finally I would probably use 15amp circuit breakers as long as the load would permit as this provides a bit of safety for your equipment in the event of a short.  I have used Grant Fivis at 650-291-2821 for my most recent electrical work.

 

You might also consider running another 12/2 cable for any future or present equipment that might be 240V.  It would be cheaper to do it all at one time rather than for it to be 2 separate jobs.

Following the recommendations of many a HiFi Guru, I’ve hired an licensed electrician to run 30 amp circuits with 10 gauge wire for my stereo gear. I told him I’d supply the PS Audio PowerPort Classic Outlets (I believe these are similar to the JPS Labs outlets shown above.)

Here’s my question — the electrician tells me that he connects a “tail” of 12 gauge wire to the heavier 10 gauge wire on the outlet end, making it easier to connect to the outlet. 

To my mind (a complete electrical newbie), this sounds like it defeats the purpose of installing the 10 gauge wire — to bring more robust electrical power from the circuit to the outlet to the stereo equipment. 

Can those of you who have more experience in this area share your wisdom so I don’t end up with a botched installation?

Thanks much.

Michael 

@sgreg1 

Is that free install and tax credit only for California ? I don’t drive an electric either but could use the free money! 

@mikempls - If I read the conversion chart correctly 10 gauge is equivalent to 2.5sq twin and earth european cable. That being the case, the electrician is just being lazy in wanting to mix in a smaller gauge cable because 10 gauge is not especially hard to work with  - it's the standard for regular power circuits here - and moreover, he's introducing a totally unnecessary break in the cable - which is definitely bad practice.

Don’t forget if you don’t get a permit or use a licensed electrician and you have a fire in your home you can forget your insurance company giving you a dime. They will use any excuse to not pay a claim.

I have mulled this idea over for myself. But also you must look at the lines you intend to run in the NEW circuit. I find it ironic that peoplw wil spend thousands of dollars on 1 meter of power cable and ignore the standard 12 or 14 gage of ordinary coper or even worse coper clad aluminum unshielded lines in wall in some cases for 100s of feet. Then what about the breaker? Another thing to look at is the quality of and length of the ground to the breaker box. I was looking at a new line my mother had a LICENSED Electrician put in her 100 year old house. When searching out the ground lead, INSTEAD of running a 5 foot coper line to a standard 8 or 10 Ft. ground rod directly next to the breaker box, he ran over 50 ft, directly to the GAS line coming into the house.

The electrical inspectors in my area don't even need to be licensed electricians, they go to courses that they don't even need to fully attend, most of them go golfing instead. I had a friend that worked there and had a heating and cooling licence, he was the only one with that type of license and they didn't even have him doing the heating and cooling inspections.

@ronboco 

no nation wide as part of mush brains “inflation reduction” money laundering plan.

@mikempls Hmmm, this is just me, but I personally have a little bit of a problem with installing 30 amp circuits for audio equipment protection. Even though almost all audio equipment has its own internal fuse or circuit breaker, from gut instinct, it still just doesn't sit well with me (especially when feeding a 15 or 20 amp receptacle). To me, the 30 amp breaker allows just a bit too much headroom for protection, if a piece of equipment blows up. I get what you're trying to accomplish (providing low resistance current availability wiring), but I don't see how it even passes code to begin with. 

Here's what I have done for my power amplifier branch circuit, and even *this* wouldn't pass NEC code, but I still feel it keeps equipment protection a bit more in check (even though, again, almost every piece of audio equipment has its own internal circuit breaker or fuse). 1) 15 or 20 amp breaker in load center (circuit breaker box). 2) #10 AWG wire to outlet box 3) depending on what size breaker (15 or 20 amp) was used, provide the same rated outlet receptacle 4) since it's not very easy attaching #10 wires to an outlet, those wires get capped in the outlet box (using AlumiConn lugs - make sure to torque them correctly), and transferred to 6" #12 pigtails, to then attach to the outlet.

I personally don't have a problem with short distance smaller gauge pigtails. It's the 30 amp breaker I have a bit of a problem with, and the lower current rated outlets attached to it. 

AlumiConn's are my most favorite wire cap - in all situations. They are a bit pricey, and may have to be special ordered, but I feel are worth every cent. When installing the AlumiConn's, if you don't already own one, you must also purchase a reputable torque driver (this is a must).  

AlumiConn Lugs 

@steeveb  >>>The 2 hot wires share the neutral and allow the loads to cancel each other out.<<< I completely forgot about this. Thanks for the reminder.

Would seem you need an electrician and a game plan. A simple question is can I get Dedicated 10 or 12 gauge wires from my fuse panel to my listening room. at this point it does not matter what you’re doing with it, you just want dedicated line information and possibilities. How many outlets you need depends on your equipment now or in the future.

Agree...

Anything is possible... It all comes down to time and money. The electrician’s time and the OP’s money.

Not all electricians are created equal. I imagine that’s why the OP posted this thread. The OP is looking for recommendations for a good Electrical Contractor/Electrician in his area to do the job. A residential house wireman that only wires new homes for a living would not be a good choice, imo. The OP wants an electrician that has umpteen hours of experience installing branch circuit wiring in a finished house that is furnished and occupied. The OP wants an electrician that won’t make a lot of dust and leaves a mess for the OP to clean up.

Layout is important... Proper layout will save man hours in labor costs. And, "Oh I didn’t count on that"...

 

You do not have to listen to what crap others have and or why. No one online knows the electrical layout in your house, suggestions on what to buy… speculation, confusing, and a waste of time.

The OP should do his homework to learn what best practices are recommended for branch circuits that are used to feed audio equipment.

Those that say the electrician knows best and knows what is needed to meet electrical codes that’s fine for installing a branch circuit to feed a freezer or washing machine. May not be good for feeding audio equipment though.

NEC (National Electrical Code) is bare minimum electrical safety requirements.

Bare Minimum...

Quote:
National Electrical Code 90.1 Purpose:

(A) Practical Safeguarding. The purpose of this Code is the practical safeguarding of persons and property from hazards arising from the use of electricity. This Code is not intended as a design specification or an instruction manual for untrained persons

B) Adequacy. This Code contains provisions considered necessary for safety. Compliance therewith and proper maintenance results in an installation that is essentially free from hazard but not necessarily efficient, convenient, or adequate for good service or future expansion of electrical use.

//


The NEC could care less about how your audio system sounds. NEC could care less if your system is having ground loop hum problems.

 

 

@zensview ,

Look at page 16. Read pages 31 thru 36.
https://centralindianaaes.files.wordpress.com/2012/09/indy-aes-2012-seminar-w-notes-v1-0.pdf


It is important that long parallel runs of NM cables (Romex Trade Name) need to be separated from one another by at least 12" or so, if possible, all the way to the wall duplex receptacle outlet boxes. (As soon as possible after getting out of the electrical panel.) If pulled next to one another the chances increase that the hot and neutral current carrying conductors of the branch circuits will induce a voltage onto the EGC, (Equipment Grounding Conductor) from cable to cable.. This can/will cause ground loop hum. Also any noise traveling on one branch circuit will be induced on the conductors of other branch circuits. One of the reasons for multiple branch circuits is to decouple the power supply’s of digital equipment from analog equipment. That won’t happen if the NM cables are running parallel against one another.

Also keep them away from other parallel running branch circuit wiring.
Especially lighting branch circuits. (Therein branch circuit wiring feeding LEDs, dimmers, and any other harmonic creating noise items that could/would induce a voltage, noise, onto the audio dedicated branch circuits.)
Here in an interesting video on harmonics cauded by a lighting dimmer control.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OCK5W9vlAE0


If you install more than one dedicated branch circuit make sure to tell the electrician to install both branch circuits on 20 amp breakers fed from the same Line, leg, in the electrical panel. Both on L1 or both on L2.

Why?
Here is an old quote from a White Paper by ExactPower. (The Link is no longer any good. The last time I clicked on the Link was in May of 2013 when I posted it in a thread)

"Less than 300 microamps of ground loop current can cause hum as it flows in an unbalanced audio interconnect cable. However, harmonics of 60Hz that are generated from lighting dimmers or switch-mode power supplies sound like Buzzz mixed with a bit of Hummm and are more easily coupled by even smaller currents. Harmonics can add together when equipment is powered from different phases, so clearly there is an advantage to specifying same-phase electrical service to power the electronics systems in most cases....

Any leakage currents on the safety ground wires of split single phase load circuits fed by different phase legs will add together due to the 240V potential difference....

Power conditioners do not solve any of these common problems: Cross phase coupling (doubles hums & buzzes) .... What actually does solve them: Same phase power.
http://www.exactpower.com/elite/assets/pdfs/theTRUTH.pdf

 

*** Any leakage currents on the safety ground wires of split single phase load circuits fed by different phase legs will add together due to the 240V potential difference....

 

NO multiwire branch circuits... (A branch circuit consisting of 2 hot conductors and a common shared neutral conductor. The two hot conductor must be fed from opposite legs. One from Line 1 and the other from Line 2.)

Multiwire branch circuits are bad for audio equipment.

 

The Type of branch circuit wiring used and the method used for installation is important for a branch circuit(s) feeding audio equipment.

.

 

 

@steeveb @jea48 >>>The two hot conductors must be fed from opposite legs. One from Line 1 and the other from Line 2.<<<

Even though steeveb failed to mention that in his post (I’m sure he just forgot), it would be a must in the 3-wire hookup that he described. You would never ever want to have two dedicated 15 or 20 amp branch circuits, on the same leg, sharing the same neutral (unless it was over-sized, but don’t even go there).

Here are some great white pages put out by Middle Atlantic. Pay special attention to Middle Atlantic’s page 12 of the booklet (AC-HCF). If you’re looking to wire up a branch circuit for audio, AC-HCF is the wiring I would highly recommend using. Obviously some, due to existing building construction, won't be able to utilize this particular cable, but if and when possible, use AC-HCF (with isolated ground outlets) for your audio branch circuits, as it just doesn't currently get any better. Taking that even a step further, it would probably make sense to have a separate dedicated branch circuit just for your power amps, and one for your front end gear.

Optimized Power Distribution and Grounding for Audio, Video and Electronic Systems

 

@jea48 

An absolute perfect audio approach I wholly agree. That is of course the house being a new build under construction. Could be an incredibly costly endeavour depending on present electrical service. One might have to deal with noise etc. after the fact, panel reconfiguring and many a PS audio industry out there ready to help.In many cases those are the only options. I’m very fortunate in that I have a small quiet panel 10 feet from my equipment, my installation was DIY overseen by an electrical engineer and a seasoned Audio Technician, there is no Measurable audible noise ! Perhaps I was a little cut and dried with my recommendations, requesting a whole lot of detail would’ve been a better way to go.

Cheers

 

Another tip for you; when establishing these new circuits for audio, be sure to protect them with the latest dual-function GFCI/AFCI circuit breakers.

Combination Arc-Fault Circuit-Breaker VS. Dual Function: Arc-Fault/GFCI Circuit-Breaker 

Everyone, please listen to @urbie .  He has all the answers.  I just have a physics degree from a little technical school in the midwest (University of Chicago). 

Thanks everyone for your helpful comments — I’ll study them carefully before proceeding. 
 

In reading over the comments, it became apparent to me that I had a typo in my original post. My intent was for the electrician to install a total of 4 dedicated 20 AMP circuits with 10 gauge wiring — one for each of the JC1 amps (2 total), 1 for the AV equipment at the front of the room, and 1 for the HiFi source equipment at the back of the room. I think that addresses the very valid concerns from the first response post. 
 

Thanks again for everyone’s suggestions. 

Carlsbad, you have a physics degree, what does that have to do with knowing how to install a dedicated line and being an electrician? nothing LOL I used to be an electrician I'm retired now you don't have to design a circuit to put in a dedicated line, that's hilarious, all you have to do is run a line from a separate circuit breaker  to your outlet and now you've got a dedicated line, it's not rocket science please don't make me laugh more.

and to add to that a separate circuit breaker that has no other lines running to anything else.

See, I told you @jea48, knew his stuff.

Bob

@gdnrbob,  (Bob), thanks for the kind words.

 

Jim

Adding two dedicated lines using materials on hand and a very long history either full time or as a hobby, 60+ years including 20 as a tech on very high end military systems, to gain whatever is actually possible and not just a change in sound as seems to be what most high cost cables, AC, etc cost.

We have a bunch of wifi power meters close by so also shielding the walls as I remodel and metal grounded window screens.

Power Guard RV permanent mount surge suppressor with remote monitor, nice to see the loads on each 50 amp leg as I turn things on and off. Already had this from prior RV, waited to long to install it, just finished it today.

Separate noisy from quieter circuits per leg. All power cables, Ethernet, etc are located at a distance from each other, c

1) 10 gauge THHN 3 wire twisted at 2 inches per turn. 1/2" aluminum flex connected at the panel but not touching anything metal on the way to heavy gauge plastic boxes, any noise goes back to ground at the panel. Leviton Plus+ 20 amp receptacle, not grounded to box or conduit. 33ft run, likely only used to power sub amp.

2) 12 gauge THHN assembled as above except two outlets down low and one up near the ceiling for the TV and Martin Logan soundbar( used when not playing the regular system) Conduit will be connected box to box but not to the outlets.

Far more current capacity than I will ever need, by design.

Computer likely powered off other nearby circuit though I will test all possible combinations with amps, DAC, etc......too see what might sound better.

I have two good quality surge suppressors I can add to the wall outlets to test as well.

Investment, new money of a few items, under $100, total with RV surge suppressor, likely under $600.

After all is done and tested I will then consider some kind of very reasonable priced power conditioner, possibly DIY, rebuild a dead one, etc...but only if it seems it wold be needed.

Also planned, DIY power cables in the $50 range.

For those willing to spend tens of thousands on wiring, cables, conditioners, etc...cool, have fun in this great hobby, at the bare minimum at least it is good for the economy but if you are happy with it, by all means do it!!!

 

Rick

 

 

 

Also using Square D breakers, already on hand.

Will apply good paste to all connections except plugs into outlets, I will used a can of ProGold to spray those. I saved the military many millions using that stuff, brought in my one can to show them it worked then bought it by the case.

Thanks all, I really apricated. Sorry about delayed reply ( stuck into my busy working day yesterday) This is great leaning curve to me to get onto this really necessary Dedicated AC Line for my home audio system, please continue the thread. 

For those interested; more white pages on AC power for audio:

Power and Grounding for Audio and Audio/Video Systems

You want two, one for your main components and a separate for your amp.

Overkill if you understand electricity. Just be sure to wire the two circuits on the same AC buss. And choose the one without refrigeration, etc. 

2 grounds ,one common ground ,the other a insulated isolated ground on a separate Copper buzz Bar, amd a 2 inch  4 ft long ground 

@audioman58 

Bad choices. Adding additional ground rods can reduce the efficiency of the Earth which is there primarily for lightning strikes on the power lines. Unless it was engineered, you probably made things worse.

These were done a Madter Electrician Audiophile,we changed the original ground rod for they had used brass and it rotted the 2 Solid copper pipe I had Heavy silver plated to not rot , same ground as original but much better 

my system sounds night and day better , that’s the only thing that counts.

and I have at the breaker box a $300 Siemens surge protector which pikes up even little spikes . I had a dedicated 15 amp breaker before , even with a $5000 innuos streamer , in this new Dedicated 30 amp breaker4 wire sounds better then with the streamer vs my little green computer , it’s That good !