Help me complete my stereo system (Harbeth, ClearAudio Concept).

Was reading Darko's review of the P3ESR SE. He should have listened with his ears instead of his eyes and with another product than Heed Class D...  

With a sub I can imagine so.  

Update :  the P3 ESRs are breaking in nicely.  My Creek amp can get them to decent volume but I need to try something more powerful to make a final call.  As soon as Covid allows I'll audition some Luxman / Harbeth combos.

At the risk of offending the Naimsters I think you might be right.

Yes ¨easy to drive¨ is what is advertised but, as you all note and as is supported by reviewers, Solide State with some headroom in the power department is the way to go (despite the occasional good experience with tube gear).  

On the radar at this point : Yamaha A-S 1200, Luxman (though price is a bit out of whack with the rest of the system, but I'm intrigued), and perhaps NAIM (though their offer is multiple and confusing, I like the minimal aesthetic and perhaps the brit fi factor).    

I should add that I'm winding down my small CD collection, so I expect streaming to replace those.

Also, based only on reviews thus far, I think there might be some interesting amplification options from NAIM, Simmaudio and Yamaha.  Luxman is a bit pricey for the kit contemplated; I don't see the point of driving 3K speakers with 6K amplification.  Hegel has surfaced quite a bit in forums I've lurked into but I'm a bit skeptic of internal DACs for the long run.  

The Accuphase /Harbeth dealer closed shop during Covid 19 to go online exclusively.  

So far, the feedback and real world experience from owners is that P3ESR will be fine for my room size.  This confirms what I suspected and so my heart and mind are now set 100% on the P3s.

My current setup is Creek EVO 50A with smallish 4ohms speakers with 4 inch woofers and while these are fast, accurate, lack a bit of bass  and have good midrange, I find that I prefer a more natural presentation which has led me to Harbeth with midrange focus where I think is where music happens.  I play drums (jazz, light rock) and appreciate good tone and realistic timbres, and find anything bright fatiguing (slight tendnitis tendency...) so Harbeths are it, and considering other factors P3ESRs fit the bill.

Now on to amplification...  

Yogi,
I've watched that review so many times lately, I find it relaxing for some reason, he makes a great case for the P3s sonic signature and what is so attractive about them.    

Elliott,
Thank you for your comments/recommendations.  These are all valid points and many of which I've already considered.  Same as mentioned in the De Filios video, I'm not inclined to add a sub. If I feel the bass would not be well served, that would mean going to a bigger woofer, hence why I also have C7s under consideration.

The dilemma with P3esr seems to be that, while they seem like a good bargain, they can't be exploited to their full potential with budget tier amplification. I think the P3s would do a more than adequate job for my space and budget.  If I move and have a larger listening space a few years down the line, I would expect the P3 setup to become either a secondary system or make one of my sons very happy. My budget would move within the reaches of HL5 or 30.1 or the like.   

Mesch,

Thanks for the BEL recommendation, I will check into those for sure.  

J

I see, sure looked the business that amp.

PPS : You guys have been really helpful despite the P3 /Amp match topic having been beaten to death : - )

PS.  I suspect the PRAT element found in Naim gear could give the kick in the pants I felt the C7s needed when I auditioned with Accuphase Integrated.

After some additional research this afternoon I dropped the Luxman 505 from the list, I can't see how this betters the Yamaha enough to justify the huge price difference (I suspect Lux are much more affordable in Japan).  The Yamaha is extremely well designed inside. It's a big component with a big 1970s vibe.
 
Did further research on NAIM's product line as well, and the Nait XS3 appears to fit the bill with a price in the right range with excellent phono and headphone stages to boot.  

Also added Belles Aria (it was on the list a while ago), recommendations fuse on the match with P3s, there is also a dealer in my neck of the woods.  

Some bad news though:  I can't seem to track down a new pair of the standard P3ESRs (except in black). Some standard C7s are still available at only a $200.00 dollar difference to the P3ESR XD, making them extremely enticing.  Decisions, decisions.  

Best way to solve this will be to audition some kit (I tracked down a Naim dealer with Harbeth product not too far away).

Still trying to track down a set of P3Esr.

Called a dealer today, he was out of P3s, including XDs. He said that supply is scarce and .... that he didn’t expect to sell many XD versions at these new inflated prices !

Alan Shaw: Bring back the classic P3ESR in other colors than Black please !!

Thanks Yogiboy, I will.

I contacted deja vu. They will try to track down P3ESr standard version in other colors (they had black which is already available closer to home but those would be an eye sore in my main living room).  

I've found a MINT pair of the Special Editions in Rosewood.  

Thanks for all the recommendations, they are all going on the list for further consideration.  An all in one solution for the phono stage and headphones is very appealing.

Curious about Unison Research as well.  

Lots of options that need direct experience with, which Covid conditions prevents somewhat for now. Using the time to read up  on components.  

 

This amp speaker pairing business will take a bit of time to sort out, so the P3s will be mated to my Creek Evo 50A for the time being.  My goal is to get off the merry go round without hopping on ! Therefore, I'll be looking for an amp that gives justice to the P3s for many many years to come.  I get the feeling this will be in the $ 3,5K plus category.   

I've always been attracted to the Conrad Johnson CAV series of integrated amps.  

Love this type of minimalist-high-quality-fair-price product. Anyone with real world experience driving P3ESRs with any of the CAV C-Js is welcome to try to convince me to go in that direction. 

I pulled the trigger on a pair of P3esr Special Editions in roeswood represented as Mint. The total cost including shipping is more than 60%  lower that the cost of the XD version currently available.

As much as I'm willing to spring extra dollars for gear where I feel the price justified, I think the future classic of the P3ESR will likely be the base model or the 40th, and those can be found (with some patience) for a decent price still.  

My mistake.  

The point about this review is that it fails to capture what the P3Esr are really about.  To me the P3s is a well designed speaker that does what it does with class leading attributes.  It's a set of speakers to which you can throw serious amplification at and it won't be outclassed.  This said they won't do Metallica or Daft Punk as well as other speakers out there, but in the right space with the right gear they can do wonders with a very wide range of music.  For my requirements, in my room, if they can do right by Miles, Herbie and Trane then bring on the pipe and slippers.  

Luxman is back on the list.  Will audition vs Naim Supernait.  

 I'm thinking that I should look a bit more into the future.  

The amp will have to be a good match for P3ESR for now but it should also be able to power larger Harbeths down the line to feed a bigger room (M30 or HL5).

In the meantime, the turntable can be upgraded to a moving coil for example.  Considering how the vinyl will stack up in 3 to 5 years, I may go up the Clearaudio chain and upgrade the table too.  

Luxman has great MM/MC onboard phono, the Supernait is only MM and I want to keep boxes to a minimum.  Also, from the reviews, I think the Luxman may have more of the signature sound I'm looking for (balanced), call it pipe and slippers if you want.  

These are all great suggestions (Unison Research, CJ, Luxman 550).  At this time, I have to say that the 550 is very enticing (pure Class A).  

This said, I don't understand the hangup over 505, the build / layout look very similar to the other Class A/B amps in Luxman lineup, damping factor and voltage are in the same ballpark, until you get to the 509.  

The P3s are replacing my Totem Arros, and these too have great attributes: fast, detailed, tuneful, decent bass.  This said, it was time to try something else after 15 years and the tweeter has never been to my liking especially on the stuff I listen to.  P3ESRs fit the bill.

Thanks Arafik, I will.

Hi Everyone,

Received my pair of P3ESR SE in rosewood yesterday.  So here is a quick report :

- These are just first impressions :

 1) My Creek Evo 50A can drive them but it will not make them sing.  They like power.  Alan Shaw is right they are not a hard pairing, they will play nicely, but if you pair a weaker/cheaper amp you won't get the full performance these speakers can deliver.  

2)  They sound a bit congested, the soundstage is not stable at this point, the bass response is changing right in the middle of a tune. I attribute all that to the fact that they need another 175 hours to break in.

3) The details, at least the ones that are showing up now, are lush, correct, detailed but non fatiguing, monitor-like but not sterile. 

4) They can handle power and provide sufficient volume to fill my space (11 X 14 X 9) with a clean, detailed, lush sound.  They will do this even more effortlessly and better with a class leading amp.

5)  As everybody knows, the mid-range is amazing and voices (I let my wife do the honours and she picked Joni) are life-like with lots of natural detail... some wet eyes followed...

6)  They love to be placed along the long wall of the room, wow ! ... but I need a way to sit in front of the fireplace to be in the sweet spot.

7) They are amazing for near field listening.

8)  These little speakers are worth the investment in better stands and cables. Integrated amps will be auditioned soon.

Best to everyone

There's a Harbeth / Luxman dealer not too too far, so I'll be able to audition a wide range of Harbeths and Luxman amps as soon as Covid allows.  

Heard the P3ERS with Accuphase ... blown away. 

While my current room is a relatively small sitting room, I want to make sure that my components are as close to final upgrades as possible so if I move in a few years they are still able to meet room demands.  

Next step will be a cartridge upgrade on my Clearaudio TT.  

I remain curious about Naim but I want to keep components to a minimum and it's very important that the onboard phono stage be able to do MM/MC.  In that respect Luxman may have an edge.  

This system will also have a streamer for internet radio, so there will be a fair bit of background music going and news and talk shows,  so I feel the amp has to be a jack of all trades with enough juice to make Harbeth sing no questions asked and not get too hot !