How to upgrade "power cord" on turntable with wall wart?


Hello, I am in the process of upgrading the power cords on my components. 
Is there a way to upgrade the power cord on my Pro-ject 12 Xtension TT ?   
 It has the skimpy wall wart.

Thanks

Mike
Bbb32883 d80b 446f 9ff8 4753917bcc5dmikepaul
I’m all in on upgraded cables, but in the case of a TT power supply, I’ve not seen it make a difference. I’ve tried on 3 tables in my own home ranging from $3k to $20k. The power shouldn’t be reaching the signal path, so I wouldn’t think it could have much impact on sound. 
A TT power cord will have NO effect on sound quality! Stop being so neurotic! As for your other power cords, well many members here know where I stand on that issue.
Yes, can be good for amp and preamp, but for turntable power supply it doesn’t matter in my opinion.

You can upgrade tonearm wire instead, external phono cable (or cartridge if you want huge different in sound)

power cable for turntable is the last thing, really
Quarantine neurosis combined with Audio neurosis.

Make sure you replace the factory cord of the new power supply to the table, with a made in USA product. The electrons are being ruined by the made in China supplied item.

All goofing aside, the Project Xtension is a fine table. An appropriate cart and phonostage(with a nice cables if you insist) should be all that's needed.

If it doesn't, sell everything and listen to your Iphone thru Beats.


Obsessing on room and speaker placement is where to consider  upgraditis.
My very first mod was to hard-wire a power cord to the motor of a Basis turntable. The first step in proof of concept, to determine if such things even matter, and if so then how much. The improvement was immediately noticeable.

Exercise caution here, mikepaul, there are way more people with opinions than experience, and even more with way more opinions than listening skills. Logic and reasoning, won’t even go there.

Well maybe for a second. Long enough to point out if things outside the signal path can’t matter then why does the turntable matter at all? Platter, bearing, tone arm, motor- whole thing is outside the signal path. Yet someone with no experience just said emphatically it can’t make any difference.

Inside the wall wart you will find the simplest of simple power supplies. A transformer, couple of diodes, maybe a cap. Probably on a flimsy little circuit board. Not much.

Each one of those cheap little parts contributes to performance. Its not just the wire. Its all of it.

My suggestion is first go check out my system and read the description and comments, so you will know I know what I’m talking about. https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/8367 Notice the mods done to the Active Shielding MPCs. These are almost exactly the same sort of wall wart. All the same principles apply.

Then once you have a handle on it open yours up and have a look inside. Then either DIY or maybe take some pics and message Michael Spallone. Or me. Whatever you do, understand that yes indeed this will make a difference.
Please recall what type of power cable goes to your outlet and what type of outlet it is, something special? What's the point to change 1 meter of the power cable from turntable motor to the outlet if the rest of power cable is just regular power cable you can buy very cheap. There is no audio signal goes throught turntable motor, so it is not the same case as with the amps/preapms. 

If you care about pure electricity then you have to change cables in your house or in your flat. Or maybe power conditioner, pure energy ??? Your own electro station? ))


It makes a difference.  When I bought my Technics SL1200G I started with the supplied power cable.  I had Rob Fritz from Audio Art build me a cable for the turntable.  Once I inserted it into the system, there was an immediate and noticeable increase in PRAT. Going back to the stock cord, the PRAT diminished noticeably. 
Try upgrading the power supply itself by getting rid of the wall wart altogether using a linear power supply with proper voltage and often adjustable to fine tune.
Once I inserted it into the system, there was an immediate and noticeable increase in PRAT. Going back to the stock cord, the PRAT diminished noticeably.


How can you explain it ?
I bet you believe in fuse upgrade too

The each of us has to end up like this dude in Japan
Millercarbon wrote, "...if things outside the signal path can’t matter then why does the turntable matter at all? Platter, bearing, tone arm, motor- whole thing is outside the signal path. Yet someone with no experience just said emphatically it can’t make any difference."
The premise of the statement is patently false.  The turntable matters very much, BECAUSE the platter, bearing, tonearm, motor (and the mode by which the motor drives the platter) are all IN the signal path in the sense that noise, resonances, speed irregularities, alignment, etc, all obviously do color the SQ.  I am sure Millercarbon would admit this is the case, if he were to have a second thought.  This is quite different from the function of the power cord to a turntable.  One could argue that the power cord cannot affect the sound, so long as it is of sufficient gauge to carry the current drawn by the motor and so long as contacts on either end are clean.  I've thought about this issue and even experimented with different power cords. So far, I have never heard a big difference mediated by a power cord.  If the OP's turntable has a wall wart power supply, then I agree with someone else who commented that there is more to be gained by upgrading the power supply.  But that job requires some sophisticated knowledge of electronics.  Most vinylphiles are not capable of it, so they/we resort to flipping power cords and telling ourselves we heard a big improvement.  Notice, it's always an improvement, never a backward step.

I too, agree that the power supply itself is much more important than the power cord for TT's.
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The OP has a $5K table that can't keep maintain a reasonably steady 33.3, as is-stock?

I would demand a refund.


different power cords on a turntable makes no difference......
lewm, I’ll admit that if you redefine outside the signal path to mean in the signal path then yes, you are right. Word games aside the point is all these things really do matter. And not subtle, but a lot.

OP- full disclosure. When talking about platter, plinth, motor, bearing, motor housing, etc. and saying "all these things matter" there is the possibility of misunderstanding. "All these things matter" not because someone said somewhere once upon a time. "All these things matter" because they have each and every one been tried, one at a time, and been shown to matter. Its how the Miller Carbon Turntable was built.
DYODD. https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/8367
It makes a difference. When I bought my Technics SL1200G I started with the supplied power cable. I had Rob Fritz from Audio Art build me a cable for the turntable. Once I inserted it into the system, there was an immediate and noticeable increase in PRAT. Going back to the stock cord, the PRAT diminished noticeably.

Please notice OP there is a pattern. Those who have actually tried and done all say it matters because they know from experience it matters. Those who have not done make grand pronouncements devoid of any actual knowledge, let alone experience. Its rote repetition. Repetition without comprehension. The proper response to them is, "Polly wanna cracker?" As opposed to stereo5 and me to whom its, "Well now, good to know, I will have to look into that. Thanks!"

Speaking about turntable power cable in general
Not sure about US standards, but could you explain how a short piece of POWER cable connected to TURNTABLE compensate for x100 times longer cheap power cable going from the wall outlet somewhere outside of my flat and connected to console in my house where we have 14 apartments on 7 floors. Why the last piece (1m) of power cable is important for turntable while another 100m of power cable is not important?

Thick cable that you have with your desktop computer is bad? Cable of the same thickness hidden in the walls in our flats. So to improve a 100m cable you just have to add 1m of different cable on one end according to this logic? And this is the cable that just supply voltage to turntable motor that rotate the platter.

I just don’t get it. Maybe i’m stupid?

I use all my turntables with stock power cables, i have expensive power cables for some of my amps, preamps. Manufacturers supply regular power cables. BTW I’ve seen the power cable behind my wall outlet.

I can get the idea of power conditioners and pure energy devices, but why 1m of a better cable connected to 100m of conventional power cable makes any difference? Please explain this phenomena.

Would you like to replace another 100m of the power cable behind your wall outlet then, and how far you can go ?
If it’s a wall wart you can’t change the mains cable on it as it hadn’t got one. You could try an alternative if you know what it is supplying the table, easy enough if it’s AC and you know the voltage and frequency. As a first test that won’t cost a penny try the supply you have in different positions on the power strip, assuming you’re using one. If you can hear position make a difference than playing with the supply might too. A larger transformer maybe if that’s all the wall wart is. Naim used to make a supply for the Linn LP12 that was just a large toroid in a box and a phase board that went in the deck. I used to power a Manticore Mantra from an isoformer instead directly from the mains to good effect but when I bought a Townshend Rock with a Merlin ps (producing a synthetic sine wave) the isoformer degraded the sound when I put it before the ps.
Replaced the WW that came with my Clearaudio with a 12V linear power supply from Jay's Audio.

Did it right after I bought the TT and never tried to A/B them. 

Just felt it would be better to have a bigger and more stable power supply feeding it.

Now that I have so much spare time on my hands, I may build myself an upgraded "umbilical" power cord.

And I can not say enough good things about Jay's Audio. Great customer service, shipping and product. 

No, not affiliated in any way with them, just a very happy customer!
chaster-
I just don’t get it. Maybe i’m stupid? 

Wouldn't rule it out. Which if you think about it is the crux of the problem. You have ruled it out. Why? Because you can't explain it. 

That is one very stupid reason. You may not be a stupid person. We give the benefit of the doubt. But you have picked one very stupid reason, which does not tilt the odds in your favor.

There's a serious issue here you will do well to try and understand. There is a difference between the existence of a thing and the ability to explain the existence of a thing - and the one does not rule out the other. 

Got it? No? That's a shame. Odds tilting yet again. We will try another approach. 

The Earth is round. Possibly (benefit of the doubt again) you agree. But why? Looks pretty flat to me. 

Never mind. Here's the question: The Earth being round, does it have anything to do with anyone's ability to explain why its round? 

A whole bunch of people have made the comparisons and consistently reported that power cables do indeed sound different. You claim the right to say they are nuts. Why? Please explain.
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It might be worth looking into whether there's a U.S. voltage version of this - https://www.decoaudio.com/deco_audio_project_unibox_power_supply.html
Miller carbon, maybe you missed the part of my post where I said I HAVE tried different power cables on at least two of my turntables ( I might add), including one power cord that I deem to be my best, on preamps and cdps. Yet I heard no improvement on those two turntables. So you may say my experience is limited to testing 3 cords on 2 turntables but that’s my result and I am not a nihilist on power cords. 
Just spend $50 on a linear supply and the you are free to sky the limit on a power cord.

@chakster ……………………………….


No, I don’t believe in fuse upgrades at all, nor very expensive wire but this did make a difference. The music seemed to have a better tone, the music flowed more freely and the sound got a little livelier. For the 130.00 invested in the cable, it made a worthwhile difference. I had to use a Shunyata 4 inch long IEC extension in front of the Audio Art cable for proper clearance. I am happy with the results and that is what counts most.  I forgot to add that I have two 20amp dedicated circuits for my system with Shunyata receptacles.
This is what was explained on another post:
It might seem logical to think so but the power cords going from our wall to our equipment is not the last meter of the the power line. It’s closer to the center of the line. Most of the garbage in the line comes from our own equipment. The transformer on the street pole that goes to our dwelling does a more than adequate job of filtering the noise from the grid.  It may be that 12 gauge shielded power cords help very little or maybe a lot. There’s only one way to find out.


Save your money and get a speed control device.
Save your money and get a speed control device.
That turntable has the Speed Box SE baked into it.


I agree turntable performance is crucial. But in your case, it's not the cable really. Please get a better power supply (which uses decent cabling). I think that's the point. 
Post removed 
Waste of time. Buy more music. 
A whole bunch of people have made the comparisons and consistently reported that power cables do indeed sound different. You claim the right to say they are nuts. Why? Please explain.

Well, i think i already explained why i think power cable for turntable is the last thing to worry about. In my opinion this is just a last meter of the conventional dirt cheap power cable connected to our wall outlet.

If your power cables connected to pure source of clean energy (or power conditioner) than from this device to your equipment it is important i can accept it. In this scenario the length of the conventional power cable is irrelevant, because the there is a power conditioner at the end, this device is a starting point for better cable to out equipment.

As i said i have some very nice power cables, but i don’t have power conditioners or some other source of pure energy. So i think even for the phono stage or amp those expensive cables make a tiny difference. It is worth to have them if in the future there will be some special device between my wall outlet and my equipment.

This is my opinion.

Interconnect cables or speaker cables can make a huge difference in sound, but they are connecting directly two devices and there is music goes through these cables. It’s another story.

According to your logic applied to power cables i could upgrade conventional 1m length interconnect by soldering 5cm of exotic cable directly to it on one end, right ? This is what you do when you add 1m audiophile power cable to wall outlet with about 20-100m conventional power cable goes from the outlet somewhere out of your house.

Snake oil !

P.S. Build your own  hydroelectric power station for better result. 





chakster
Interconnect cables or speaker cables can make a huge difference in sound, but they are connecting directly two devices and there is music goes through these cables. It’s another story. 

>>>>Well, technically, music doesn’t go through any of those cables. There is no music signal until the speakers generate one. What goes through interconnects and speaker cables is actually the same thing that goes through power cords - alternating voltage and current.
I'm with Lewn......I tried a number of different power cords on my turntable and none made any difference at all from each other or stock.   The change in wall wart may make a difference....mine plugs into the wall.
Changing out an el cheapo wall wart for a decent LPS could certainly help, my ears tell me it made a difference on two phono stages I owned. 
That then begs the question as to whether then changing out the LPS power cord to a much better aftermarket one would yield a further improvement.

Not something I have tried but surely in theory it should have some effect?

I no longer have any gear using wall warts or even a LPS to test the idea out on but I am sure some members here must? 
Well, technically, music doesn’t go through any of those cables. There is no music signal until the speakers generate one. What goes through interconnects and speaker cables is actually the same thing that goes through power cords - alternating voltage and current.


I expected someone will make a comment like this, lol 
It is NOT the same and you know it, because with interconnect it goes from the source directly to the speakers. 

When you supply power to turntable it's just for torque, rotation is stable with whatever cable if the turntable is high quality, now sure what exactly you are trying to upgrade here with different power cable? 

But cartridge coil wire, pins, headshell wire, tonearm wire, phono cable, interconnect cable, speaker cable responsible for the music as the signal traveling from A (source) to B (speaker) through these cables.

The source of electricity is not even in your house and the route is way too long to your wall outlet. I think in my country power cable is nothing special up to my wall outlet, so why the last meter of high-end power cable can change anything ? Please explain if you know it. 

Another analogy:
Imagine conventional turntable with regular cable inside the tonearm (about 25cm) and conventional external phono cable (about 70cm), then change 2cm headshell lead wires for "something special" and try to detect any difference. I doubt that better lead wires can change anything if the rest of the cables is just crap. 

Then replace the rest of the cables (inside the arm and external phono cable) for "something special" inslucing better connectors and listen again. I bet in this scenario you will hear the difference. 

   
It will not make any difference.  If you do however, make sure it is "insurance proof" otherwise if something goes wrong and causes a fire, even though it may have nothing to do with the cable, they will use it as an excuse not to pay.  Not worth it....
You might look up Swagman. I was able to get rid of the wall wart on my Rega turntable with one of their power supply units.
The thing is, some turntables (e.g. many Project ones) require non-DC power supplies, in which case you're stuck with the supplied wallwart or a very close equivalent.
Why would you want to? Geeez it works make  no difference but hey it’s your money.