counterfeit NBS cables

.Anybody heard anything about forging NBS cables, or any other cables for that matter? I was warned by Walter Fields of NBS, as well as other NBS dealers (like the cable company) not to purchase NBS cables on the used market lest they be fakes. On the other hand, when I suggested Fields to help me and check the used cables for their authenticity, he refused. I find this all disconcerting.
Sounds like a case of a manufacturer just wanting to sell new products. Very greedy of him.
This is typical of Fields, he's done this before, even with cables that he had sold factory direct. He does not like to lose sales to the used market.
But then again look at it his way.Unlike an electronic manufacturer he has no potential gain in servicing or upgrade.Buy used but but don't expect the guy to hold your hand while you do it.
Chazzbo, I disagree. Gain or no gain, there is such a thing as customer service. People do notice. A sale doesn't just end when you walk out the door.
even used counterfeit nbs cables are overpriced. least that's my view, FWIW. -kelly
There are two issues here. The first is, that it is in the interest of the manufacturer to put his (or her) hands on the forges, and having people send their cables in is exactly one way of doing that. It might also be a step in tracing their illegal origin. The second is that a stable secondhand market is no less important for the success of a product than a firsthand market. People who buy new cables would like to know that they would be able to sell them one day. Whereas, spreading suspicion around would work in the opposite direction.
Either NBS cables are so shoddy that anyone can make a clone (thus they obviously aren't worth their price) or this guy just wants to sell new cables. If he's inferring that anyone can clone his cables, then there is obviously nothing to them that warrants their price. Even still, who would take the time and expense to clone cables?
Waler Fields is a greedy bastard. Try calling him up and see for yourself. Ever notice why all of his ads in magazines mention nothing of dealers only "buy factory direct" this is because he is so greedy that he chooses to eliminate the dealers all together and make the middle man profit himself. The cables themselves have been dissected, search over at, and have been found to be nothing more than factory belden cable. Yes, there was a guy selling "replica" NBS stuff but it did not have the NBS logo, which could easily be done with a typewriter and some scotch tape for those of you who have seen NBS stuff. The guy was honest and said that it was the exact same cable at a fraction of the price. Same shielding, cable, neutrix connectors, sheathing..everything. Walter sent him a scary letter and the guy stopped. The fact that he wouldn't verify his customers or potential customers cable is appalling. I would tell him to go F himself and buy a different cable brand. What happens if your connector breaks, will he repair it or ask for an original sales receipt and charge you to fix it because you werent the original owner? I had all NBS now I have all Nordost. The reason? All other cable manufacturers buy their cable but Nordost makes it. It is proprietary and I know they make it solely for audio. In any event, I know what I am getting is different, not necessarily better, and I have no fear of the same cable being sold for 1/10 of it's price by a different cable company "relabeling" the same cable. My opinion: forget NBS, forget Walter Fields and let the rest of the "suckers" buy factory direct. If he continues this way, there will soon be no factory at all.
Magnan had fake copies of the Vi going around. He checked mine and verified that they were real and then upgraded them for me(They had no serial #).
yes . go to buy from dealer or manufacture . then after
you want resale on second market . see what they tell to customer . i have same problem with MIT
when i want to buy in second market . mit tell
me go to dealer buy current product . due to fake cable and try to tell you 2 year ago item list $8.000 sound perfermance not even close they current model $1.000. this is dealer and manufacture suggestion . want customer pay full price .
Some cynics would say: authentic NBS cables are already a copy of other cables (Cardas, PAD...) and there are a few cable companies that copy NBS "legally" already (Heaven's Gate in Germany, as one example): if the counterfeit cable sounds as good as the real one, why should the end-user worry as long as they got a good deal? Here are a few other points:
1. Detecting counterfeit NBS cables is difficult for a few reasons: even within a single production run of the "classic series" there were changes in manufacturing materials and specifications. Thus the same cable within the same series often had different outer mesh sheathing (a good example of this is the change from silver to crimson red sheathing for King Serpent early on) and varying circumferences. Also, it is "easy" to manufacture a counterfeit (given the right supply chain and manufacturing know-how): the company label is especially simple to duplicate with a copy machine and attach (not exactly with "scotch tape" but with transparent cable shrink tubing).
2. However, there is one way that the authenticity of an NBS cable can be certified: the series II cables from Signature upwards (but also some early King Serpent IIs) have proprietary copper/berylium RCA connectors that are easy to identify and help to authenticate the origin of the cable (go to the NBS website or get their promo literature to see a picture of this RCA connector). Since the RCA cables with the proprietary connectors are the most expensive in the line, the problem of authentication is virtually solved for the most crucial instances (of course, the XLR, speaker. and power cables are still left as a problem). The spade connectors on NBS speaker cables are Cardas and can be identified by the Cardas shell logo very faintly embossed in the metal (of course, anyone can get these spade connectors...). Similarly, the power cables all use Hubbel plugs (no help, again...).
3. For those who claim that NBS is made from Belden wire, could you please specify exactly what cat. no. Belden wire is used in which NBS cable: I have heard this accusation many times but have never seen a detailed listing of the specific Belden wires used, which should be easy to provide if you have fully dissected the cable. I am also specifically interested in knowing IF the material of the supposed Belden wire is silver-coated copper since NBS claims their wires are made of this material layering.
4. The price margins on NBS cables are "normal" for the high-end audio industry (40% for retailer, 25% for distributor) and only a little more immoral than other high-end companies since the cost of the parts for a cable is lower than the costs for an electronic component (but then, given outsourcing and the world market, some components are very cheap to manufacture these days, and there is really no reason for the extremely high price of, for instance, Wilson Audio speakers, or Burmester CD players, to name two offenders) and of course the MFSR price is inordinately high for NBS (with some second-hand dealers charging too much as well). However, NBS offers a life-time warranty. They also do not waste money on expensive packaging and labeling.
In the end, the retail customer suffers under this situation as long as there are enough customers willing to pay normal retail price and no significant price competition between high-end cable manufacturers (PAD, AQ, MIT, Transparent, Synergistic, NBS, Cardas, Wireworld, Kimber, Fadel Art, Shunyata being the chief offenders). The used customer suffers (when he wants to honestly resell the cable later on or when the forgery is poor quality) when there is a flood of counterfeit cables on the market and the cable company is unwilling to authenticate these used cables. Even if NBS did offer this service (which is against their IMMEDIATE economic interests), what would a used customer do when he discovered that his cable was a counterfeit (with or without it sounding as good as the original)? Would he really bring charges against the salesperson (presumable a private citizen with no connection to any industry) for false advertising or fraud? How much would this cost in legal fees and what would a court award as settlement to justify the hassle of initiating legal action? What are the legal regulations concerning fraud and counterfeit manufacturing at internet auction sites?