Going to go single or double(yeah I know that beneath 150 hrz that you "can't localize) bass but two is what many folks do.Storm would be first choice.Or larger.But remember that a 20 Hrz wave is 56.something large so even in big room your not going to get lowest notes that you might hear ((25hrz is more reasonable).Think older series maybe a single stadium is good.They are fast multi drivers.Too bad Vandersteen never made a bigger 2WQ.That said and though not with same finesse Logan has a fine sub (some have said better for HT and music and not as refined as REL) but whatever you get Maggie told me get multi driver that does not go beyond 6" driver.ML Depth is really a fine sub.Since it's not going to reproduce a 20 Hrz wave in actuality your room may need more SPL than depth (ergo ML and two not one)Both they an REL don't have digital e.q. that other like Velodyne have so a REL you can afford (again older models still built not newer series or one from some guys who left company and started MJ Acoustics are worth looking into.Then get a SVS EQ with mike to smooth it all out since these brands don't have the EQ.Your on right track though knowing about REL and that speed not "Boom In The Room" is what a music lover wants.Me I'd go two Storms or ML Depth's and SVS-1.Wish I could name older model above Storm but you'll see it if REL is the choice.
REL B series is what you want. I have the B2 in my HT and it blends in very well with my Vienna Acoustic Haydns. The B2 sometimes find a place in my two channel setup for a nice change of bass.
One of the things I like about the REL is the control to blend and integrate the bass.
I agree with Chazz on planning for two RELs.
B1= 12" woofer
B2= 10" woofer
Thanks; the REL Storm looks very promising, even two used would not brake the bank and they just might move the 3.6's to sonic nirvana.
I would go for the Stadium, I started with one and now have 2. I saw a Stadium 11 here last week for $995, one of mine is just like it. I have mine starting to roll off at 25 Hz. I actually have a Storm also but haven't heard it yet as it was for sale by local pick up only in DC and I had a friend there pick it up for me. In your room the bigger ones would work better, my room is 35x13x7 and I have no trouble using 2. I have often heard the theory that your room has to be very large to reproduce 20 Hz but I think that this is simply not true, another case of theory being at odds with reality. When did you ever see room size specified in frequency response specs?
I use the James 1500, have had the 1200's in the past and they all worked very well with the 3.6. The Jl Audio are very good, probably better if set up properly. I have only heard one Rel sub, and thought it was too slow, and a bit fat. Probably not optimized. jallen
I have a large listing room also and use two Rel Storm IIIs. I have tried one sub many times for waf...it just isn't the same. It takes two to tango fast,tight and low!
I just purchased a T-1 for Home Theater use and am shocked at how well it integrates(via its Neutrik Speakon connector)with my Canton Karat M-70's for 2 channel music!
I can only imagine how good its more expensive/bigger brothers are. I have not used a sub in a dedicated 2 channel system.I tried a couple of times many years ago,but could never seem to properly integrate the sub into the system.I may haul the Rel downstairs and give it a try!
Vandersteen 2WQ hooks up the same as the Rel but the High pass will take you to another level try a pair and you will
like even better.
Updating this discussion for those that might still be interested in such a pairing...
My music only listening room is 22' wide by 25' long with an "A" shaped vaulted ceiling 8' at the lowest, 13' at the peak. A decent amount of air to energize.
I've paired a set of two REL T-5's to my Magnepan 2.7 QR's. T-5 crossovers set at around 75 Hz, level 50%. Using the T-5 "High Level" inputs. Subs pushed into the room's front corners behind the Maggies, roughly 4" from the corners.
Have never used another sub. But IMO this combination, in this room is spectacular.
The 2.7's are authoritative enough on their own to not require a lot of supplementation. And the pair of T-5's combined have power in reserve - neither being strained at all. And the results...
Well, all my musical vocal and acoustic instrumentals are just as transparent and precise as they always were (gotta love Maggies). But now Peter Gabriel's Sledghammer has got that SLAM that I've been missing. And the drums on Patricia Barber's Too Rich For My Blood have the percussive power that I've always known should have been there.
I cannot say what this pairing on a classic 2-point series Maggie means for people with the current 3-point series. Though I'm sure people more informed than I about the differences should be able to speculate.
Hope that helps. :-)
PS - One last point... They were super easy and forgiving to set up. On day one I tossed them in corners, and tinkered with placement, crossover point, and amplification level for about an hour and was very happy with the results. Later, I spent many hours measuring dB, listening, recording, comparing, making incremental changes... you know the drill. Anyway, at the end of many hours work, the ideal speaker positions, crossover point, and amplification wound up so close to my original 1-hour assessment, that the difference barely matters. It's subtle. A pair (in my room, with my equipment) is that easy to set up.
Much Thanks! Scolley-
REL makes the finest sub on the market. One would be hard-pressed to find a better sub. Ease of use, ease of system integration, excellent dealer/retailer network and an outstanding product line makes for a no brainer choice. Even the older series subwoofer(s) are never out of date IMO.
Happy Labor Day!
After an number of months, I made a pretty big change that I thought was worth reporting...
Setting the RELs up initally sounded good - using their recommended front corner placement. But after months of listening, I became convinced that my bass was not quite as tight as it should be. And was - at times - a bit boomy. The fix was really easy.
I merely moved the subs out of their corner orientation, to being in-line with the plane of the maggies, right next to the woofer side of the speaker (opposite side from the tweeter), center of the sub on that plane. Audible difference. Nice, tight, coherent bass. Not remotely boomy. And any slam is now more crisp. It's a difference that you can literally FEEL. :-)
Obviously this completely ignores room modes, so your mileage may vary. But the maggies' bass (withot the RELs) sounded good where they are. So it's no surprise that putting the RELs right next to them would sound good too.
As stated in my first post, I've got 2.7QRs, not 3.6s like the OP. But I'd be shocked if REL T5s did not work great with them too.
FWIW my crossover is set to around 50 Hz, using high-level inputs at ~ 25% volume on the RELs.
I had the same type of success with a pair of JL audio E112 (with thiel 2.4). I use their built in high pass crossovers between the pre-amp and amp and it sounds great. The key to using subs is a good high pass crossover. I will be using subs on all my systems going forward. I crossover at 60hz but with the crossover I can really blend it anywhere between 100hz and 30hz if the gain is set right in the subs.
always nice to read about another Thiel speaker owner.
What brand(s) of other gear is in your system?
Most important, want brand(s) of cables/cords is in your system? Keep me posted & Happy Listening!
My system is cheap and simple. Wyred4sounds DAC2 (as dac/pre-amp) and their st500 amp (replaced my mcintosh mc252...). My interconnect/wire are just random kimber and wyred4sounds stuff that I all got used.
The thiels have been good (switching them out soon) but much better with subs high passed. Actually I am starting to think all speakers are better with Subs that are properly high passed, there is no going back.