Do expensive ethernet cables improve sound quality?


Please refer to: 
https://audiobacon.net/2019/11/02/the-jcat-signature-lan-a-1000-ethernet-cable/amp/#commentform

This can of worms might be ugly...but I'm curious - like the cable brand.

Tell me what you think...
7504ed1a 1fd4 440c ae3d 83599a6ac1f6mastering92
Worthless info. Unless the cables are listened to with  ears not the eyes and ears and the sound level matched it's just another audiophile blabbing. 
Expensive? No. Not necessarily. Good? Yes. By definition.
NO! The reviewer is just a shiller. With his imagination he can have a good career as a fiction writer!
LOL, BUST out laughing.. Rolling on the floor.. Me the dog the rabbit and the goat ALL said "HUH". There are quite a few 0 and 1s missing.. This is not the electrical grid you can clean up with a filter. This is where the 1s and 0s are either here or there. Plane and simple.. Once you get the 1s and 0s I’m sure there is some way to screw that up. TONE through a binary cable. I’m an old wore out mechanic, BUT this isn’t just "You need to listen". This it TOTAL BS.. TOTAL ABSOLUTE BS.

The quality of a transfer cable is just that, SPEED yes, distance yes, but tone, and how it SOUNDS, "it sound different" no it doesn’t. Either you get all the information or the packet is resent.. CRC.. There hasn’t been bad digital cable in a LONG LONG time... Cat 4 is GREAT with short enough runs.. 30-50 feet.. 1000.00 for a one meter cable.. BS... Cat 6 or better can't get it done in? How is it getting to your house?

How is a 1000.00 cable going to fix packet loss any better or quicker than the 20 dollar patch cable.. That's right it won't. NOISE? Try plugging it in next time ALL THE WAY.. One of the biggest problems that exist in digital..

1. Plug the cables in ALL THE WAY.
2. Clean the DIRTY CONNECTIONS.
3. Check your newly made cables, don’t assume you did a good job of crimping and attaching the terminal ends..

If your not losing packets your not losing sound..

OUT of the source to the pre amp, YES cables really matter on the analog side..

Puff Puff pass DUDE... or maybe just PASS, thing will make a whole lot better sense..

Like Grand Nagus Zek said "It's like talking to a Klingon" DS9 quote..

Regards
I'm glad to have received the above responses.

Ethernet cables, in theory, should not make a difference in sound quality.

Perhaps there is some true genius on audiogon who will disprove this. Maybe we'll get someone who praises this product: 
https://baybloorradio.com/audioquest-diamond-rje-ethernet-cable

Even at 12M for only $14,299.95 we cannot expect any packet loss. You know, new packets that improve the depth of the recording are likely transmitted by that bulky thing on the cable. What if the OSI model is wrong?! 

AudioQuest will have to take over the IEEE; by teaching them the sacred craft of making flawless ethernet cables for use with digital audio. How nice of them to offer such a premium cable...I wonder what their next big product will be.
Expensive Ethernet cables will definitely improve the sound, if you strongly believe they should.  It is placebo effect - nothing wrong with it (if it lasts)  :)
If you spend enough and believe they do, they will.  I won't and don't, but what do I know.

Former Network Engineer
Excellent!  @jcarcopo APSTNDP! 

Maybe someone at AQ will provide me with the magical explanation I am seeking...


I sent an email:

Even at 12M for only $14,299.95 we cannot expect any packet loss. You know, new packets that improve the depth of the recording are likely transmitted by that bulky thing on the cable. What if the OSI model is wrong?!

All very relevant questions. I think maybe AudioQuest knows something that the IEEE doesn't about making superior cables.

Let me know.
They don't need to be expensive. Just try Supra 8+ @ $50/meter. Much better than Monoprice 5e or Cable Matters 8 @ $10/meter, the two I've tried. If you have not tried them in your system, you'll never know if they make a difference or not. All wire matters, give it a shot.
I am sure a better cable makes a difference just as all better quality cables do but i am sure you do not need to spend 1000 on one to get the same result.
Supra was better than whatever I got in the box with Asus router. Got it on ebay. And put well shielded power cord on the computer - big difference, both audio and video. Doesn't have to be expensive at all, I got mine for $15 on ebay, 14 gauge.
A very good quality shielded cable may help but anything from an Audiophile Grade level has to be questionable. I would imagine you can get very good ones for less than 100 dollars.
Put a filter and a short well shielded cable between the long ethernet link and the server
I ended up installing CAT 7 cables from my Fios box to my router this past winter.
The biggest difference I found is that 6a and 7 utilize a grounding system. I had to buy Telegartner connectors and some tools to install, but I found it to be a learning experience.

Did I hear a difference? 
I can't say.
But, my streaming seems to be much faster.
B
Some reasons why Ethernet cables might matter to audio sound quality from people who are actually designing audio equipment. The factors that can impact sound quality are not the integrity of the digital signal, but the digital and analog noise (i.e., RF) that can creep into the audio signal chain.

Bob Stuart, Meridian Audio: "Of course digital bits-are-bits and with due care, each of the three interfaces (USB, Toslink, coaxial) can deliver the same data at approximately the same time. But the audio we hear is analog and real-world devices are subject to a variety of interferences including data-induced jitter, other process-induced jitter, (and) common- and differential-mode electromagnetic noise. In the ideal world, the data are clocked in by and buffered in the DAC (asynchronous mode) and then de-jittered before conversion. In my experience this can never be perfect, just made closer and closer to irrelevance."


Gordon Rankin (introduced the digital audio world to asynchronous USB transfer)when I transfer a file over USB to an external hard drive it doesn’t make transfer errors – the file at the destination is the same as the source – so why should sending digital audio over USB be any different? https://darko.audio/2016/05/gordon-rankin-on-why-usb-audio-quality-varies/

@calvinandhobbies Exactly...you’ve hit the nail on the head with that post.

I hope to eventually understand why AQ is charging over 14K for an ethernet cable. I mean, I know it's hogwash, but I’d like an explanation from someone who works there.

It’s funny cause when AQ released some of their first products, those were reasonably-priced. They seemed to have good intentions. With the ignorance surrounding digital audio in general, they have found a way to make serious money out of those who believe their claims.

So long as we refer to engineering standards, measurements, and actual testimony from folks who tested stuff, we’ll be safe from nonsensical audio products.
+1 on the Supra Cat 8 USB cable as well. I compared the Supra Cat 8 to an AmazonBasics Cat 6 cable and the sonic improvement was immediately evident. Cost-benefit matters to me so I will probably most likely never spend more than this on a USB cable. But going to the Supra was definitely worth the $50 extra cost over the AmazonBasics cable which I also purchased for testing purposes. My plan was to sell the Supra cable if it sounded about the same as the AmazonBasics cable, BUT it sounded quite a bit better.

Differences I notice are:

Benefits that I heard from the cleaner sound from the Supra cable are:
  • More presence to voices and instruments which sound more forward and distinct in presentation
  • Richer tonality
  • Less grain to the sound
  • Better resolution due to a lower noise floor (This is audible when comparing a cleaner signal to one that is less clean)- Easier to follow bass lines- Pace seems faster due to more clarity and better definition to the leading edge of notes.

NOTE: Your listening perceptions may vary from mine. I’m not looking to debate whether my hearing is working.)
@mastering92 Well, I have to say that from my experience, it’s important to actually do some listening to equipment. In this series of videos, Rob Watts, who designed the Chord line of DACs, talks about how he finds it important to do both measuring tests AND listening tests, because everything you can measure is audible, but there is a lot that is not currently measurable in digital audio that is also audible.

Interview with Chord Electronics’ Rob Watts:
https://youtu.be/k9Sp9KCq1B4

I came to similarly interesting results when comparing power cords. Synergistic Research is another company that produce products that some would call snake oil, but I've been testing four power cables with a Denafrips Ares II DAC (a $15 Tripp-Lite Heavy Duty power cable from Home Depot, a $150 Shunyata Venom, a $200 Audience Forte F3, and a $500 Synergistic Research UEF Blue). The Audience cable sounded both harsh and congested. The Shunyata Venom and the $15 Tripp-Lite cable seemed somewhat close in sound quality, but the Synergistic cable was noticeably smoother in sound as well as sounding more detailed. But those differences were perhaps 25% of the sonic improvement of the Supra Cat 8 cable over the the AmazonBasics USB cable.
CAT 8 cables are awesome.

Higher operating frequency + higher theoretical bandwidth + better shielding. I mean, it’s technically superior (in terms of specifications) so I can understand how sonic improvements could be made. The cable is less of a filter and more of a wire from point a to b.

I think you’re just listening to the full potential of your gear by using the CAT 8 vs the CAT 6. I’ve heard of Supra’s being the go-to brand before.

Regarding your note, I’m not here to argue with anyone...nor do I get salty or offensive. At the end of the day, this is an open forum for anyone to express their opinions... I’m no better than the next person lol

I will check out that YouTube link. Thanks
It’s possible that is is the Cat 8 cable architecture. I’m just happy that I got that much improvement for $50. To your point, even if I had $14k to spend, I would expect my audio system to walk on water if I spent $14k on a cable. I do think that there is a point at which "good enough" truly is good enough for me. And my experience shows that point doesn’t need to be too terribly expensive...certainly not at the $1,000+ price point for cables.

@mastering92 I think your comments are more than fair and not at all argumentative. I often include that note when posting my listening impressions for some forum posters that feel the need to attack others that perceive audible differences that they don't.
Cool ! I've posed a question to a YouTube channel owner...

Audiophile Cable TRUTHS: Power Cords - YouTube

My comment should be the most recent if you're seeing it now. "Dillon's Audio" 


It was hard for me to believe that power cords would make a difference, let alone have different sound signatures, but lo and behold, my ears tell me that they do.

To your question about stock power cables. I would consider a power cord to be a way to get more performance out of your existing equipment. Enjoy your equipment as it comes stock & if you get the itch to see if it can sound better, one route for doing so can be getting an aftermarket power cord.
@calvinandhobbes

Sorry, I got your name wrong last time.

What about amplifiers and CD players with inbuilt power cords? (non-removable power cords that go directly to the board and are connected to a power transformer inside the unit.

Are these defective? Should we pull out these stock cords and solder power cables from the cable manufacturer of your choice?
According to bill low, yes ethernet cables make an audible difference.  He has some in his audioquest catalog, and they're very expensive, but they're very good! So he says to take money.
@mastering92,

a kettle power cord can heat your cockles, crank your engine or power your vibrator. When you ask it to shield RFI/EMI or ground level noise it is as useful as a solar panel on a submerged submarine, whether plugged into an IEC connector or directly tethered to a transformer.

The same applies to a poorly shielded ethernet cable of non spec inductance.

Over and out