Clarity CSA are darker, CMR are most open.
Mundorf Supreme's are very colorful at the top, scintilating. Depends on what you want them to sound like.
Mundorf MKPs are cheap, but smooth and very dark.
Parts Connextion suggested Clarity CMR just concerned they may come across as bright or thin. Erik you say Mundorf Supreme are colorful are you saying they are bright, tipped up or not natural or true on top end. Just looking for a smooth, liquid and a natural sound with weight on cymbals, I'm not locked in with mundorf or Clarity, I'm open to anything.
I didn't like bypass caps on my tweeters (Coincident PRE's). They added some phassiness that bothered me. Don't really think they work well in crossovers if you're phase sensitive.
Put the same bypass caps, duelund casts, on the coupling capacitor in my amps and really liked it though.
And if you can swing it, I'd go with a copper cap for smoothness & detail. I read a lot before replacing my caps and that's where I landed... Pretty consistent comments supporting them and I agree. I have Jupiters and others recommended Miflex. Haven't heard the later, but some people think it's as good as duelund, at least in some applications.
Also, my speakers had some cheap solens and while the Jupiters are definitely better, I have to say I'm pretty impressed with what the solens were doing. They're certainly harsher, but have really nice tone & color.
The CMRs are the best "reasonably priced" caps I know of. At > 5uF, add a copper foil 0.1 uF
The Mundorf supremes are too complicated to call them "bright." They add color and pop at the top end, like film that is over saturated in color. A Disney like quality which is not natural but some really like it. B&W and Magico put them in their top end speakers for this reason.
Mundorf Supremes may not be for me then. I can up the budget a little but not in the Jupiter range, if cost was no object I wouldn't hesitate to buy them. Sonicraft suggested a prototype made by Relcap for him he called it a " true film and foil" but have no idea with that means, he said it was very smooth for $350 for all 4 caps that I need. I did consider the Miflex on just what I have read but that's all I can go by. Sonicraft has Miflex on sale for a little over $300 for all 4 caps I require.
Wima bypassed with flavor of your choice
I was wrong, the Miflex aluminum was aroun $350 for 4 caps, the copper is around $900 for the 4 I need. Back to the drawing board, right now I leaning toward Clarity CMR just scared it may be bright or analytical.
Wimas are super over sold.
Paul, CMR is NOT bright or analytical.
If you are using values over 5uF, use an Audyn TruCopper 0.1uF bypass cap.
The CSA is also not a bad cap at all if you want to save.
Oh, but FTR, Clarity is a little "splashy" first few days.
Oversold by people who build great gear
not a fad
still around building award and show winning speakers and amplifiers..x
But as I peer under the hood of just some of my gear, seems like WIMA keep pretty good oversold company: Brinkmann, Aesthetix. Vandersteen........all use bypassed WIMA
there are of course alternatives
What is benefit of audyn bypass? Being copper does it help smooth things out? There only $20 a piece so if it is beneficial without affecting phase of speaker I would give it a shot after breaking in Clarity CMR so I know what CMR is doing first. Right now I plan to order CMR Monday which gives me time to look at other caps but I really see no others in my price range as these speakers are in a second system unless someone can suggest a non fatiguing musical cap around $300 or $400 ish price point.
Dear @paulcreed : "" I would like to make them very smooth relaxed...."""
"" just scared it may be bright ..."""
"" unless someone can suggest a non fatiguing musical cap around """
with all those you posted I can’t be sure if you really like MUSIC and I mean live MUSIC and I say this because live MUSIC at nearfield seated position ( 2-3m that’s where recording microphones are positioned. ) is not smooth in any way and it’s brigth and depending of the kind of MUSIC fatiguiting too and yes colorfull with great dynamics/power/weigth and very fast transients and gorgeous rythm.
"" looking for a smooth, liquid and a natural sound with weight on cymbals,.... """
you ask in your words for " natural sound " well the live MUSIC has natural sound with those characteristics I mentioned before and many others. Maybe you have to attend more often to live MUSIC events and try to have experiences seated at nearfield position and then you will know how live MUSIC is in reality that’s not what you are looking for. You ask for something that just does not exist in live MUSIC.
It's the same with @beetlemania when he speaks of " adding warmth " when live MUSIC is not warmth in any way ! ! ? ? ?
From where came all those wrong adjectives used to show MUSIC characteristics when those characteristics do not exist in live MUSIC ? ? Gentlemans, what are you listening it because MUSIC : no way?
Btw, Jantzen Alumen Z caps. Don’t by-pass nothing till the caps are already broken and you can really evaluate the quality performance of thoase speakers.
Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
FWIW, I recently built new XOs for my Thiels using Clarity CSA. A big step forward in terms of resolution and transparency. Still, I wanted just a bit more warmth. I considered different bypasses such as Audyn or Jupiter. But I first replaced the hookup wire and binding posts with Cardas products. That snapped everything into focus, for lack of a better description. Even added a bit of warmth and the speakers now sound dead neutral. I considered CMR, especially on the coax feeds, but that would have been major coin for the required capacitance (14, 28, and 43 uF) and I’d probably have to go outboard for size reasons. And it’s hard to imagine how much better those would be compared to what I’m now hearing.
BTW, nice choice on the Mills. And Path would be my choice if not for the $$$.
The TC opens up the upper mids. But it is only useful if you are using CMRs of larger values (5uF or bigger).
If you use smaller caps I can't hear a diff, but this was done in a crossover, with different caps in different locations, so you may benefit depending on exactly where it is.
The point is, as you found out, they are inexpensive, so very much worth experimenting with.
I will spend some time with CMR's if I feel the need to put bypass on 8.2 cap. At least I know we're to turn with a bypass cap. I did put Cardas all copper post it did improve things. Raul please understand I'm not trying to duplicate live music. I am familiar with live music as being a drummer( mostly in my teens to late 20's) doing live and studio work a lot of times having to use crap house kits and cymbals. I've played from 5 to 600 seat clubs to 5 to 6000 inside room and outside festivals being at the mercy of the room, a drunk guy running the board and how many people fill the room to kill the sound. I mean no disrespect but I don't think live sounds very good unless done in an acoustic setting in a nice room.
Dear @paulcreed : """ I don’t think live sounds very good unless done in an acoustic setting in a nice room. """
of course and if you are not trying to " duplicate " live music ( impossible to do it but in my case I always want to stay nearer as I can or my room/system permits. ) then now I understand the adjectives you used in your posts. Good luck with your second system.
Hence my comment about flavor
some of us sober sound board guys are trying to move the illusion forward, some are busy creating a 33rd flavor
some do both
and are self aware
enjoy the music
Raul, I looked at the Jantzen Alumen Z, that looks like a very nice cap. Might be a better choice than Clarity CMR for me but all I can go by are words not what I can hear. That's just the way it has to be. This system is will mostly used for jazz, simple acoustical and female vocals most of the time, 80% Vinyl. Both the sources being a little layed back cirkus LP12, pink link power supply and old Exemplar Audio tubed Denon 2900 and el84 amp. The Jantzen sounds like it may be voiced in the direction I'm trying to go. While reading being compared to Jupiter caught my attention. Both Clarity and Jantzen are priced the same and both seem like a very good choice. Can anyone tell me the difference between the 2. One review I read mixed the 2 with good results.
@paulcreed what values do you need in the clarity caps? I have a pair of lightly used 4.7uFs I'd love to move into a loving home...
4.7 and 8.2 in Clarity CMR,thanks
: Like 10-12 months ago I decided to change again the caps of my external passive speakers crossover where in the past I used V-caps, Sonicraft, Mundorf and I had the opportunity to test Duelund and before all those a few more.
This time I want it to try was the " last change " so I took months asking " expwerts " on Agon forums about but in reality when I ask in specific for my needs no one of those experts really gave me help/advise.
My quest was in favor of true " neutral " caps where not the Mundorf or Duelund ( extremly expensive. ) achieve my neutrality target. What for XO that shares that target are the Duelund resistors. The inductors in my XO are ribbon 100% silver ones.
At the end of my research Clarity and Jantzen were my candidates along teflon caps by V-caps and Sonicraft but difference in price is very significant for my needs: 4-4.5uf, 2-16.8uf and 2-100uf.
I decided for Jantzen after read and re-read its information in its web site and between other things the explanation of why ( as others caps manufacturers. ) they designed the Alumen ( twetters/mid-range. ) Z caps with 100vdc instead of 400-800 vdc and mails to Jantzen and Clarity I decided for Jantzen. Btw, M.D.Jantzen not only is very knowledge on the caps overall concept but a true gentleman and friendly.
I can tell you that first its build quality is just second to none with cares on every detail you can imagine and yes it's the most neutral cap I ever experienced.
The MUSIC information flows as if there is nothing between it and you. It's outsatnding and only with experiences with the Alumen Z against the more expensive ones we can know what I'm talking about.
Another advantage is that you have that very high quality level performance for way lower lower $$$$ than Duelund, Jupiter, Mundorf and the like and overall the Alumen Z caps performs better that many of the $$$$$ caps.
Of course that with passive parts in a Speakers XO always is dependent of the speaker drivers and whole design and each one of us priorities.
I think you can't go wrong with the Alumen Z caps: