Check the Apogee users website - a lot of information by a great group of people. Use the Apogee Users Group link near the bottom of the page.
Dave - The room is quite huge (25'X30 with ceilings vaulted from 9'-16'). My guess is that Duettas or even Divas would probably be more appropriate.
Out of curiosity, how do you like the Centaurs? I owned a pair for about 3 hours. I found that the ribbon and 6" woofer did not integrate well at all. They also seemed rather dull and lifeless. I was using a Forte Model 4 (50wpc pure class A) to drive them in a very small room (11X13), so I don't think that amplification was a problem. I then bought a pair of MMGs and they worked terrific. Was I doing something wrong?
My room is only a couple of feet smaller each way than yours but with 8' ceilings. The Duetta Signatures really show what they can do in large rooms. At 5' out from the front wall and over 8' from any side walls my bass responce only begins to drop off at around 27hz in my room. I have a Krell Ksa-250 for power amp.
The Diva would be a step up but will require bi-amp and are much harder to place, this should not be a problem for you unless you have the WAF problem that some must deal with, my room is dedicated so I would love to own a pair of Diva's. That said, I don't ever feel like I need the larger Diva's. (I would just like to have them..If you know what I mean!!).
The Centaur Minors: I owned these speakers before I bought my Duetta Signatures, they were used in another room and a second system. The potential that I could hear in these small hi-breds are what caused me to move to the much larger D Sig's. I had a Krell Kav-500 on them and thought it a great match at 240 watts per. and never found them dull or lifeless?, I did find them to be a little bright at times and their bass responce at around 60hz. to lend their use to mostly well recorded Jazz and vocal reproduction..not a good rock music speaker. As far as the cone and the ribbon integration..I hear you on that one but I find that to be true with every hi-bred I have ever listened to unless the X-over is at very low fqz's which requires the ribbons to be almost full-range. I do have twin VMPS sub's on my Duetta Sig's from 35hz-17hz but my sub amp hardly gets a work-out at these fqz's.
Sogood51 - Thanks for your very thorough and thoughful response. You were dead right about the Apogee "sound".
I just picked up a pair of Calipers (non-signature) and HOLY CRAP, they sound good! As I mentioned, my room is quite large, but the amount of FULL RANGE sound coming out of these panels is nothing short of amazing.
Previously, I was using a pair of Acoustat 1+1s which were truly outstanding in their own right, but these Apogees are really something special. I've also owned Magnepan 1.6QRs and, while I'd still give them the nod in overall cohesiveness and transparency, the Apogees seem more dynamic and certainly dig deeper than any panel I've ever heard.
I listened to Lyle Lovett's "Road to Ensanada" and on the title track, there's a 5-string bass playing an "open B" (lowest string on a bass is usually E which I believe translates to 41hz? - someone correct me if I'm wrong - A 5-string bass adds almost another half-octave to the lower register so low B equals almost exactly 30hz).
On many speakers...like the Acoustats...this is totally inaudible. To give a point of reference, I also had a pair of Vandersteen 2CEs in the same room. Vandersteens are famous for their full range and they had a hard time with this track. The Vandies could produce the note, but it was shelved down several dbs. Consequently, they could not pressurize the room where you actually felt air move.
I can't begin to imagine what the larger Apogees are capable of. The Divas must be quite spectacular!
My only gripe(s) is that the midrange still seems a little "thick" compared to Magnepan 1.6s and the highs are a tad rolled off. But what they do, they do extremely well. My other complaint is that they're not exactly kid-friendly - or wife-friendly for that matter.
Anyway - thanks again for the assistance.
Glad the Caliper's are working out in your large room. What amp are you using on them? We have a member of the Apogee user forum who has just built a digital amp based on the B&O "ICE technology" that we are all excited about. A couple of members went to his house over the weekend to have a listen on his Divas and Scintilla's. The early reports are that this amp could drive his 1ohm Scintillas with-out even a hint of strain to very hi spl's.
He has built 3 of these so far and is letting these out for home trial to members of the forum.
Here is a link with pictures and spec's of his new digital amp design. This link may not work with-out a password? http://www.picturetrail.com/gallery/view?p=999&gid=3924042&uid=1034484&members=1
Well...Unfortunately, the Apogees are on the proverbial auction block. Unfortunately, they're not the most kid-friendly speakers in the world (as I mentioned before) and to keep the peace, I've decided to move along.
I just purchased a pair of ML CLSIIzs. I know they're not at all the same speaker, but the one thing that they share in common is the 3D soundstaging. The nice thing about the CLSs is that that they're pretty well protected and reasonably stable.
Don't get me wrong, my kids are extremely respectful and well-behaved, I just don't want to take any chances. It's not worth it.
That amp looks pretty slick. Maybe it'd be a nice match with the CLSs. I was thinking about picking up a BelCanto or Spectron. What's the price point on these?
I know you are selling your Calipers, but the photos look like you did not biwire them (unless those are shotgunned wires). Biwiring the Calipers really makes them open up. Also, the Caliper and Duetta Signatures have a plastic screen over the bass ribbons, which go a long way to protecting them from inquisitive fingers. The Duetta Signatures and the Divas can also be screwed into the floor, so they can't be easily knocked over by toddlers.
I also have utilized the Calipers and the Maggie 1.6QR's as main speakers and concur that although the Calipers are incomparable in bass power and dynamics, the Maggie is more neutral, more coherent throughout and superior in the higher registers. A Vandersteen 2WQ added to the Maggies almost makes up for the difference in the bass.
I am bi-wiring them with an "internal bi-wire" pair of cables. I was told that it does make a big difference. The binding posts were also upgraded to all copper too.
All I know is that they sound amazing. Not the best I've ever heard, but certainly a very unique sound and extremely easy to listen to.
Somebody is going to be very happy to take these home, provided that their amp is up to the task. Did I mention that my Classe gets hot? Baby, does it get hot!
Back in the day. I used a pair of caliper's. It still remains one of the best sounding speakers I've owned. Big but, controlled and dimensional sound. I had great success running them with a pair of levension 20.5 monos and Mit speaker, and interconnects (shotguns) Also the addition of a sub really helped. Back then a Velodyne UDL 15 did the trick nicely.Good luck. As I'm writing this I think back on just how nice that system sounded, And why did I find it necessary to change anyway? It worked!
I owned a pair of calipers's a few years back used them with a Kerll KSA100 amp and a Krell PAM 3 pre with many many speaker cables. I never could get them to sound good I tried many interconnects and speaker cables and could not find a good match for them. I had a smaller room so this may have been the bigger part of My problem. I loved the look of them and so wished I could of found a way to make them work in My room but no so I sold them good luck with them . Marc