Clyde Stubblefield RIP

@lowrider57

thanks for that link - so tasty!!!!

Great grooves.

FYI Pee Wee Ellis made up the riff for Cold Sweat and should have been given credit too - in fact if you listen very carefully you can hear that Cold Sweat was subconsciously influenced by Miles Davis Kind of Blue - similar note progression even if the rest of the song is very original.

And I have attended many many drum clinics but regretfully I never met Clyde. 

RIP

@frogman

I think in the pocket means the beat has movement or swings.

Compare

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U3sMjm9Eloo

to

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=6UdZIh8_xGc

Note how the second example grooves better - both are swung but the musicians hold their relative time better in the second example whereas the first example they follow the drummer too much and wander. Also Jim Riley (master drummer) is late on the 2 and 4 which gives it more lilt while the rhythm guitar keeps very rigid time to help create the time bending effect. The rhythm guitar locks in with the drums too much on the first example. Rhythm guitar is EXTREMELY tricky to get that perfect driving feel that grooves - hence legends like Nile Rogers have made a career from it.

So in the pocket requires setting correct time (hi hat usually) and then swinging some other parts of the beat to create the groove or lilt. The band needs to be tight and play well together to maximize the effect. A drummer can create the effect alone as in this example (delays the 4 and effective use of high hat to accent the "&")

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Bk3N84ArTno

Steve Ferrone kind of dances as he plays (trained as a tap dancer) but if you notice his beat 1 is always in the right place like a human metronome.

@frogman   

machine drummers do not sound as good as a great drummer because they are precise and have no feel or groove. 

Moving the beats around and away from the precise metronomic time is what gives the rhythm a unique pocket feel. Of course a groove once laid down must be repeated or looped so the imperfections in time from a metronome must be consistent from bar to bar (without consistency it just sounds sloppy)

I can provide more examples but regrettably I don't think a non-musician has much chance of grasping it. I encounter it all the time when playing a cover and trying to mimic a particular groove created by a drummer. The subtle adjustments in time that give a groove a particular pocket feel are one of the hardest aspects of drumming. Some tracks are done to a metronome (a lot of music theses days) and producing a machine metronomic sound can be a challenge too but it never sounds "in the pocket" as there is no feeling. Suprisingly, dynamics also play a role in pocket feel as the dynamics of each beat in a bar and where emphasis is placed will also define the feel of the groove. In the pocket drumming requires a consistent repeated dynamic variation through the bar as well. Just a simple change such as dropping the 1 or emphasizing the 3 over 2 and 4 creates a half time or reggae feel.

@slaw

No disrespect to you or Clyde. Any reference to a great drummer (such as Clyde) immediately leads the musically inclined to a discussion of technique (such as "in the pocket") and comparisons (not criticisms but deep respect for what every drummer brings). I understand that this does not interest you and wish to to discuss and honour the particular person that was Clyde. I also apologize that I did not respect audiogon as an official forum for leaving obituary comments and I simply got excited to see a few here who show interest in drumming technique. I am sorry you had to explain all this but please understand it is my enthusiasm for what Clyde brought to music that got me going on a tangent and off of the proper homage that this thread is supposed to be.

Here is what I know (and I have nearly all of James Brown stuff which is a lot considering how prolific he was)

He never got paid for Cold Sweat groove. And no doubt got nothing for all the samples taken of his music. Curiously in music you can copyright a chord progression or melody such as Stairway to Heaven but NOT a distinctive drum groove! Clyde was very humble and such a great person. He was self taught & his big break with James Brown lasted 6 years on tour. Clyde was no exception - many musicians had falling outs as James Brown was a difficult character that regularly fell out with members in his band (and the band was paid very little). Prince was a big fan of his and even helped with Clyde’s health care bills.

Like Mick Jagger and others have recently made an effort to recognize the great backing singers as well as the great musicians that invented the blues, it would be wonderful to one day see a great drummer such as Clyde get the recognition he truly deserves. Clyde contributed so much to the music of the 20th century and his influence lives on today and yet he got paid so little for it. To be so humble and to have given so much and to rarely have shown any bitterness is the mark of a truly great human and artist.

@slaw 

Sorry again for offending you. My enthusiasm for Clyde and the music he helped create got the better of me.