B&W 802 N vs. D

Look guys, all of you need to fix your egotistical attitudes & start behaving like civilized men. And, also understand that this is a DISCUSSION & not a brain-washing session where you need to convince one or more men that brand XYZ is better than brand ABC! As all you zipper-heads know audio is a very SUBJECTIVE hobby & (often) one man's meat is another's poison.
Allow each contributor to this thread retain his opinion & RESPECT that opinion esp. if it does not jive w/ your own. As, I wrote before - it's subjective & bound to have vast differences. LET IT GO!

Now, in an attempt to contribute to this discussion: I have nothing to gain/lose here as I am no longer a B&W owner. However, I will say this: from my experience & from that of a good friend (who owns a 802D at this present time), the only way that you are going to make the 802D get up & salute you is to take care of the amplifier-speaker electrical interface. IOW, you will need an amp that has huge balls to drive this difficult load otherwise you are going to get a dull, lifeless, over-bloated bass, tizzy type of sound during playback.
http://www.stereophile.com/images/archivesart/1205802FIG1.jpg
look @ its impedance, phase plot.In the 20Hz-200Hz region the phase goes from + to - => inductive load to capacitative load. The amp you use will have to be capable of handling this phase lead, phase lag on a dynamic basis; otherwise, the 802D will be controlling the amp rather than the other way around. Also, in this region I note that the amplifier you use will need to have the ability to source/sink current into a low impedance load (2.5-3 Ohms) & still sound good. For most amps available in the market this is a tall order indeed. Most amps are rated for 4 Ohms & maybe even 2 Ohms but that does not mean that they sound good when driving those impedances.
From my experience at RMAF2007 I can tell you that B&W's decision to pair Classe amps with their speakers is a mistake! The new Classe amps are quite poor sonically & do their speakers a big injustice. However, what's B&W to do: they own Classe now so they have to tout their in-house brand!
So, guys, be careful mouthing off here: your experience of the 802D can dramitically change if you use the "correct" amplifier that has the ability to control this speaker. This is my personal experience - it's not hear-say or 2nd-hand experience.

07-22-09: Diw
Bombaywalla:

Do you think my Theta Dreadnaught II would be sufficient to cope with the issues you mention, or would it be more like the Classe in design?

The truth of the matter, Diw, is that I don't know as I have never heard a Dreadnaught II driving an 802D.
after reading an online review in the Ultimate AV mag, I seem to be in 2 minds (of course, this is just a review & words cannot describe how the actual amp-speaker interface will fare; only listening can prove/disprove that). I've cut & paste from that review below:

Into an 8ohms load, with five channels driven, the Dreadnaught II clipped (1% THD+noise) at 192W per channel at 20Hz and at 189Wpc at 1kHz (215Wpc with two channels driven at 1kHz into 8ohms). Into a 4ohms load, five channels driven, clipping occurred at 228Wpc at 20Hz and at 227Wpc at 1kHz (255Wpc with two channels driven at 1kHz into 4ohms).

isn't clipping supposed to indicate the point where max power has been reached? so, why didn't the amp's power increase substantially (double?) into a 4 ohm load? There was a marginal increase only.

With the Theta, however, the distortion increases gradually as power increases. At 2% distortion, for example, the Dreadnaught II will put out 257Wpc into 8ohms and 341W at 4ohms (two channels driven at 1kHz). The amplifier is able to double its 8ohms rated power when the load drops to 4ohms, but at a distortion level of 7.4% (450Wpc, two channels driven at 1kHz). It should also be noted that the distortion in the Dreadnaught II at very high power levels is higher than we measured for the original Dreadnaught.

the levels of distortion seem disturbing to me but maybe I'm being too picky? Or, is this amp designed specifically for HT & these levels of distortion are OK for HT use?
I would certainly not be successful using this amp to drive my Scintillas! They'd burn up in a short time!

What does your listening tell you? Does the Dreadnaught II cut it?

By the way, I enjoyed looking at the pictures of your Scintillas. Now that brings me back to another era!

Thanks for you kind words, Diw. I love those speakers. they are a very hard load to drive & they make your 802D, in comparison, a very easy load. ;-)
Yes, they belong to a bygone era (that, according to me, was when audio was a growing market & there was more dedication in the manuf than there ever will be today) - it's an oldie but a (very) goldie.....

07-20-09: Missioncoonery
Bombaywalla ..We all know that the 802 needs power,old old news,,.....

you are quite the antogonist, Missioncoonery, aren't you?? on the prowl looking for a fight....
Ok, so you know that B&W speakers like power. So, which kind of amp would be suitable for this type of speaker? When you listened to this speaker, which amp or amps did you listen to it with??
Power, as your clever self would know, has 2 components & you can get high wattage increasing either or both components. Which of these 2 components of power seem to be more important for B&W speakers in your opinion?

No im not looking for a fight,just thought your writings were silly and unimportant to be honest..but as stated enjoy those B&Ws..

my post might be unimportant to you but you are not the only one on this forum. My post might have meaning to others interested in this brand & those interested in making these speakers sound better. It's OK with me that you do not like B&W & never will; you've made that clear w/o mincing your words. Fine w/ me; no offence taken.
I also think that your mind is shut closed.
Further you cannot read! Read my original post & tell me if I still own B&Ws.
You have dodged my power related question completely that alone has told me a lot about you!

That's right, Missioncoonery, we are done with this!
Like you wrote before "we agree to disagree".

BTW, what the heck are you doing in this thread?? This forum is a DISCUSSION forum where we discuss topics including those that do not align w/ your likes & dislikes. If you have nothing useful to contribute in this thread (or anyother) then get lost; find another thread that you can be useful in. Simply bashing B&W (or any other brand) is NOT what anybody wanted in this thread.
Remember we are in an audio discussion forum - if you don't like a topic(s) then stay out of their. No need for you to participate & spew your venom.
You are right, we are done here. Goodbye!

Now, back to Diw's question comparing 802D vs. 802N. Members with useful comments should kindly contribute. Those that do not like this topic, keep out! (many topics in this forum will not be to your liking but try to remain civil all-the-same). Not that I like or want to be doing this but I'm pretty sick of nimrods like Missioncoonery who think they know everything swooping in & raining on someone's thread. People like this should just stay away from audio discussion threads as these sort of people are not open to any discussion - their minds are made up & they are out to bash brands that they do not like/prefer - they are no use to anyone in a discussion forum.

Tuanloinoel,
thank you for your kind words. I am happy to read that the info re. the amp-speaker interface + my review of the TARA Labs cables were helpful to you.

I believe that Kodg has answered your question better than I could have.

Best regards.