Has Anyone Found Shunyata Cables Sounding Thin?

Sabai, I recall you working with the "series" concept a while ago, and I sincerely applaud your creativity and persistence. However, I feel you are disadvantaging yourself with this method. For every change achieved by adding an unnecessary interconnect to the chain, and an unnecessary connection, you are also losing information - you are gaining tonal variety at the expense of precision.

My perspective is that whatever goal could be achieved with the series method could be achieved better by selecting proper cables not in series, but if desired by mixing them. If you feel a particular cable sounds thin, then you place yourself at a disadvantage in using it at all. You are merely degrading the end result in order to adjust the thinness. That is not something I would recommend for the reasons I have stated.

I'm not under the impression that I will change your mind in this matter, but I'm sharing my perspective based on use of cables.

Sorry, Sabai, you are wrong in believing that I have not tried this. When you first posted your "series" idea a while back I tried it; I believe I used three brands of balanced cables in the experiment in different configurations. I found it to have marginal benefit, and I could get better results by continuing to mix a shorter run (no series) of cables than by adding unnecessary ones. In fact, the degradation of the sound was pronounced enough universally that I abandoned the method entirely.

Therefore, I do speak from experience, and my experience says it is counter-productive to add unnecessary cables. While you can adjust the tonality, you will be hurting the precision/clarity. That is my position, and I'm not interested in arguing, if cordially, about it. You are convinced you have a "holy grail" type solution, and after trying it I disagree. :)

BTW, I don't have to hear your system to reach my conclusion, just as you have not heard my system and cannot declare my findings invalid. So, people will simply have to 1. draw conclusions based on our disparate findings, and or, 2. try it.

If I were to hear it I would likely very much enjoy the sound of your system, especially since you have worked so hard to tune it. However, I am also confident that given the opportunity I would be able to improve the sound, that is, make it more to my liking, by being able to remove some of the "serial" cabling and mix in as I wished a more streamlined set of cables. Or, more likely, I would replace the mix of cables with an entire set of cables I feel are exceptional.

I simply do not agree with you when you say the system is at, "no disadvantage whatsoever." From my experience (not simply theory) that is not possible when adding cables which are unnecessary to the system. You may prefer the result, but I have experience which leads me to conclude there is degradation happening in your system as a consequence.

Based on my experiments a person may be able to adjust a sound to address a problem using serial cables, but it introduces a different set of problems unnecessarily when attempting to attain a more SOTA-like sound.

Sabai, like I said, we're not going to agree on this. I'm glad your method works for you; that's what we're after, a satisfying experience. :)

Actually, no one has mentioned the most damning problem with Sabai's initial complaint about Shunyata cables. (Unless someone else commented and I didn't see it.)

There is no way to know the native sound of the Shunyata cable when used in series with another brand of cable. They are simply being misused. I would guess Shunyata would not agree that their cables are thin sounding, and not even Sabai could argue this when, in fact, he's using them serial with other cables. It's one thing to say, "X cable sounds thin," but it is an entirely wrong statement to say, "X cable sounds thin," when it has been used in serial, which is in no way representative of normal usage.

I suspect Sabai may not have even tried the Shunyata cable alone; from the lead post it appears he has inserted it into his serial cable system and weighed in on its sound. He simply is not using the cables correctly, according to the intent of the manufacturers, when he uses them serial. Consequently, he is most assuredly off base on describing the sound of any cables he is using in that fashion.

It's tough enough to zero in on the sound of a cable when used in a mix of brands; it is impossible to know the native sound when used in an unnecessary serial configuration.

Mixing cable brands as well as serial use leads to one thing: a sloppier sounding rig in which it becomes impossible to isolate the actual contribution of any cable used in series. It may sound good, but not nearly as good as if proper methods were employed. I have built hundreds of rigs and tried such things, and I don't need to hear anyone else's rig to state that as a principle of system building.

I think Sabai feels his philosophy of audio is superior to persons like me, and thus I don't think he will be open to such criticism. He proposes what he feels are superior methods, but when those methods come under scrutiny, he retreats to the, "... you can't judge because you haven't heard my system," defense.
There is no way to find solid ground with such methods and logic. :)

Zd542, you may be correct about that, but it seems that Sabai has been using cables in series for a long time. If you are right, and he tried the Shunyata cables, but they were not to his liking, then I'm sure you would agree the proper solution is to eliminate them, not add additional cables. All an individual is doing when adding more cables in series to correct a perceived problem is making a potentially better system worse; unnecessarily doubling the length of the interconnect, which deteriorates the sound, adding unnecessary connections, which deteriorates the sound, and mixing a so-so wire with a better one, which also deteriorates the potential. Not a good solution at all, and this is so whether in Sabai's rig or anyone else's.

If his ears like what he has done, great! But it's not a better way to build a rig.
A better way to build a rig is to find a better/more appealing cable and lose the series approach.

Sabai, thanks for the clarification regarding trying the Shunyata cables alone. But, as I said I am done discussing this with you.

Sabai, a clarification for your and the community's benefit; when I used the phrase, "... so-so wire," I was referring to the Shunyata cables you said were thin sounding.