Get the largest HEPA type room filtration machine you can afford. Check the threads there was one a week ago.
Try Endust cleaner for electronics. It puts a charge on the chassis to repel dust so that it lands somewhere else.
Move. Just kidding;>)
Hepa air cleaner left on in that room anytime not using system. A large Honeywell Hepa will keep the air much cleaner.
Cool. Good idea. How LARGE might you be talking about? Could something like what you've suggested be moved easily enough? Wouldn't want some big industrial sized monster populating a lot of floor space in my beautiful dedicated listening room,(the room is a showpiece in itself),and must have high wife acceptance factor. I WILL check into the Honeywell Hepa for sure.
What about an OREK? Saw one of those late night "infomercials" and the OREK ProShield Plus air purifier looked like it might be a player. Anybody own one? If so, does it work well/do the job? T.V.ad claims that it cleans and recirculates all the air in an entire room 10 times in 1 hour. I guess that sounds like a good thing? It runs about $400 and is supposed to operate very quiet. Looks pretty stylish too. Input from owners of it is appreciated.
The Honeywell HEPA are about 20" to 24" tall, 16" diameter, alway a beige or off white color. They are on wheels, with a carry handle built in the top. They could be anywhere in the room and clean the air for the whole room. I would not recommend anything advertised on TV. The Big Honeywell mentioned are less than (50250N on Amazon $155. new) and are the best portable one can buy. Honestly the big round ones like the Honeywell work far better than the square boxy ones. (I have had all sorts..)
The main HEPA filter is a permanent one, and an outer 'wool' like prefilter wrapped around the main one can be vacuumed, or replaced rather cheaply. For a dusty situation, the fact the Honeywell has the prefilter is a bonus. The main Honeywell filter would last many years, the prefilter, if vacuumed once a month, lasts about a year or so. I just pop the filter with the prefilter out (take a minute at most) and vacuum the outer dirt off the prefilter with it left right on the main filter, then pop it back in. I am an air filter nut. So I am giving you the best advice I can. I have owned many air filters over the years, and the HEPA Honeywell is the best one. Not the quietest, but the best at doing the job.
Good Luck. (Ps i LOVE your speakers...wish i had some.. Only Maggies for me.)
Thank you so much Elizabeth, the info you provided is very helpful. I am kind of a clean freak when it comes to my audio system, and I hate when all my "toys" look all dusty and upkept, (a condition that is common to most of my friends and audiophile club members). It has bothered me when I go over to share an evening of music listening at someones place and their beloved equipment looks as if it hasn't been dusted, or cared for in years. I take much more pride then that and I could never treat my prize possessions with such carelessness. So I clean, and vacuume, and dust, and constantly wipe things down. My dedicated listening room has been a 20 year labor of love. Not to mention a sizeable investment. But I struggle constantly to keep it all clean and dust free. It's kind of a pain in the butt, and time consuming to do it. I have gone so far as to have "custom" covers made for EVERYTHING, (the B.A.T. amps which sit on stands, the MBL 101e's, the subwoofer, the main rack with all my front end components), but that is a royal pain to always have to cover everything up. Especially when I like leaving my system on/listening to music all the time. Unfortunately, living out in the country, (and closer to all the natural elements), makes for a much dirtier existence then living in town...where streets are paved. In town there are no tractors or other farm equipment working the "field". My cars are NEVER clean. Much as I love the FRESH air, I never run my "whole house" fan. It works wonders to circulate stagnent air inside my home, but sucks in every bit of airborn dust, pollen, and particulate. So everything inside my entire house gets super dusty...all the freakin' time! I also have ceiling fans in every room of my home, including my dedicated audio room. All they do is circulate the crap around even if they do provide air movement within each room. The area of California I live in gets very hot in the summer so fans and air conditioners are a must. I try to open windows, use fans as often as possible so as not to run the electric bill through the roof. Which I do anyway during our long, sweltering summer days. Oh the price one must pay for peace & solitude...and better air quality! Another question I posed earlier in my original post: Does constantly having dust on, and getting into the nooks and crannies of speakers, and air vents of pieces of gear, cause any long term negative effects on performance? reliability? lifespan of components?
The 'petals' and bases of your Radialstralhers are better off without the dust being wiped off (scratching the finish?)
and the innards of most electronics are not a good place for a lot of dust. Otherwise it is not too much of a problem. I am suprised that you do not get some built in addition to the 'whole house' fan to purify the air. Some sort of HEPA filtering system must be available?
I have a pet Cockatiel, and they have a 'dust' that lubricates the feathers. The dust is very much like a dusting powder, and gets in everything. So I share your concern for dust.
I hope you find a good solution.
Good luck (and enjoy your system!!!)
A word of caution. A few years back I obtained a few of the Oreck air filtration machines which have ozone generators. Later on my audio dealer advised me that ozone wreaks havoc on rubber products. Sure enough all of my o-rings and belts on my VPI turntable started to crack in a relatively short period of time. He also said any phono cartridges with rubber suspensions could be affected as well. I've since turned off the ozone generator on the machines. I would look into filtration systems that don't have ozone (i checked online--some hepas do not have ozone) or have a turn-off provision.
Hello Elizabeth, about your post on 3/17 you made mention that the Pedals, and bases of my speakers are BETTER OFF without the dust being wiped off. If I understand what you are saying correctly, i should not wipe them off at all?
Leave them dusty otherwise run the risk of scratching them when i try and dust them? If that is what you're saying then what am I to do? Leave them the way they are? Oh man, they really start looking like crap if I dont do something. Which do you think would sustain scratches easier? The Lamellas(petals)which are made of some space age alloy. Titanium and Aluminum i believe? Or the high gloss piano black finish on the subwoofer portion of the cabinet? I have been using compressed air from a can to blow dust out of the little nooks & crannies. I also employ a nice soft feather duster to dust the "orbs", i use supersoft micro fiber cloths and the feather duster to GENTLY remove dust from the lower bass cabinet without scratching it. So far I've been lucky and done no damage. I can honestly say that I have racked my brain thinking of better ways to keep the dust off. If you have some better suggestions on how to do that, by all means share those with me. I agree with you, and i know it will just be a matter of time before something happens, and i accidently do damage to one of the surfaces. I did have special custom dust covers made for the MBL's which actually work very well....IF I want to leave them on most of the time. But that's not very realistic as I have my system on for many hours both day and night. Those covers do no good sitting on the floor next to the speakers when they're playing music. Bummer! Just short of constantly cleaning and dusting, or keeping them covered up, the only other option i see is keeping the air in the house cleaner. Hence the question I posed to all Audiogoners. You, Elizabeth have given me my best information so far. The Honeywell HEPA room filter. If you have any other helpful tips on proper/safe cleaning of RADIALSTRAHLERS, I'm all ears! I also appreciate the info from Hifigary regarding Orek air cleaners and the ozone generator inside it. Who knew? Definately will dig deeper into what that Orek does,(and does not do), before moving in any direction or making a purchase. Those late night Orek "infomercials" make it seem like one hell of a nifty, useful device. But is it worth $400? And does it emit OZONE? I gotta do some research into this. Other Ideas and suggestions are wanted, and welcome. Thanks for the input thus far.
I meant just that it is hard to constantly dust them off without creating some marks. Not that you should never clean them!
I hope you can solve the dust issues.
The round Honeywell I suggested does NOT have an 'Ozone' device. (i do not know for certain the other shapes do not)
Again, i am suprised you cannot get a 'whole house HEPA filtering' added to your air conditioning system.
Do not go for any electrostatic charged air purifier stuff though. that is very like an ozone thing, and a mess to clean, and does not do nearly as good a job as a HEPA filter. If you have a choice in whole house system additions, get a two stage filter, where the cheaper sub filter is first, then the expensive HEPA, saves money in the long run by a LOT.
Hey there Elizabeth, thanks for your response. Yes, I agree with you about doing damage to the surfaces. No matter how meticulous a person is. (and I admit I am pretty anal retentive when it comes to my stereo gear. Hey, my MBL speakers are less than 8 months old and in PERFECT, MINT, FLAWLESS condition). So those superficial blemishes and minor scratches WILL HAPPEN over time, no matter how hard you try to be careful. So yeah, I'm not wanting that to happen. Which is why I get that compressed air in a can. But even that doesn't do all that great a job on the driver elements (orbs). MBL and my local dealer both say NOT to touch the tweeter or midrange with your fingers, or any kind of wettness, cleaning solution, nothing at all. So I use a feather duster. Same goes for the watermelon shaped bass orb. No touchie-feelie says MBL. Again the feather duster comes out. But that does not really clean them off and they still look dusty and dirty. The covers I had made are great but not too practical. Clearly I am going to follow your advice and attack this at the source- the fresh(?) air coming into the house needs to be filtered and cleaned before it has a chance to spread its eebee-geebees all over the place, on my stereo, on friggin' everything.
Problem with a whole house fan is how it functions. Really no way to clean that outside air, that is coming inside, unless some type of filter system,(be it HEPA or whatever else),is positioned at the point(s) of entry. Usually a window, front screen door. When the Whole house fan is kicked on, it only "sucks" air from outside, into the house thru whatever intake point is used, that screen door or open window. All the crap, dust, pollen, etc. from outside gets pulled into the house and replaces the stagnent air, sucking it out of a big ceiling duct, which blows it into the attick, then ultimately escapes thru dormer vents on the roof. In order to filter the incoming (dirty) air, something would need to be done at the entry source? what to do has been an issue. Once the "outside" airborn crap makes its way in, then the problem starts all over again. Technically, whole house fans (at least the one we have in our home) really just circulate and get everything dirty. It definately works by bringing in the (fresh??) air and sucking out the old air. The system, by the very nature of its design, is not the best way to cool down yer house. Just a way to move air around. Then again, neither is opening up all your windows. Oh it all functions alright, but the downside is all the crap that invades the airspace in the process. We've had our carpets cleaned twice a year-for many years. Our curtians cleaned. Our wood blinds and shutters cleaned. Everything cleaned-frequently! The dedicated listening room with all the expensive audio gear is just one more pain in the ass cleaning "project" in a series of things we have to do in order to live our lives in peace, out in the country.
Kind of sucks. REALLY IT DOES. I have a good sized home, so running the a.c. can be VERY costly during the hottest times of the year. More than I want to swollow frankly! So we open windows, turn on ceiling fans, use our whole house fan...and so starts the problem all over again.
I really appreciate your ideas and input. I am going to go the Honeywell HEPA filter route. Attack the problem from the inside of the house. Wish there was another, more efficient way to clean up the incoming air before it actually got in to the house, but I don't see that being possible due to the way our system works. So I'm thinking, get a few of those Honeywells, position them at the (outside air) points of entry, or somewhere in the vicinity, and let em rip! It's either that, or close everything off, run the A.C. 24 hours a day during the summer, and kiss $2000 a month good bye. NO LIE. That's what it would be. It's been that before, numerous times. I hate that!! Rather have windows open and use ceiling fans. Kinda feels like I'm stuck between a rock and a hard place. But I HATE PROCESSED AIR. I hate paying big bucks for processed air. Maybe I should move to a cooler climate and away from rural agriculture, huh??? Ha Ha Ha!
I have an air exchanger in my home similar to this http://www.venmar.ca/AfficherProduit.aspx?page=361&langue=en&id=24ave
Systems like this generally won't help much if the windows are open because they rely upon balancing the pressure inside and out to create a "exchange" of air every couple of hours or so. Many other products but I like Venmar and would recommend their products highly. Website is no the easiest to navigate.
Bjesien, thanks for the link. I checked the site out, and learned some information that I never knew before, so cool!
Venmar is in Quebec Canada. I searched for dealers, retailers, and installers of their products here in California. Nothing came up, so I left my contact info. so they can call me.
Yeah, this leval of air filtration/recirculation is a hell of alot more sophisticated than I imagined. I was thinking of putting one of those OREK (tabletop) air purifiers in my listening room...and leaving it at that. Then I realized how little I knew about this subject. Hence, my question to all you Audiogoners! I never gave a bit of thought to my air quality untill it started making my gear look dusty and my shiney new Radialstrahlers kept bitchin' at me! Now all of a sudden, it's a call to action!
Who knew that OZONE screws up the rubber in audio gear? phono cartridges?
Now I'm looking at HEPA based air exchange systems! Funny how things just seem to take on a life all their own. But it's nice to know there are people out there such as youself, Hifigary, Elizabeth, and the others-who have offered up valuable advice and helped steer this thing for me. So thanks everybody for the input so far, and sorry for my longwindedness. I figured if I got real detailed and specific about my room and what is happening, folks would better be able to advise...and they have. One thing is clear, (and it's NOT the air in my house! HA HA HA),... there are definately steps to take and now I know a few more than I did when I started this thread. Still I need to do more research online, and talk to industry professionals more "in depth" as I need to learn more. As of right now I have no idea how involved, or expensive an air exchange system is to have installed. Elizabeth got me all excited about a free standing hepa filter that I can just set in the room. Who knows, maybe I will take things to a whole new leval and make my house a freakin' CLEAN ROOM. I will keep everyone posted as this progresses. Thanks so far for the input everybody.
We paid around $1600 for ours 10 years ago (not installed.) The technology is really simple. The installation depends on your duct system and how many modifications you will need, and also mounting, or hanging the unit in an appropriate location.
Our house is highly energy efficient, so it is sealed, no leaks at all. The important consideration for us was getting moisture out when needed and letting fresh air in. You want to concentrate more on dust and pollen elimination. We have that with ours, however it's not a HEPA unit.
There are many out there, including many USA made units. Web search air exchanger or air to air heat exchanger. It's important to match the system to your home size/needs.
May your gear be shiny and nice!
We also have farm land around us . We rarely open windows , if we need fresh air we go outside . For inside our furnace / airconditioner has an electronic filter that works very well .
Hello Tmsorosk, I wish it were that simple for me. But the big issues for the wife and I are during the summer, when it "bakes" for 4 months solid, we cannot survive with any leval of comfort if we don't run our A.C.-it's an absolute MUST. I don't know about you, but I can't function comfortably once the temperature INSIDE my home rises above 80 degrees Farenheit. It's just too friggin' miserable...and I sweat like Mike Tyson at a spelling bee!! During our sweltering summers it consistently gets 100 degrees or hotter where I live. Some days the mercury will rise to 110, 113, and it's been known to hit 116 degrees. That's brutal. So leaving doors and windows open during the day is simply NOT a viable option. If we run the A.C. all day and night, (which we often do), our electric bill goes right thru the roof. Not at all uncommon to have $1800, $2000, or higher bills per month. It's a killer man! And it cuts into my C.D.,Vinyl, Beer ,& Cigar money! Can't be having that. SO at night when the temp. drops, we open up windows and screen doors, kick on the "whole house" fan, and turn our ceiling fans on high. It works ok, circulates the air, (and all the ebee-geebees from outside too), and the house cools down to an "acceptable" temperature. Like 78 degrees Farenheit. If I didn't run my A.C. during the day, my interior house temp. would very easily hit 95 degress. NO SHIT! It's happened before. I ain't having that! My "whole house" fan, in conjunction with open windows and screen doors, and all the ceiling fans on-is effective at cooling things down but is a BIG CULPRIT when it comes to all the outdoor filth that makes it's way indoors. That's always a problem, always has been. So what to do? Run the air and sell off our first born?, and our gold teeth in order to pay the bill? Or use the "natural" elements, aided by fans, to pull the heat out? Clearly we cannot control what mother nature stirs up outside, nor can we stop farmers from tending to their fields and orchards, so we clean, clean, clean constantly! It sucks man! I have this kick ass dedicated listening room with great gear, killer speakers, artwork all over the place, and it's always so damb dusty. Bums me out. Never was AS big of a problem until recently when I got a brand new pair of MBL 101e Mk2 Radialstrahlers. Paid a small fortune for them. Love em. In no time flat they began to look terrible. All dusty and dirty. They are kind of a pain to clean too. Takes a lot of time and you have to be very careful not to do damage to the (orbs) driver elements, or the high gloss paint finish. I had custom covers made that worked well but are a pain to put on/take off. I am disabled and do not work, so I am home all the time. That allows me to listen to alot of music...all the time! It's really groovy to be able to do that. I love it. My audiophile buddies are jealous as hell and wish they could "immerse" themselfs in TUNEAGE the way I do. SO THAT'S MY STORY, and I'm stickin' to it! Now I am needing to install & employ some kind of TOTAL air filtration/circulation system. Hence, the reason for my starting this thread. Got some good ideas so far. Still looking for more input, and still gotta do more research into different "systems" before making a purchase, or installing anything. Elizabeth suggested those free-standing HEPA filters by HONEYWELL. I plan to buy several of them for starters. They are not terribly expensive and can be moved around as needed. As for moving out of the area, or out of my home? That's NOT an option as we like the area. HATE the friggin' climate during the summer with a passion. So thanks to everybody who has contributed so far. Will keep you all updated as this process moves along. Peace.
Hello Martin ... You must be kidding , $1800 to $2000 per month , Wow , thats about what are utility bills are for a year , and the folks here think were getting hosed . Of coarse in Canada are furnace gets about 7 months use and AC unit is used for about 4 months .
As I mentioned above our furnace/AC unit is equipped with an electronic filter , its far superior to the particle filters that come with those units . The cost was about $900 installed and works whenever the furnace or AC is on . If your close to it you would think there was a bug zapper in the intake duct .
After hearing about the temps you endure it makes 3 feet of snow sound like a tip toe through the tulips . All the best . Tim
Is your room some what sealed so the room can be made slightly positive? Not counting of curse when you open the door to enter. If this can be done, you can add a separate small inline blower to the A/C supply duct that can be switch on and off with a differential pressure switch. This would keep your audio room at a higher pressure than the rest of your house. The air would also be filtered air from your a/c system. This would minimize the dust from entering the room in the first place. This is one of the ways they control the air quality in clean rooms along with very expensive 4 prefilters and 12 95% HEPA final filters. You can also purchase a make up air unit for the room with all the fixings to control all issues with the room as they do with clean rooms.
Hello Tmsorosk, No kidding about the electric bill. You know I'd almost prefer the snow. Colder climate is much more to my liking, unfortunately we are "rooted" like so many people and must stay in the area due to aging and ill parents, children, longevity on the job(for the wife, I'm all done with the work world now),etc.,etc. Now is not the best time to pack up and move away much as we'de like to. Winters are not too bad here. Summer sucks bigtime. We enjoy the small comforts of life which I'm sure contribute to a high electric bill. 2 refrigerators, a freezer, a beermeister (just gotta have one of those you know), and a jacuzzi help drive up the costs no doubt. Add to that trying to cool a big house down to a (semi)comfortable 78 degrees Farenheit when it's 105 degrees outside. We have an oversized a.c. unit for the square footage (2700 sf) of our home, but it works OVERTIME from May thru September. It NEVER shuts off. God forbid when I sneak over to the thermostat, (when the wife isn't looking), and click it down another 3 or 4 degrees. Run the a.c. at 70 to 72 degrees 24/7 and watch the meter "SMOKE"!! Add to that having all the ceiling fans on full speed. Then my audio gear that stays on 18 friggin' hours a day! I have no idea how much juice my B.A.T. VK600se monoblocks consume when they are doing their thing all day and night. But I know they are suckin' down some power, not to mention generating a signifigant amount of heat, which only adds to the issue of cooling down and comfort. My home is 18 years old, (fairly new construction), No basement. Stucco and brick exterior, Cement tile roof, interior walls are sheetrock. Insulation up in the attic was "blown" in, and appears to be covering up all the beams? (R-30 value I believe its rated). All interior walls are insulated too. R-19 I think? Beyond that is nothing particularly special about it's design. My dedicated audio room does NOT have a door to close it off, so in response to your question Hevac1, I cannot seal it off from the rest of the house or do anything with regard to "differential" pressure. At least I don't believe so, if I even understand what you are suggesting. (I'm definately no HVAC expert). I DO have one of those "HUSH" fans mounted up in the attic, ducting connects to 1 single ceiling mounted vent above the equipment rack, sucks the rising warm air out and blows it into the attic. It's on 24/7 and has never been turned off in the last 4 years. Without it the room would become unbearable to sit in and listen to music during the summer. Oh yeah, house sits oriented east/west, so we get morning sun that "frys" the front of the house 1/2 the day, and afternoon sun that "bakes" the back of the house, and patio the rest of the day. Ah shit, now that I read all the things I just wrote maybe I SHOULD just move to a colder climate! Ha Ha Ha! So that's what it's all about here in my neck of the woods. Still pisses me off that we incur such monster power bills every summer. SO...in an attempt to utilize the "natural" elements (nightly breezes), and the ceiling fans, the "whole house" fan, and open windows and screen doors...my house, my dedicated listening room, my beautiful audio gear and MBL speakers, (and every other cotton pickin' thing), is dirty. Dirty all the time. What to do? What to do? So far Tom6897, and Elizabeth have suggested HEPA filters, Free standing Honeywell type. I plan to buy a few once I find who sells them in my area, but have not done it yet. I'm still taking everybodys input under advisement. Surfing the net. Doing lots of research and homework. Hifigary cautions against the OREK table top air purifier due to the fact that it outputs "ozone" that will damage rubber. That's not a good thing, even if DAVID OREK says he'll throw in a cordless vacuume cleaner and battery operated refrigerator filter all for only $400.00!! (and he will even pay for the shipping! You just gotta love those late night infomercials.) Bjesien has given me a great idea to install some type of "air exchanger" system in the house, which didn't really seem to be all that cost-prohibitive. Although I will need to concentrate more on dust and pollen removal, but not heat exchange. I am awaiting information and/or a phone call from a manufacturers rep. as I write this. Again, I am no HVAC expert and will need info/installation help on something like this, But thanks again Bjesien for gettin' the ball rolling for me on this one! Hevac1 gave me an idea that I've often thought about, but never done, "seal" my dedicated listening room off. I should put a door on the room!! What a great idea. That way I can pressurize the room, (whatever that means?), and run extra ducting into the room from the main a.c. unit? I think? Did I get that one straight? All great ideas. Some of the more complex HVAC applications I will need to have professionals explain, and install. But that's cool. Some of the more simplistic "do-it-yerself" FREE STANDING HEPA filters are an easy fix and reasonably priced too. I think one of those energy usage surveys would also be a good idea. Maybe my home is in need of some insulation upgrades? I am planning on installing some of those THERMAL SHADE SCREENS across all the windows and glass doors on both the front (eastern exposure), and back (western exposure) of my house once spring arrives. That could help huh? Ok folks, I've carried on long enough. Thanks for reading all my posts, and for all the advice and concern. Peace.