If you are talking about the new MOBILE FIDELITY Silver series reissue, I do not hear that on my copy. |
The way the Lisa's voice is recorded and processed it's can cause some speakers to sound peaked, excited or resonant. The higher the volume the more likely the problem.
Be sure to double check your turntable and cartridge set up, anything wrong there (even slightly off tracking force) can make the problem worse.
Unlike Mofimadness I have not heard the reissue but would assume it's at least as good as the 4AD and I have no problem with the original.
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Yeah, Lisa's voice is great but quite cold and abstract. Even speakers perceive it. Brendan is the heart and mind of DCD. |
I have heard that the Mofi is very good. I'd love to have the 4AD but this title commands some big prices. Guess I'll "settle" for the mofi. ;-) |
This is probably a cartridge/arm Compliance issue. I had the same problem with a stone Koetsu, when I used the standard counterweight on the arm. When I put the heavier counterweight the song on the a.m. LP was flawless, no tracking issues at all.
If you know your arm mass, check the compliance with the Cartridge Resonance Evaluator on the VinylEngine.
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good input from everyone, thanks. for the record, I have a Rega P5 with an ortofon 2M black cartridge, not yet broken in (about 25hours on it) all fed through a Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum int amp with MM onboard phono pre amp. I will check the cart compliance to arm weight and post as I have no idea what is ideal. Was told by Music Direct, that the 2M black was a great cart for the RB 700 arm, but no detials regarding compliance. |
I have both the 4AD and the new MoFi Silver pressing, and do not hear what the OP is reporting, on my copy.
I think the MoFi is pretty close to "as good as" the original 4AD. In my listening to both in the last few days, I think there may be a little more deep bass in the Mofi.
Have any of you bought "Spiritchaser" from Mofi as well? |
I have "SpiritChaser", but haven't had a chance to listen to it yet. |
Have played mine a few times and I'm not getting any of the distortion your talking about through my system. Love both this record and recording. |
Interesting update to this...........I have taken my copy to 2 different audio systems and heard it on both, one to a lesser degree, but it was heard by myself and the other listeners.....very strange?? Possible bad pressing? I have no idea due to my lack of experience, but as an experiment, I am purchasing another copy of Dead Can Dance (I know it's silly) just to see if it's audible on the new copy as well. |
I recently picked up that same recording, and have a very similar issue with just that track. Everything else sounds fantastic, but on that particular song distortion appears in the left channel during the loudest dynamic peaks of the vocals. Jimbojrjb, I look forward to hearing what you discover with a new copy. |
Abchand, that is the very same issue I was hearing..........specifically in the left channel. I am waiting for my new copy to arrive and will post when I have an update. |
I am new to vinyl but I had a similar issue with a couple of Radiohead issues from Capitol records. There were others who had experiences similar to mine and a friend experienced in vinyl told me it was most likely (non-fill???). I think this is condition where the vinyl does not fill all of the grooves of the stamper and leaves a "pocket" in the LP groove that causes distortion particularly in louder passages.
Jimbojrjb, your experience sounds very similar to this. |
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Jimbojrjb, did you ever get a second copy for comparison? And insight would be much appreciated if you happen to check back on this thread. |
Sorry for the very late response here........we moved and my new pressing is on its way. I will update shortly |
Reading this post made me dig out my old original Dead Can Dance Albums. They are all state of the art in vinyl recording production. They are dead quiet, clearly recorded with tube equipment...that's not to say they are rolled off. The little percussion tings, and things are as real sounding as I've ever heard. There is absolutely no telltale signs of mistracking on any of the records...no matter how loud Lisa 's chanting is recorded. It makes you wonder why the art of recording has plummeted so. Listen to the new Norah Jones album or the Paul Simon album....so disappointing... |
Most likely, it's not the recording, as I know exactly to what you are referring. I've heard it on multiple systems - both from an analog pressing and multiple digital copies (original release and the MoFi re-release).
I don't hear it on my current system, and for that I am thankful. |
Find a good copy of one of these test records: (http://www.ebay.com/itm/LP-SHURE-PHONO-CARTRIDGE-TRACKABILITY-TEST-RECORD-NEW-/350505083217?pt=Music_on_Vinyl&hash=item519bbb2151) (http://www.audiophileusa.com/item.cfm?record=81920&c=1&kw=Accessory) (http://www.elusivedisc.com/prodinfo.asp?number=CLELP43039) I own the first two I listed, and a couple others that are no longer available. They are very useful tools. I'll bet you find that your stylus is mistracking, at the higher groove modulation levels. When Sheffield Labs came out with their 'Growing Up in Hollywood Town' direct to disc; some complained of mistracking, when Amanda McBroom hit some of the same notes as the violins, on the cut, 'Amanda'. Mine never did, but- I heard the distortion on a couple other systems. It was ugly! |
But what is odd is that I hear the same distortion on an intirely different system at my dealer with this pressing as well. Could both carts be mistracking?? What are the odds? |
Actually- the odds are pretty good, if the groove modulation is high enough. BTW- Do you have your VTF set toward the high or low end, of your cart's range? |
I have no idea. The arm is relatively parallel, with maybe a 2 degree tip forward at the most. |
Well now I have 2 copies of this record and I still have the same isssue in the same spot on both records and have checked this on a third table/system. I also checked with the closest Rega dealer and with my cart (Ortofon 2M Black) I should have 3ea shims under the RM700 arm, which I do and that is the optimal VTA for that arm and that cartridge. I also checked the alignment again, and all is nearly perfect. I am at a loss here! |
Hi Jimbojrjb,
I had the same issue you have on the same songs on the same album plus on one other album on one song. Possibly maybe on more albums but not discovered by me. Used 2 different copies of the Mofi "Into the Labrynth" too. Same thing.
The issue was related to my phonostage. Same issue was there with the same phonostage at my dealer. They called the manufacturer and they said it was a known issue in some customers systems and a free fix was available. My cartridge puts out .8MV The issue described to me was with the "input sensitivity" and it could be adjusted. It was related not to loudness issues of the signal but with "large macrodynamic swings" of the signal. Perhaps a lower output cartridge would have been fine. I am only a consumer of audio products and do not have technical knowledge of how these things work.
Well anyways this took care of things pretty much however, it is just barely, barely present on "The Wind That Shook The Barley" and eliminated on the other album.
The phonostage is Nagra BPS, my cartridge is Clearaudio Da Vinci V2. Drove me crazy for awhile.
Thank you
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I have tried 2 different systems with 2 different phono preamps. Not sure that is the problem, but I do appreciate the feedback. |
I talked at length to the guys at Needle Doctor and Accoustic Sounds and both agreed it's an allignment issue. I'm only using a one point allignment that came with the Rega, which is minimal. Any thoughts on some inexpensive two point allignment protractors?? How about the Wally Tractor??? |
Rodman, Sorry I thought you were asking about the VTA, so my confusion came through. The VTF is 1.5 which is what Ortofon recommends for the 2M Black, but should I try heavier or lighter?? |
Actually; the range for your Black, is 1.4 to 1.7G, so- you can try .2 more VTF, without exceeding the recommendations. Further- the Shibata stylus is very sensitive to VTA and Rake Angle adjustments. Does your table's arm allow for those? I'd still suggest obtaining a test record, and judging the cart's performance or making adjustments, via the tracking test cuts(controlled and accurate). |
Have you played that same track from a digital source to make sure it's your analog front-end?
I've listed to that track on many systems that have exhibited that distortion (on that track) you describe. I used to think the source of the issue was my front end. Then I used to think it was my speakers. After hearing that same distortion on multiple systems, I thought it was in inherent in the recording. With my current system, that distortion doesn't exist at all. So I'm at a loss.
My comments may not help you determine what is causing your issues, but hopefully it helps you determine what is not causing it. |
I do have a CD copy and the distortion does not exist there, only on the analog LP. However, with that said, it appears on 3 different systems. I can adjust VTA with the Rega provided shims, but it fixed at 2mm per shim. I tried one, now I have 2 which raises the tonearm 4mm from the plinth. I have a pretty good magnifying lense that I use to visually look at the stylus and the rake angle seems to be tipped very slightly forward, not by much though. I've read where this is optimal for the 2M Black. The allignment is as perfect as I can achieve with both the Rega supplied protractor and the Geodisc I purchased.
I know I a being fanatical about this as this is the ONLY record in my entire collecion that has this issue, but it's driving me nuts. And I should clarify, it's very minimal, but audible enough to where I hear it and want to figure this out.
I really appreciate all the helpfull tips and welcome any additional tips.
I'm not giving up on this one! |
Update, I talked to Chad at Acoustic Sounds and he assured me it was a tracking issue due to the shibata stylus on the 2M Black.......BUMMER! According to Chad that stylus is so picky about tracking that it's nearly impossible to get it perfect on a Rega Arm without going insane. I do have a Rega Exact for a steal I am going to pick up and give it a shot just to prove to myself he is correct or not. I also have access to a Graham Slee Era gold V that I will be "borrowing" from a freind.
I will post my results by tomorow. Wish me luck!!!! |
Alright guys and gals, I installed a new Rega Exact cart which has the 3 point allignment that locks you into a nearly perfect tracking angle and I still hear the same ever so slight distortion in the left channel only. Again, only on the parts of the song where Lisa really belts out a lyric. And I tried it with a Graham Slee Era Gold phono preamp, same situaion.
Could the vinyl be damaged due to mistracking with a shibata stylus on the 2M black??
I'm at a total loss. |
Just played this on 3 tonearm/cartridge combinations without an issue.
YMMV |
Just get rid of this damn album and stop being bothered by that! |
My pressing has the same problem. |
Inna, why so harsh? I understand your point, and I am simply trying to ensure I don't have an issue with my table or equipment. Idle tinkering is all, so relax dude, it is simply a question.
Decibell, I spoke to the guys again at Music Direct and finally they admitted they have received several calls regarding this issue. They offered me a new copy but I declined since I already have 2 copies and am willing to accept the fact that it's in the pressing. Why is shows up in some systems and not in others is a mystery. Oh well, I'm moving on and enjoying the other 999 records I have in my catalog.
Peace |
Nothing harsh at all. I just thought that you are getting stuck with that. Great album, by the way. You could consider getting the original UK pressing. Expensive, yes, but worth it. |
I agree, I found one on auction for $100.00 from Holland.........yikes that's a pretty penny. Thanks again to all and happy listening. |
I have an early pressing of the MoFi release and an original UK 4AD pressing. Both play clean without the distortion in Lisa Gerrard's voice you describe. |
