I can not comment on the project cleaner but have used the okki nokki for a couple years with aivs products with excellent results. I used the spin clean for a while prior to the O.N. , no comparison. I would not be without a vacuum cleaner. To me it is a must have!!!
If you had to choose between Okki-Nokki and Pro-Ject record cleaners....
Hi all,
I am going to return my sub-woofer to the hifi store where I bought it... after repeated A/B comparisons with and without, I find that I just don't need it.
So I am going to ask for store credit. Depending on how much credit I get, I might get a better record cleaner than the Spin-Clean that I have now. The store carries the Okki-Nokki and Pro-Ject machines, so I wanted to ask what you all thought about the differences (if any) between the two.
I am not really satisfied with the Spin-Clean. I have tried various fluids, also just used distilled water alone, and used various iterations of number of forward and backward rotations.... everything I have read to do in the various Spin-Clean-related threads. It gets my records cleaner, but not totally clean. I still get a lot of pops and crackles.
I keep the records in anti-static inner sleeves after I clean them, and I use a Milty Zero-Stat using all the various methods described in the Zero-Stat-related threads, before playing and after cleaning. Still the pops and crackles, even with my brand-new Janos Starker Bach Cello Suites record (although not as much as with my older records), even after cleaning.
So I am hoping that a better cleaning method will eliminate the pops and crackels and since the local store only carries those two machines, I wanted to check and see if anybody has experiences with either, or both.
If neither machine will be an excellent solution, I will probably use my store credit on something else and keep looking for a better method to clean thoroughly my records.
For the record, my system is:
Music-Hall MMF-5.3 turntable with Ortofon Blue cartridge and Herbie's TT mat
Music-Hall a15.3 integrated amplifier
Bowers & Wilkins 686 S2 speakers
Thanks in advance for your time and advice,
Eric Zwicky
Richmond VA
I am going to return my sub-woofer to the hifi store where I bought it... after repeated A/B comparisons with and without, I find that I just don't need it.
So I am going to ask for store credit. Depending on how much credit I get, I might get a better record cleaner than the Spin-Clean that I have now. The store carries the Okki-Nokki and Pro-Ject machines, so I wanted to ask what you all thought about the differences (if any) between the two.
I am not really satisfied with the Spin-Clean. I have tried various fluids, also just used distilled water alone, and used various iterations of number of forward and backward rotations.... everything I have read to do in the various Spin-Clean-related threads. It gets my records cleaner, but not totally clean. I still get a lot of pops and crackles.
I keep the records in anti-static inner sleeves after I clean them, and I use a Milty Zero-Stat using all the various methods described in the Zero-Stat-related threads, before playing and after cleaning. Still the pops and crackles, even with my brand-new Janos Starker Bach Cello Suites record (although not as much as with my older records), even after cleaning.
So I am hoping that a better cleaning method will eliminate the pops and crackels and since the local store only carries those two machines, I wanted to check and see if anybody has experiences with either, or both.
If neither machine will be an excellent solution, I will probably use my store credit on something else and keep looking for a better method to clean thoroughly my records.
For the record, my system is:
Music-Hall MMF-5.3 turntable with Ortofon Blue cartridge and Herbie's TT mat
Music-Hall a15.3 integrated amplifier
Bowers & Wilkins 686 S2 speakers
Thanks in advance for your time and advice,
Eric Zwicky
Richmond VA
22 responses Add your response
OK I called the store and found out I was mistaken... they carry Okki-Nokki and Nitty-Gritty... they must have a thing for rhyming names :) So let me re-ask the original question. Between Okki-Nokki and similarly-priced Nitty-Gritty, are there strong opinions either way? Thanks again for your input. Eric |
@ezwicky; okki-nokki is better value. at $500 all you can get from nitty gritty will be a fully manual cleaner. turning records by hand is a right pia and a quick way to rsi. as with all platter based rcm you don't want to put your dirty record down on a clean platter so put a piece of card or paper (cut to fit) on the platter before cleaning side 1, then remove the paper when you reposition the record for side 2. |
@mambacfa: I am not 100% sure that I do not have *any* static, but I do notice a difference after changing my method of cleaning, therefore I am sure that cleaning has a significant effect, and that I can further refine the cleaning process so as to take it out of the noise equation. Also, I am not sure what else I can do in order to reduce or prevent static. After cleaning a record, I use the Milty Zero-Stat, then insert it into an anti-static sleeve. The when I go to play it, I use the Zero-Stat again, followed by a few passes with a carbon brush while it’s on the platter. @audio_d: Thanks for that advice, it makes sense. Thanks to the other guys who replied as well. Okki-Nokki seems well-regarded! So for now, I altered my cleaning method and it seems to have made a positive difference. I put a record on the mat that came with my TT (I upgraded to a Herbie’s Way-Excellent mat) on a towel on the coffee table. Then I sprinkle it with Nitty-Gritty record-cleaning solution (just because I have some on-hand from the hifi store). Then I use one of these painting pads... https://www.lowes.com/pd/SHUR-LINE-Edger-Pad-Refill/50369768 ... and spread the solution into the grooves, in a clock-wise direction, not using too much pressure, just enough so that I am sure the bristles are getting down into the grooves. Then after several passes with a back-and-forth motion, I flip the record over (yes the newly-cleaned side is now sitting on the mat) and do the other side. Then I do a final scrub/rinse in the Spin-Clean with just distilled water. Then I dry with cotton cloths and air-dry on a dish rack for an hour. I have noticed an improvement over just the Spin-Clean, with this method. I think the next step upward would be to vacuum the record after the spin-clean rinse. But for now, I am mostly happy with the results. At some point I will get a proper RCM and I thank you all for your input! Eric |
I would definitely recommend moving forward and getting a RCM with vacuum capabilities. I have recently upgraded (substantially) my RCM. I had used the Okki Nokki for a few years before upgrading, and I went with it because dollar for dollar it seemed the best value. I really liked the forward and reverse feature. A few minor issues though, and they are not huge: 1) Its is fairly loud 2) the full platter, so that when you clean one side and flip it over to do the other side you are laying your freshly cleaned side directly on the platter. 3) the hold down clamp has a small outside diameter. It does not cover the label, so when you spray your cleaner on the LP you risk wetting the paper. I solved this by simply cutting a disk from an empty windshield washer jug and drilling a spindle hole in the centre. Just place that on the label before the clamp goes on, and the label is protected. I think once you do get a new RCM you will be glad you did. Good luck Erik |
Hi Erik. It's a 56 panhead (slightly modified HAHAHA) I went up to the Clear Audio Double Matrix Pro Sonic. It is a fabulous RCM, with a price tag to match!!! I am primarily a vinyl listener, and my collection is quite valuable to me, so the cost of the Clear Audio was justified as I deem it to be a good maintenance tool to ensure long/clean/quiet life to my precious albums |
Eric, If you haven't seen it, this record cleaning method might be the ultimate: http://positive-feedback.com/audio-discourse/rushton-paul-diy-approach-ultrasonic-cleaning-lps/ It's based on a DIY ultrasonic cleaning method developed by Harry Weisfeld of VPI. The good news is that the recommended ultrasonic machine and record spinner aren't very expensive - only $200 or so each. And a record vacuuming machine is an integral part of the method, so you can build your way to it starting with the Okki-Nokki and pick up the other pieces later. Reviews of the method say it gets close to master tape quality from LPs. Weisfeld says: Just remember one thing guys, my basement has two USC machines lying there dead with a total retail price of almost $10K. My Chinese USC for $179.99 has cleaned over 3000 records and is still going strong with its Spin-Klean still working perfectly and 1 micron fish filter for $100.00 |
Group, I make my own record cleaner using the formula from the 1996 Stereophile. The cost is next to nothing, I make it a gallon at a time and my records are all spotless and silent. I clean at every play. I have shared this formula with hundreds of audiophiles all over the world and have dozens and dozens of emails from those who agree it's the best thing they have ever used. I try and mention this every time I see someone inquire about cleaning fluids. Email me. n at normansizemore dot com and I will send you the reprint. Norman |
"You can get it from Music Direct for $499 with no tax and free shipping." mktracy- no tax? You're not implying you don't pay your states sales tax? Remember the line on the state form you're supposed to state EVERY out of state purchase and declare tax owed? An agent who's also an audio freak may be reading these forums! |
mktracy- umm...that's not how commerce works here in the U.S.A. Online retailers simply put the burden of taxes on the buyer, regardless if you're in the state or not.EVERYONE is responsible for tax on a purchase. You're not exempt just because you purchased something out of state. Perhaps you're not aware it's been a subject govt. has been trying to resolve with online purchasing for years. For now, it's left to the consumer, to be responsible. http://www.cnbc.com/id/100708642 |
I just got the newest iteration of the Pro-Ject (marketed as the MK II in the UK) and have been pleased with it. I still use my Spin Cleaner for the really dirty records first...don’t want to stress the new baby yet 🙂. I am still experimenting with my cleaning process. The company has a recommended cleaning process of adding drops of their (diluted) cleaning liquid, turn on the machine rotation, use the goat-hair brush to spread the liquid, reverse the rotation and use the brush again, then vacuum two rotations and reverse for two more rotations. My dealer recommended another process that he uses for his record cleaningservice: he uses a Spin Cleaner for the initial cleaning of very dirty records, then attaches the record and cover, adds liquid, then gently scrubs with a Mobile Fidelity cleaning brush. He then vacuums the machine in one direction. I have seen a marked improvement in the sound quality, and my cleaning and drying time is halved. Love the fact the RCM has no platter. I have had only two minor problems: the aluminum arm rests on a plastic collar and is so tight I could not manipulate it; a little engine grease fixed that. Also, the vacuum arm when fully swung over touches the record lock and causes aluminum shavings to fall on the record. Slightly adjusting the vacuum arm avoids this. The factory-provided liquid seems to work well |
Check out the Record Doctor for $200. I've cleaned over 200 LP's over the six months I've had it and it's going strong. I bought an Okki Nokki goat hair brush to do the scrubbing with and that gets the grooves clean combined with the Nitty Gritty #2 solution and the vacuum on the Record Doctor gets all of the solution off. Great RCM for $200. |
I bought vpi 17 thinking it would get rid of pops and ticks but not the case for me. I tried all types of fluids. Not for everyone but hand held steam cleaner then vacuum with machine. I use spin clean to pre clean flea market albums or kill static. I have never damaged an album and gets rid of pops and ticks machine can't remove and always sounds much better. The scary part is when you reach the end of album with steam you can watch it warp and then go back to original form, so why I say not for everyone. |
