2. amps-preamps
  3. 169435-165413

Deciding if I like Class D.

I recently purchased Goldenear 1R towers. I was powering them with my Oultlaw 770 initially. I’ve also used a 350 wpc McIntosh a friend owns.. I realize the Outlaw is not audiophile grade, but it’s actually better than most give credit for.  Anyway...

Even though the built in subs are powered, the towers still benifet from a good amount of power, up to 650 rated, so I have been on a quest to find the right amp.

I purchased a set of Hypex Ncore NC1200 Monoblocks with custom buffer boards, and it came with Sparkos 2590s Opamps as per my request. The Goldenears are slightly forward, and I was told Sparkos was the way to go because the were warmer in presentation .

So, I let the amp break in, playing it when I wasn’t home at 85 to 95 DBs for a few days, and gave it some good material to assess it.

I was immediately disenchanted, because the amps sounded very dull, and the highs were rolled off considerably. When compared to the A/B amp the D was not pleasing to my ears. My hearing is slightly diminished from combat, but the A/B was much more detailed.

So I called the company that made amp, and he was very polite and helpful. He sent out a set of Weiss OP2 and Sonic Imagery 990 opamps,to see if I preferred the sound characteristics. Well, the difference was significant.

I am using a Marantz 8805 preamp in pure direct mode . Using BlueOs Streamer, using both optical, and a analog outputs for the testing.. Analog is required to get the MQA files to give full resolution.

To me, the Sparkos just killed the sound. I could honestly see why reviewers would say the treble in particular, was not musical. If I had to live with that sound, I would not..

The Sonic 990 was much better. Much more detailed, better sound stage, just better overall.. Then, I tried the Weiss. Well, that was another level altogether. It sounded like the McIntosh, perhaps better in some regards, but to be honest, it takes a lot time and A-B testing to really be sure. None the less, after hearing the Weiss, it was obvious that they were superior to everything else.

So, I called the manufacturer to let him know my findings, and he said, well, I should give the Sonic 990 another try. I asked why. He said the Weiss would add over 600 dollars for the two pair over the Sparkos and Sonic Imagery.

So, that would bring this setup to over 3100 for the pair. And I could buy a ’good’ high power A/B for that used or even new.

I’ve read a lot of opinions on this forum, and I know the consensus is that D is good, but not great. I know people usually defend what they own, so I needed to hear it for myself. Without a basis of comparison, I’d probably never know the difference, but to be honest, aside from the Hypex getting much louder, and without any audible distortion, I really think the A/B *may* still be more musical, but dammit, I’m not 100% sure. It’s subtle at best.

After hearing the Weiss Opamps, I’d not be satisfied with anything else, but with them, the price is commensurate to A/B.

I’d really appreciate your input on this subject..

BTW, I have purposely left out the company I bought it from, because I think component wise, they are all pretty similar,and I don’t want to start any BS.

I will say though, at the end of the day, the op amps make-or-break the amplifier.

Thank you
Rick




knowitall
erik_squires
15,647 posts
 
Listened to several as mentioned on,this dead horse subject.
A. A/B, even H is better. Devialet, Rowland, NAD, all this class D is fine, as they are lighter and smaller, but there is something missing, mids, highs, depth of bass kick drum.
If you have concluded D is the best because YOU dumped a huge cash chunk on class D amps, so they must be good.


Really hard to tell if you are serious by such broad statements. Can you give us a specific Class D amp and specific A/B you felt it was inferior to, and exactly by what manner?

BTW, I’m not challenging anyone’s personal experience, but rather that to get to understanding we can’t draw such broad strokes. I can think of a number of Class D and A/B amps that sound better to me than some Class A amps. That doesn’t mean I’m throwing out Class A as inferior, so lets do the same the other way too.

I can also think of some A/B amps that were the equal to some Class D.
jnds
8 posts
 
“I’ve read a lot of opinions on this forum, and I know the consensus is that D is good, but not great.”

STOP!

Generalizations about Class D are stupid, especially when the opinion is formed based on one or two samples. Even worse are those who express an opinion who have never heard even a single sample. 

Class D is like any other Class / topology. There are good and great and not so great examples of every design approach. I’ve been in this game long enough to have owned many different amplifiers over the years. And although I have owned more tube than SS amps, they all have one thing in common in that they all vary quite a bit even among their own kind, especially in terms of musicality.

Some tube amps, regardless of the tube and topology sound like refuse for the toilet. Same thing with the various SS amps that have passed through my hands over the years. OTOH some were outstanding and some were pretty good. The point is there isn’t any one Class, design approach or topology that is inherently better or more musical than another.
jnds
8 posts
 
I just read the thread and I see others have already made the same point, so hopefully the above message is clear now.
georgehifi's avatar
georgehifi
10,312 posts
 

The measurements and graphs from the manufacturer don't lie Eric, as you are doing and accuse others of doing.

The fact is there plain and simple from the PDF data sheet from the manufacturer themselves, which I also measured to satisfy myself, and if you can't handle that then that's too bad, you need therapy 🤦‍♂️
cakyol's avatar
cakyol
940 posts
 
If you like what you hear, buy the class D. It will most likely be much much more efficient, smaller and lighter to carry around.  Everything else being equal, those are definite advantages. 
Having said that, be aware that if the power supplies are SMPS types, they may be less reliable.  Reputable A/B amps last a long time. I dont quite know about the very long term reliability and longevity of class D's. 
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