Ayon Vs. Audio Research Preamps

Hi Scott, you're not alone. I currently own an Ayon CD-5s & am planning on upgrading my current pre-amp (CD-5s) to an Ayon Orbis. I've had a few discussions about the Orbis with Gerhard Hirt, and it's obvious to me (and clearly to you) the Orbis is superior to the Ref 5. It should be a killer pre & sound warm and very musical with my Boulder amp.

The PBD deck is a great SACD player & is a very different player to the CD-5s. One is a solid state SACD player & the other is a class a valve cd player. My opinion on RB vs SACD hasn't changed; a well recorded K2HD, XRCD or DXD disc should sound as good as an SACD on a 'garden' variety Ayon spinner. They're both mighty players though.

Cheers,
Melbguy

Hi Scott, firstly congratulations on your decision to buy the CD-5s. You certainly wont regret that as you're getting a great dac, transport & pre-amp in one package. In regards to my contact, I have spoken directly to Gerhard Hirt at Ayon regarding the Ayon Orbis on several occasions and compiled these responses regarding the Orbis and CD-5s. You can draw your own conclusions..

"The new Orbis will be the next milestone of our preamp history. It is always difficult to give you 100% correct sound description because it depends from so many factors.

Fact is that the Orbis is an ultra new Linestage concept, with an amazing 6H30 circuit ( parallel single-ended design with high current bias point – yes we are talking about a preamp)

Also there is a Re-Generator power supply built in and we are using a special 4 channel volume potentiometer from Japan, custom modified and motorized. As an ayon standard we included special chokes for the power supply.

I dare to say that this preamp doesn’t have any competitor in its class."

"Orbis: it is an analog preamp and not need to bring any update, there will be no any MK II version in the future, the design is done. BTW the Orbis is not yet released.

Actually when you have a CD-5s not need to include an preamp, the CD-5s preamp section is extremely well sounding."

"As you know the preamp section of the CD-5s is very close to any top preamplifier."

"I can tell you that the new coming Orbis will be a new milestone in its preamp class, the design what we using is a bit different from others and we designed without any compromise to get out a new performance standard.

Please know on the preamps side there is since a longer time not really any step ahead , all preamp manufacture in real moved back our using their old concept ( 10 or 20 years old design – just around a new chassis) because the preamp business is not a real business for the bigger manufactures.

But we set up a new reference standard with the Spheris II – it is a design which no others could do it or let’s say nobody would be crazy enough to invest a big amount and research and time to realize a preamp like the Spheris II nowadays.

Even the Orbis is using a bit different technology as the big Spheris, but the Orbis is truly outstanding and we invest a lot of brain to make it happen, and we were crazy enough to invest a lot of time in the Orbis again and even preamp business is not so attractive, for us is more important the result and that we set up a new standard and besides them still a very good price value."

"of course the Orbis is not very dark and very warm sounding but also not too neutral, the Orbis has all magic from a SE tube preamp with a bit warm in the midrange and its huge and holographic sound stage."

"You can be sure that the Orbis will be an improvement against the CD-5s."

Regards,
Melbguy.

Hi Scott, i've done some more research on the Orbis vs CD-5s and have to say i've come to the same conclusion as you. The CD-5s is an amazing preamp. I also found out it's preamp section has similar bandwidth to a CJ Act 2.2 (ie: over 100kHz!). Like you, when I looked at the the significant investment (preamp, high end cable & pc), it just didn't add up. The CD-5s is good enough & is pretty killer. I plan to upgrade my tonearm instead & invest in a high end iso platform...happy days!
Regards,
Melbguy.

Thanks for your feedback Audioman. Gerhard assured me the Orbis is an excellent design, much different and a superior circuit design from the CD-5s. Have you compared the CD-5s & Orbis side by side? From Gerhard's comments, I would have expected the Orbis to provide a bigger improvement than that. Btw I haven't found a better tube pre under $20k than the Orbis & plan to upgrade to an Orbis later this year. As for HDD based music, yes I see the convenience and agree it's the future of digital audio, but I think if you compared a CD-5s running pre-amp out to an Ayon Orbis vs a server or HDD-based system, there would be no clear advantage to the latter (other than convenience).

Thanks for your post Scott. Fyi, the CD-5s needs a full 250hrs+ to fully open up and bloom, but I would say at 150hrs the players is 80% played in. Re: the remote, once you read the instruction manual & understand all the functions of the remote, you learn to recognize only the buttons you use every day. I haven't had the same problems with misreads of cd's as you have, so it might be a fault in your player? I also haven't had the same issues with batteries dying, but then again i'm using premium long life alkalines. As for the issue of inadvertently hitting the "Fixed" volume control, I don't have that problem as i'm also using my CD-5s as preamp, so I have the rear toggle set to "Direct amp" which automatically disables the "fixed" output button to protect your amp & speakers. Selecting "Direct amp" also automatically drops the volume to -40 on every power up for safety.

Hi Scott, yes I think the Orbis will be a great pre at it's price point. It's a good thing you bought spare DR tubes...they'll probably be sold out soon.
MG