It sounds as though you've pretty much decided that you don't prefer the Vandersteens to the ML's. Yes, it's strange that the bass contest seems to go the ML's over a speaker that is extensively engineered to provide SOTA one-box bass, but there you go. The thing I immediately think of is that with so much adjustment possible in the bass, maybe you haven't got the 5's properly dialed-in yet, but you seem to think that you and your dealer have this covered. I don't think your variety of partnering gear can be blamed, and you've tried the Vandy's out in the bigger, treated room, so what's left? I think the "A" upgrade of the 5's includes a better bass amplifier, but how can you be sure you'll get everything you want top to bottom if you spring for it? Obviously, even though the low bass isn't handled by the main panels, an ESL is going to give a much different presentation overall from a dynamic box speaker, and your allegiance seems clear. (Or could the Vandy's actually be telling the truth, but you're underwhelmed?) Whatever the case, maybe you should look into the newest ML's such as the Prodigy or Odyssey instead, which are supposed to be even more accomplished in the bass than the older ReQuests, though this would probably mean having to do the acoustic treatment again in your listening room if you want comparable results. I live in the area - email me if you want, but I think you already know what I think you already know... ;^)
Help with speakers, equipment, satisfaction
A little background, I have a theater room that was designed for me and I built it. The room is 30 X 17 X 9' ceiling. All the walls have acoustical panels for absorption and reflection. In this room I have ML request Z speakers, Lexicon MC-1, Pioneer DV-38A DVD player, Conrad Johnson 2 channel amp and Harmonic Tech cables and interconnects. also center and surround speakers.
After some debate I decided to use another room for stereo only and proceeded researching and reading recommendations for equipment. I choose a pair of Vandersteen 5 speakers using a BAT VK500 amp, Wadia (GN reference upgrade) and Audience cables with various room treatments. The room is 18 X 13.5 X 8' ceiling.
Being Mother's Day I decided to have other opinions on my systems (family and friends). We played a couple of tracks from a new rock CD and an existing Jazz CD. I then took them to over to the ML room and played the same tracks. No one has any knowledge of the equipment so they are basing there opinions on the sound they liked. Hands down the ML system (which are not famous for bass) took 1st place. They were impressed the clarity and bass for punch. To make sure there is no interference with the sub woofer I unpluged it. Unhappily I have to agree with this statement.
I had the 5"s setup for the room. I also had a dealer setup there 5's and went to there location for a listening session. I didn't hear any noticable differences. I have adjusted the crossovers, the bass levels, adjusted the positioning of the speakers, the sitting location (the bass is the strongest in the back of the room). I have tried other equipment (BAT pre-amp, CD player, Placette Pre-amp and McCormick DNA-2 LAE amp). As you can see I have narrowed down the equipment. In the 5's defense in an adjacent room you can tell the bass is definitely there. I placed the speakers in the theater room to make sure the treatments were not really adding that much to the ML sound (the room was designed with the ML's in mind) and that really didn't help that much on the bass as far as punch. The mids and highs were close to the ML's but didn't shadow the ML's overall. I use my decimal meter often and with a 75 reading on the ML's I can be comfortable with the bass and overall sound. With the 5's I have to push between 80 to 85 to get similar results.
The problem is no matter what I try to better the stereo room sound with equipment changes and upgrades I can't get the results that I feel I should be getting. I know the speakers and equipment should make a wonderfull sound and that's what I can't understand. I did have a ground problem with the speakers and cleared that up with grounding and using balanced interconnects.
So, should I give up on this venture, sell the 5' and use the rest of the equipment from the stereo setup and upgrade the ML's?
I am in the Washington DC area and would be open to anyone with a better ear to visit and tell me what I should be hearing.
Thanks Joe
After some debate I decided to use another room for stereo only and proceeded researching and reading recommendations for equipment. I choose a pair of Vandersteen 5 speakers using a BAT VK500 amp, Wadia (GN reference upgrade) and Audience cables with various room treatments. The room is 18 X 13.5 X 8' ceiling.
Being Mother's Day I decided to have other opinions on my systems (family and friends). We played a couple of tracks from a new rock CD and an existing Jazz CD. I then took them to over to the ML room and played the same tracks. No one has any knowledge of the equipment so they are basing there opinions on the sound they liked. Hands down the ML system (which are not famous for bass) took 1st place. They were impressed the clarity and bass for punch. To make sure there is no interference with the sub woofer I unpluged it. Unhappily I have to agree with this statement.
I had the 5"s setup for the room. I also had a dealer setup there 5's and went to there location for a listening session. I didn't hear any noticable differences. I have adjusted the crossovers, the bass levels, adjusted the positioning of the speakers, the sitting location (the bass is the strongest in the back of the room). I have tried other equipment (BAT pre-amp, CD player, Placette Pre-amp and McCormick DNA-2 LAE amp). As you can see I have narrowed down the equipment. In the 5's defense in an adjacent room you can tell the bass is definitely there. I placed the speakers in the theater room to make sure the treatments were not really adding that much to the ML sound (the room was designed with the ML's in mind) and that really didn't help that much on the bass as far as punch. The mids and highs were close to the ML's but didn't shadow the ML's overall. I use my decimal meter often and with a 75 reading on the ML's I can be comfortable with the bass and overall sound. With the 5's I have to push between 80 to 85 to get similar results.
The problem is no matter what I try to better the stereo room sound with equipment changes and upgrades I can't get the results that I feel I should be getting. I know the speakers and equipment should make a wonderfull sound and that's what I can't understand. I did have a ground problem with the speakers and cleared that up with grounding and using balanced interconnects.
So, should I give up on this venture, sell the 5' and use the rest of the equipment from the stereo setup and upgrade the ML's?
I am in the Washington DC area and would be open to anyone with a better ear to visit and tell me what I should be hearing.
Thanks Joe