bat vk 60 vs rogue mono 120s

Hello,

I have owned the BAT VK-60 a few times (the same one). It had revision C boards. The amp was a cool looking and ok sounding but sounded very bright with various preamps (ARC LS-22, BAT VK-40, etc.) My biggest problem with BAT is the company. What sort of company makes revisions A-F on the an amp in less than 3 years? They wanted about $4500 to bring my rev. C amp up to the VK-60SE. What a deal! I ditched the amp. I am now using a Kora Galaxy (Sweet) and the Rogue Audio 99 preamp (Freakin incredible). I just ordered the phono board for it. I would say it is a keeper. Read the reviews on www.audioreview.com. Rogue gear may not look as polished as some but the engineering and sound quality are top notch. The guys at Rogue are very helpful and can help a lot with tube rolling and such if you are interested in that. I wish I could say if the 120's are better than the BAT VK-60 or 60's. I imagine that they are. What I can say is that as companies go I would rather deal with a company that has sound design ideals up front than a bunch of tinkerers. VK and the gang are applying the same revision ideals to audio gear as they did in the computer business (HP). As a computer geek I understand this. As an Audio Geek I detest this approach. Sorry. I did not mean to make this a diatribe against BAT. My opinion..go for the Rogue and be happy.

Here is the e-mail from VK. I really have nothing against VK and BAT but the way they do business. I like the Guano gear but as an EE type I get confused (pissed) when someone makes 6 (now 7) modifications to the board in 5 years. In the mini computer business it was not unheard of to have PCB's with 40-60 revisions on them. Most of those revisions were necessary to run new versions of ucode and operating revisions. In this case we are talking about a very old art that you either know or you don't (tube circuits). As far as Mark O'Brian I think he seems to know this art if he designed the Rogue 99. For $2400 or less you can have one of the most musical preamps I have ever heard. It is a pefect match for the Kora Galaxy. Well I am way off subject here. I really don't know if the Magnum 120's sound better than the BAT's. Here is the e-mail from VK about the cost of a version C to VK-60 rev.F and VK-60SE. Add them together to get to the SE. I stand corrected. He wanted $4750 not $4500.

Dear Sherman,

The VK-60SE upgrade cost for that unit will be $3000 plus $1750 for newere
PC boards.

Sincerely,

Victor Khomenko

Ok. One last attempt here to get my point across and then I will be quiet. Regardless of how nice people are if you bought an amp for say $4500 and then 3 to 5 years later they had an upgrade for the amp. You inquired about it, and they told you it would cost you $4750 to upgrade it. What would you think? There is something called customer loyalty and I don't think that this sort of pricing model exhibits customer loyalty. This sort of mentality is more the norm when we are talking about business machines that you depreciate and make money with. These are toys. I am sorry but this just hit a nerve with me. I could be all wet here. Ok I am done. I will go on my way with my Rogue Kora combo. Both are excellent values and can be had for about the same price as the VK60 SE upgrade.

Sterling. I agree with you for the most part. The bat amps I have owned and heard are good. I have not had a chance to listen to the Rogue 120's to compare. The cost of the upgrade just miffed me a bit. I am now on a Kora Electronic Concept wagon as far as amps go. I am using the newer 50 watt Galaxy. I hope to add a second soon and strap them mono. I guess I would go as far as to say that it KILLS the Bat Vk-60. The reason I chose to answer the gentlemens question was because I have rolled many preamps over the last year and have found none that can touch Mark "O's Rogue 99 preamp. The finish is not as trick as the bat's I have had but it sounds like no other in my system. I saw this as an opportunity to praise Rogue and vent my dislike for companies like BAT that out source most of their products build up and then design revision after revision and gouge the customer that wants the update.

BTW Mark O' is building me a special phono board for the 99 I have and I told him in jest that he is "No Victor Komhenko". He laughed pretty hard so I don't think he will loose any sleep over it.

I do apologize to those guano lovers that I have offended.

David99. I just received a special phono board for my 99 that Mark O'put together for me. He put a few fancier parts and sent me a full compliment of NOS GE's and Tung-Sols. It is as awesome sounding as the line stage. I talked to him at great lengths today and he is still laughing about the previous comment that he is no Victor Khomenko. As a professional he won't make a negative comment about a competitor. He is a real class act and seems to have fun building and talking about his wares. The guys at Kora are the same way. Just having fun in this crazy business. BTW I asked what it costs to have a set of 120's updated to "Magnum" status and he said they charge $1200. He defended BAT a little in the conversation because of the nature of these upgrades. He did not understand the extreme cost of the update that we have blathered about here. I guess it is just part of this low volume market. Well I will quit gobbing off here.