Drubin,
I have asked previous ownership, to no avail, (people tend to use what is available rather than what may make sense in the morning) why we didn't use the Mark III amp to drive these speakers which are, about 89 db 1W1M in most measuring situations, and also, a benign load...so what's the problem?
Anyway, maybe with the rush for press that's what was there, I really can't excuse it.
But to answer Drubin, the Mark III will drive 1.3 ohms up over 800 Watts per channel before clipping. And these don't present a 'load' of that nature.
Some questions, such as this, have no good answer.
I know I personally like the sound of many amps, but it sure makes more sense to use the DK with DK speakers.
That's how the road show with LSA will happen, I can assure you all that.
Best to all.
Larry R. Staples
DK Design LSA Group LLC
President |
This review shows that when Daniel Khesin said "audio manufacturers run for cover" that he really wasn't kidding. |
Huh? Not sure if I am missing something in the news, but I was not aware of any recent scurrying movement towards sheltered or reinforced real-estate facilities by any audio manufacturer. |
So, has anyone but the PF reviewer heard or seen these speakers? At which upcoming shows can they be heard? |
In a more serious vein, if DK was seeking a superior non resonant material for the speaker chassis, how did choice fall on Aluminum? Aluminum billet rings like a bell when struck. Magnesium for one is a lighter and less resonant metal. More exotic, non metallic materials are used by other manufacturers. One material no one has applied to speakers yet is Pumice, a natural vulcanic glass foam. Extremely light, rigid, and sonically extremely inert. Cannot be used for outer surfaces because of its texture, nevertheless could be used in non exposed load-bearing areas. |
Guido - allow me to take a moment to pay repsctes. I have seen some VERY insightful posts from you on a vast range of topics. You are the audiophile's audiophile! |
Art, I am herewith electronically blushing! |
Guidocorona...Excellent idea to use Pumice. Similar to my suggestion for the foamed metalic material, but a lot less expensive. |
In addition pumice would display no, or negligible, electric conductivity. The disadvantage is that--being essentially a glass foam, it is relatively fragile, and will withstand torque or shearing stresses somewhat poorly. In that a metallic foam would be superior. . . but do we want the entire speaker to conduct electricity? |
Maybe if you infused the pumice with various metals it would increase the structural rigidity of the cabinet allowing it to withstand the torque that is applied. I suggest various metals as I think that light show produced by the cabinets conductivity could be quite interesting and maybe even have multi-colored sparks...what could be better? It would be like the 4th of July every night in your listening room.
You would probably want to listen from a safe distance though. |
Yeah $25k sounds cheep for what they're touting. And it does sound like another "I paid you off, or scratched your back" kind of review. We've read these before.
Time will tell. I'd like to hear too.
Please keep us up to date, anyone who ever gets a chance to hear em though. '
I'd love to hear a speaker sound better than Avantgard trio's, that you can actually hear "off-axis"!..that would be nice |
Has anyone here heard the LSA model 2 speakers yet from DK Design Group? I like to know just how good these $2000 speakers really are...... |
I heard the model 2's at Larry's several times over a 5 month period. Even the first prototype pair I heard looked great and sounded great. Very alive and dynamic, excellent bass and tonal balance top to bottom..I heard these speakers with 3 different amps and 2 different cd players..Last time was with a DK amp and Exemplar CD..Larry's room is maybe a little to live for me to really get a handle on what these speakers are all about. I need to hear them in a more familiar room one that is a little drier in tone..As it stands now these speakers maybe as big a bargain as the DK amp is..Tom |
Theaudiotweak, let us know what you think about the LSA model 2 speakers when you try them out in your system. I was talking to Steven R Rochlin from www.enjoythemusic.com about these speakers and he said, if Larry would like Enjoy the Music to do a review on these speakers then contact him |
If anyone else here has heard the LSA model 2 speakers before, please tell us more about them. |
Tin_cup,
I have a pair sitting patiently in my basement waiting until the day my dedicated listening room is completed and my cables and rack arrive. Once I have everything set up I will give my impressions of the LSA 2s. If they sound anywhere near as good as they look I will be pleased.
You should know that if you do seriously consider any product in the DK/LSA lines you will get first-class advice, support and service from Larry Staples. He has patiently addressed all questions and concerns I have had throughout the process of selecting my system. |
Thanks for the kind words from 'tweak' and Bratschman.
The speakers (even if I did design them) are REALLY good.
They do not sound anything like a monitor loudspeaker. Both models have a 'big' live sound which belies their size.
There is much more to be said, but more is a commercial.
Best,
Larry R. Staples
DK Design/LSA Group
President |
Bratcheman, you are a man with great willpower. I'd have to move those speakers to the garage! I couldn't stand to have a speaker that good sitting in my house and not playing music. I've heard both the LSA 1s and 2s. They are off the chart values and will seriously challenge speakers at several times the price. You will be surprised at how good they will sound, even with an inexpensive amp. It might be worth investing in a used integrated that you could easily re-sell when your system is ready. It may sound like a lot of trouble to buy an amp to get you through in the short term, but you'll understand when you hear the speakers.
I was a DK owner before Larry bought the company, and I have to say that the DK Amp and LSA Speakers are a perfect fit! That stands to reason as the speakers were voiced with that amp. Before I get attacked, I'm not going to make any money no matter what you buy, but my strongest recommendation would be to buy a DK to go with your speakers. Good luck. |
A man with great will power, you say? You have NO idea! I have waited for over twenty years to have the setting to put together an audio system that I could only previously have wished for. A few extra weeks will not put a dent in my enthusiasm! ;-)
I have just taken the plunge and ordered a complete set of cabling from Cerious Technologies, and once I have broken in the system I will post an extensive evaluation.
BTW guys, get my login right, OK? It's Bratscheman (Bratsche is the German word for viola). That's about as much of a rant as you will ever hear from me!! :0
Lewis |
How big are the LSA 2s? Where can I find some specs? Frequency range/ sensitivity etc...
thanks for the Info.
paul |
The size should be on our website, though we are in the process of adding quite a bit, and it may be temporarily off the site.
The size is 39"High. The width in the front of the speaker is 8" widening to 9 1/4" then tapering to 6" at the rear.
The depth is 16 1/4 inches, not counting the binding posts.
Thanks for the interest.
Best,
Larry |
>>>>BTW guys, get my login right, OK? It's Bratscheman<<<<
not gonna make friends quickly here with that 'tude |
Of course, a much more erudite moniker would be Brazzaman, from the original Italian Brazza, standing for 'viola da Brazzo', then 'viola da braccio' in more modern guises. the German 'Bratche' is but a typical transalpine translitteration. But Essentially, Ellery's observation is correct. . . and, by the way, welcome back Ellery. . . did you stop driving at the edge of the Pacific? |
Or "Bratwurstman", which has nothing to do with the viola, but may make the girls (or guys if you prefer) fantasize more about you when the surf Audiogon looking for eligible bachelors who obsess about all things audio!
Marco |
|
Very good point JAX2, in fact the aforementioned brazza, was thusly called for being held by the 'brazzo' or arm in vernacular Italian, as opposed to the 'viola da gamba', to be held on or among one's legs. This was also called simply 'gamba' in the English world, or 'gambe' [pron: gambeh] in the Transalpine milieu. Interestingly enough, the variant 'gambo' was never used, where 'voila da gambo' would have meant viola for the stem, probably because this particular term also is often used with the same delightful metaphorical connotations as the otherwise nutritious Bratwurst. Even more so, even though anatomically more precise, 'viola da coscia' [pron: cosha] or thigh viola' was also never adopted, as the sexual association is even more at the surface in most languages. But in some alternate reality the Rose Consort is probably now playing on 'Coscias' while German Early Music bands fiddle on the Kosche or the cosche. Hence in this alternate world Koschenman would make a very brave moniker. I should really contact Dr. Harry Turtledove, master of alternate histories. |
Larry, they talking about your LSA model 2 speakers over on these forums too www.hometheatertalk.com , avsforum.com , www.audiocircle.com , www.audioasylum.com , www.audioreview.com |
>> >>
what could possibly be the point of this post other than to "point" the other readers towards other sites so they can read more about Larry's speakers.
but hey...who am I to say anything (yes...you may all jump on me now and copy this quote and then post "exactly" after it. But...why not email Larry directly if Larry is the one that you are pointing this out to.
sorry...gotta run...need to get some dakiom stablizers and bybee fuses quick.
Larry?...you there?...you catching my drift? I have a list already written of who's gonna jump me now...unless of course even more people sign up as members so they may rag on me for pointing out the obvious...at least obvious to me and many others. |
Ellery911, I think there are some folks who have and continue to post about DK products in a manner that will draw critics to accuse DK of (or continuing to) use sockpuppets to promote their products, thereby damaging their business. This just cannot be so, Larsky (Larry Staples) is just too clever to orchestrate something so worn and apparent to even the casual reader. Besides, I looked at the LSA speaker on the DK site - it sure is pretty. :-) |
Has anyone yet heard the X-Dreams? Are they really as fantastic as described in the review or was it all just talk and no action? |
I had a chance to see the X-Dreams, they are a reality. Larry Staples invited me over to hear the latest version of the LSA 2 speakers and I also had a chance to audition the DK amp again. Very musical and affordable combination. Great look and feel. They do have my respect and require further audition in my own home and space for me to comment any more. The X-Dreams were in for a photo shoot so I did not have an option to listen. They are killer in in construction quality as well as looks. Maybe in late January I will be given a chance to hear some of these products in my own listening room with my own racks platforms and cables. Tom |
Honestly, I can't wait to hear them. Visually the X-Dreams make a perfect match with Boulder monoblocks. I bet sonically too. With the financing option that DK was offering I may be able to swing it in 2006. |
Will they be showing them at CES? |
I just got an email from Larry Staples and yes they intend to show the X-Dream at the CES but they will not have them hooked up and playing. This is crazy! This has got to be the biggest tease every perpetrated on the audiophile community. |
I just got an email from Larry Staples and yes they intend to show the X-Dream at the CES but they will not have them hooked up and playing. This is crazy! This has got to be the biggest tease every perpetrated on the audiophile community. I disagree, this was the biggest tease to the audiophile community. :o) |
Tireguy, good point :-)
On the other hand, the review in PFO came out about six months ago, which says the X-Dream was under development for over a year. Is it a finished product, and if so, why not play them? They look interesting on paper, but the proof is in the listening. |
Tireguy,
Can't you see past the jugs? Besides in Las Vegas there are many more jugs like that. |
And what's become of Gilmore? Are they still around? |
AudioAri1, if only these things were 'jug'-based, I'd be the first in line to buy them. At least they'd be based on something 'tangible' and definitely enjoyable. |
I just got an email from Larry Staples and yes they intend to show the X-Dream at the CES but they will not have them hooked up and playing.
Huh???
|
Guidocorona are you saying that being 'tangible' more or less makes them a reality? Or should we be asking if they are silicon based and are considered 'tangible' should they even be considered a reality..Tom |
Tom, I actually prefer purely carbon-based, auto-hooking, self-playing and. . . most eminently and concretely 'tangible' 'jugs' and jug-generating systems. |
Speaking of which...
In Vegas one year, I was with a group of guys doing the WCES.
A friend and I were waiting for the rest of the guys to show up to go to dinner, as we stood on the perimeter of one of the many casinos.
Up walks a young woman in a business suit, name badge and a briefcase. As a fleeting thought, when she approached us, I thought she might ask for 'directions' to a restaurant or whatever--happens all the time.
She came face to face with us and said, "Would you gentlemen like some company for the evening?"
This was totally out of context for that moment, so I said, "Excuse me?" She repeated, "Would you gentlemen like some company for the evening?"
I can't remember, but it seems that I stammered, "Uh, no thanks."
Las Vegas--what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas...until the blood tests prove otherwise.
Larry |
OK, some 3 years later, I can inform you, that, there is no evidence that Positive Feedback heard the speakers...and further that as Owner/Founder of LSA who purchased DK Designs and wrapped them into the umbrella of LSA Group, the the speakers in question, never really existed, therefore the review had to have been a complete fabrication...a complete fabrication.
I tried on numerous occassions to speak to "Jimmy Olson", the reviewer, and he never would respond to me.
I analysed the speakers on gaining access to them, and found that they had never been completed--which is to say they were NEVER attached to a crossover...of course the principal ingredient in making sound.
My evaluation, as Owner and Founder of LSA Group, which purchased all assets of DK Design, is that these speakers were never played for the public...ever. It was impossible to have done so...as no crossover was ever designed, until I did so several months later.
This is the worst example of deception that I have come across in the audio industry. I supposedly 'magnigicant' speaker, which never really existed.
Having said that...I selected drivers, crossover points, and made calculations after the fact...and created the 'best loudspeaker' I have ever heard...at any price. It was a purely magnificant product...though only one ever existed. This, my friends is the whole unabashed truth.
Larry R. Staples
LSA Group Founder |
Holy Back from the dead thread!
Thank you Larry for enlightening us as to the speaker. I did however get to converse via email with Mr. Olsen, the reviewer you mentioned, as well as the reviewer of DK's next speaker creation, the successor to the X-dream. I talked with 2 actual owners, however I was never given a chance to hear the speaker, on the many occasions I tried, while visiting in Florida. There was always some some problem getting an audition, then complete silence from the manufacturer after many attempts. |
I responded last night, well...at 4:14am this morning, privately. Now, I'll elaborate on my last email.
He stated:
"I talked with 2 actual owners, however I was never given a chance to hear the speaker..."
Again, there are no multiple owners. The cabinets were subcontracted to an aerospace design firm, and only ONE pair of cabinets was ever made, and the XDREAM, later LSA10 was discontinued in Feb. 2007. (See LSA's Website)
Upon purchasing the 'assets' of DK Design, I contacted the company which had done the aluminum work for the speakers, (that was their sole task)only to find out that the speakers were being held, until the significant invoice for their work was paid, a 'mechanic's lien' if you will.
I had many lengthy conversations with this company and then obtained their files which clearly showed that only one pair existed...no second gunman, for those who suspect anything else.
After paying their invoice, I, along with John Tucker of Exemplar, who I had hired to head up engineering, examined the cabinets. It was then that we discovered that there was simply no way ANYONE had ever heard these speakers. One example, there was no pathway for wires, no way for a crossover to have ever been placed inside, OR even outside the cabinets. No binding posts, it goes on like this. We were pretty stunned to say the least.
It was then that John began to work to select the best crossover components available, and I selected the drivers for the speakers. BTW, the 'photos' of the speakers, were computer generated, no actual drivers were ever in the cabinets! So I selected among the very best drivers from all over the globe (subjective, but I had very specific requirements as to the crossover points as well as the slopes that I wanted to employ, and these drivers were the best for that particular crossover and slope).
After the crossovers were complete, John came to Louisville, and we assembled them in my home.
The crossovers were enormous, given that the air core inductors, to name one part, were huge... HUGE.
After several hundred hours of playing, they began to sound as they ultimately would, which is to say, again the 'best' I have ever heard.
We took them to Denver, to the Rocky Mountain Audiofest in October of that year. Those who heard them early on, were impressed, but not blown away. The issue was that we were using an amp which was, while excellent, completely underpowered for driving this loudspeaker. Later in the show, we switched to the Statement LSA Amplifier and the sound was remarkable.
I hope that this puts this saga to bed.
I am still waiting, some two years plus later, to hear from Jimmy Olsen of Positive Feedback about his 'review', but he has yet to return any of my (then) frantic emails. Who knows, maybe he's out with Lois Lane or Clark.
Best,
Larry R. Staples
|
Do the Polymer Audio speakers, raved by Jim Olson of PF, exist? The speaker was designed "under the vision and direction" of the same individual from DK Audio, Daniel Khesin. Price is the same as the X-Dream, $25K.
http://www.positive-feedback.com/Issue34/polymer_logic.htm |
Seems to me that it is just another 'enclosed speaker' with an exotic price tag that went as easily as it came. |
