Genelec SAM active studio monitors for home use


https://www.genelec.com/studio-monitors/sam-coaxial-studio-monitors

Wondering if anyone has experience with Genelec SAM monitors in their home. They are meant for near field listening, but I wonder if they can fill a room if seated 8-10 feet away. These speakers have room correction and coaxial design. On paper it seem very promising. Please share any first hand experience. Not looking for opinions, but first hand demos in store or feedback from owners. 

My last post on this forum was a disaster. Giving it another try. Mentioning it just in case the same trolls strike again.
rohanstevens
interesting and wow one of them is 111db efficiency
Very cool, right? Seems like there's a couple good active speakers like these. Namely Kii Three, KEF LS50W and Stereo Devialet Phantom Golds. 
I agree; very cool, especially the hidden bass baffle. I am very curious to listen to these; my only experience with active monitors is with ADAM Audio, which I thought are quite astonishing for their size. I really like their tweeter a lot, but that's probably because I own a pair of Dali Euphonia MS5’s with a similar albeit hybrid tweeter. Just my cup of tea. But, back to Genelec; I found this:

https://www.musictech.net/2017/11/genelec-the-ones-review/

Eric, thanks for the review link. I learned a lot more about the 8341 since I haven't read this review before. Like their Scandinavian brothers, I hear Dali has a great reputation. I think that company was founded by the same guy as Lyngdorf-Steinway.
Hi, will get back to you on this thread when I had the opportunity to try the 8341 which I hope to be able to do in a month time. They might be the best buy around 4-5 K$. I believe 8 feet would do fine, but remember they're made for near-field listening, which is about 2-4 feet.
those are super high quality speakers, but based on my own experiences with JBL LSR 305 - an admittedly lesser speaker with corresponding lower price - i would not ask a near-field to do room filling duty.... get something bigger.... you lose the detail, the timber and texture when you put these near-field monitors into a bigger space.... the sweet spot really is closer to your ears...
Hi Gosta, thanks for the info. Looking forward to your review. I wish they would add SAM to their G series. However, that 2-4 ft guidance for near field monitors is what kept me from buying the 8341s. John Darko's website has a review, and his room is 16x19ft, but it's not clear the actual listening distance from the speaker.

https://darko.audio/2018/02/genelecs-the-ones-8341-think-inside-the-box/


canibefrank you make some great points here. I don't know enough about speaker tech to understand how a bookshelf for home use like a KEF LS50W and many other small cabinets active and passive can fill the room. Then a studio monitor, similar in size, is only really recommended for near field.
I believe with the SAM system you are able to increase the listening distance without loosing too much. Also remember that genelec has a lot of other models, also with SAM, for mid- and far-field listening.I'm really interested in the 8341s because they might be perfect for my desk-top system. I have plenty of active monitors, but for some time I've returned to passive near-fields (small Diapason and Westlake monitors + small REL sub).I also use the active Unity Boulder mk2 that is a beast for all listening distances :-). That's the one the 8341 will have to beat...
There's quite a difference between active speakers designed for home use (such as the Devaliet or KEF LS50W) and studio monitors. Studio monitors are specifically designed for mixing and are extremely neutral, but with that comes some lack of "joie de vivre", just plain boring.

I'm not saying the the Genelec's won't sound good, they most definitely will, but I'm not too convinced you'd like to listen to them hours on end year after year.

On the other hand, active studio monitors in a HT works quite ok.
I'm very interested in experiences from audiophiles with these genelecs. Particularly in their capability to convey the tone of the instruments, and how they perform with female voices. I want to upgrade my Proac 1sc+Valve amp (20W class A) for near field listening, and I don't find anything at 5-6k this the level of engineering of these Genelecs. On the passive models, I'm considering as well the Revel M126Be.

I owned some Genelec 8020, which were terrible at low volume levels, and because of that I replaced them for the Proac 1Sc. However these 8331/8341/8351 seem to be in another league. 


“...wow one of them is 111db efficiency.”

I think that dB number refers to how loud they can be played not efficiency or sensitivity. Those metrics are somewhat moot as the speakers are active.
Here’s some information about their in-room performance.
https://www.genelec.com/sites/default/files/media/Studio%20monitors/Catalogues/genelec_monitors_in-r...
Well, with qualified pro monitors you get the truth, For me that's not boring. Be prepared that some of your favourites will not sound as nice as before. But the good ones will sound even better. That includes female voices :-) Generally I don't find active speakers made for home listening that interesting. They actually tend to sound a bit boring. Like the active LS50.(which I got). Naturally also prospeakers differ. Some are made to reveal all too much of the mistakes in a mix. Those should be avoided for listening. They are a working tool. Geithain, Amphion, PMC, ATC are examples of other very well regarded pro brands. New brands to look for are Kii and Dutch & Dunn. 
I’m running a set of the 8341’s on my desk and couldn’t be happier.  The SAM functionality works well (took a lot of the mid mud out for my room).  As others have said, they are honest monitors...crap in, crap out.  One thing that impressed me the most was the amount of solid, tight bass they put out.
@strojo 
very good to hear. how do you find their imaging capability since they are what audiophiles tend to appreciate - a point source (with power and bass capacity).
@gosta


https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/Directivity/Genelec%208351A/images/Plots/Horizontal/Genelec%208351A%2....

A lot of nearfield monitors do have more limited dispersion but if you look at the Genelec The Ones lineup like the 8351 you can see the dispersion of the system is better than even passive home theater speakers with coaxial drivers like Kefs.

These speakers should have no issues at all for even home theater use.
@gosta   what transport are you using to feed the Gennis?. A DDC with AES or some DAC?.

Best
Post removed 
@cortes
Don't have theGen 8341 yet. On top of my try list when I return home in a couple of weeks. For my final near-field setup... Do have e.g the JBL LSR 4326/4328/4312sp with AES input so interested in that. Aldo thought of buying the small Neumann KH80 with AES input. Is there maybe a streamer with AES output to find or do you need some pro studio DDC inbetween?The Gen 8351 model now seems to be able to find for the same cash as the 8341. Would they be too large for near-field? Like 2-4 feet listening distance.
@jeffersondavis
thanks for your info.
@gosta,

here's a list of  DDC & streamers with AES output worth considering (for cost reasons) for me:

-Sinxger SU-1/SU-6
-Mutech MC3
-Metrum Ambre
-Gustard U16
-pi2design 502dac (AES)

out of these, I'm mainly interested in the new  DDCs:  Gustard U16 and the upcoming Sinxger SU-6.  

According to my readings, for near-field the models to go are the 8341&8341. They can be used closer than 1 meter keeping the point source coherence.  

In my case, I'm mainly interested in the smallest 8331, because I just want low listenning volumes in a small room, and the price gap with the 8341 is high.


As per the 8351, it cost the same as the 8341, in spite of the size  and SPL, because it is older and uses  a less sophisticated DSP and probably amps.  



@cortesThanks for much valuable info.

Elac new digital products may be of interest.
Alchemy DMP-1 has AES/EBU output.
Combine with Alchemy DDP-1?


@cortes How about a streamer recommendations with optical output? Not to derail the active speaker discussion, but after all we need to feed these speakers some content. I am expecting my Bryston BDP Pi tomorrow. I couldn’t handle the whole Raspberry Pi thing. So bought it pre made and the Bryston apparently has VU meters. My main criteria was Roon endpoints with optical. I gave up on MQA.


Sorry he's a better link:

https://www.princeton.edu/3D3A/Directivity/Genelec%208351A/

You can see the vertical directivity of the Genelec is crazy good. Speaker height won't be as sensitive as many speakers.
@gosta  Imaging is very good (if not excellent).  I upgraded from the Focal SoloBe6 nearfields and there was a significant improvement across all criteria, especially with SAM enabled.  The Genelec’s aren’t cheap...but they are worth the price.
@rohanstevens 
you only need a streamer with AES/EBU output to feed the Gen. Like the proposed above. DAC is built in. The same for a lot of other moderna pro monitors. The Elac has roon capacity. Or did you mean something else?
Hi Gosta. Sorry I should have been clearer. I was asking more broadly for active speakers with optical inputs. I don't have an AES input. Yes, no DAC is needed, which makes looking for good network streamers harder to find that include Roon. I am currently using Chromecast Audio and it drops/cuts out audio with  96 khz files despite having mine rigged to ethernet. Apparently it's a software issue with CCA. Which means I can't connect a CCA as a Roon endpoint. So I need Roon built in.
To Cortes:
My pair of Revel M126Be are breaking in now, currently with about 150 hours of music. You mention a 20 Watt amp, and I have a 12 Watt Valvet E2 which has enough power for about 90% of my listening. I am also breaking in the speakers with a new Wyred 4 Sound ST-750LE which uses the newest IceEdge chipset.

Audio components need to have two attributes: ultimate resolution and linearity in that resolution from bass to treble. The Revels seem to have both. Check 'em out.

Happy listening!
Have listened to the smaller Genelecs 8331 for an hour at a dealer (listening room) with the room correction active and at a distance of 1,30 meter.
They are a little more hifi-ish than I expected. Warm sound, tries to play more bass than they should which means the red light comes on before you want it to. Detailed sure, but did not hear the ultimate resolution I was hoping for (maybe due to too much bass overpowering the mids). Will remove them from my wish list because for this money you want to immediately feel that they are a must. I'm looking for a more pro sound and so far much prefer my active Unity Audio Boulders mk2. They are monsters - a little big though. I'm sure the 8341 is a better buy. Just my humble and perhaps much too quick opinion. 
Should also say that the imaging and 3d soundstage was stellar. Could not wish for better. And certainly the bass should be able to get more precise in your room with manual dsp corrections. Just felt they didn't give me anything more than what I already got - besides the small size.
But there are also neumann KH80 for much lesser money if you want something really small with digital input and a dsp correction system.
@gosta,

great to know from you first hand experience.  The 8331 were driven digitally or with some DAC?. 

I've been looking at the specs of your  Unity Audio Boulders MKII, and truly they are monsters. To find something better, you'll probably need some big package, at the very least the 8341, as you mentioned, or some big active ATC. 


@gosta

I think one of the advantages of something like the Genelec 8331 is that you can run your own target curve with the room correction software they have.

With a speaker that has uniform dispersion like the Genelecs EQ should affect the sound uniformly around the room rather than at just 1 measuring location. Whereas with speakers that have directivity issues EQ at the measurement location can mean a worse response somewhere else.
Please note that my first impression of the Genelecs 8331 was a quick one, not in my room and not set up by me. So if you are interested in these don't let my words scare you away. But I do mean that the 8341s is probably the one's you should try to if you like me want the possibility to crank the volume up sometimes and/or you will be sitting further away from the monitors.

@ sesdiamond 
After some manual setting I may very well be able to control the bass to my liking. However, I read that the GLM software does only small adjustments and you can't do that many manual corrections. I'm used to room correction systems like Lyngdorf, Arc2, Antimode 2.0, Sonarworks and have them for cleaning up the bass/mid. Unfortunately I find that, to my hearing, they all present to much low bass after calibration. Fine bass but to much! I read somewhere that Lyngdorf actually admits this and say that their in-built correction curve "Open" is the flat one. With the correction active I thought the Genelecs played so heavy bass that you didn't really hear the the mids (I'm exaggerating, but....). Not the bass I want and for this money I want it to be very close to perfect from start.

@cortes 
Nice looking up my speakers! Bought them from a studio in London last year when they moved further up to the Kii three. Bought them instead of Genelec 1037a SAM. Not sure I made the right decision, but the Gen's were too big. I mean it's a desk top system :-). Amongst others I have the ATC 150 ASL for main system. Havn't compared the Boulders and the ATC side-by-side but they are not too far away. Need an Antimode 2.0 to control the bass from the Boulders, otherwise it will overpower my working room. Also to clean up the bass/mid. Works fine. 

I don't have the Genelec SAM monitors, rather the 8040B's first hand. Very pleasing experience and quite satisfied with them, it would be interesting to see what differences one could hear (if better) when it comes to the Genelec 8351's but I don't know, certainly the 8040s are a lot cheaper and worth the money.