Avalon toe-in?


Need some suggestions on Toe-in for my Ascendants. My speakers are 7.5' apart, 4.8' from back wall, 3.8' from side wall with a listening position of 7.5'. They are currently toed in 3/16", not sure what that is in degrees but how much more toe-in would you recommend?
try toeing only slightly until you achive some focus..to much and you could squash soudnstage width.
Hello Wig,

May I suggest 1/2" as a starting point an then fine tune the toe-in from there depending on your room acoustics and taste. If you want a more spacious airy sound-scape keep them straighter. If you think you need more focus and more chiseled images toe them in more.

Take your time and give yourself a chance to absorb and learn what the change in movement is doing to the sound.

It all depends on the room. Try straight ahead first, and hear what that's like, then slightly toe them and find out if you like that sound...more depth, but less width. Some rooms even favor toeing out. Experiment..the only way to know.
Excellent advise from Tom.

On a rainy day after you think you have optimized the toe in/soundstage try continuing to turn your speakers inward crossing the axis of your speakers in front of your listening position to the same degree.

For example, in an equilateral triangle the degrees from a line perpendicular to the front of the speaker (its axis)to your head is 22.5 degrees. Lets assume you find that toeing your speakers in 10 degrees seem optimum, leaving 12.5 degrees to the head.

Now toe your speaker until the axis crosses your head by 12.5 degrees. What this will do, or at least can do, is to change the reflection pattern off the side walls and ceiling. It can give you a very focused but full frontal soundstage because, for example, the sound from the left speaker will not be reinforced by the side wall or ceiling surfaces. This would also allow you to move the speakers further apart and the listening chair further back should you desire and enhance even further the size of the focused sound stage.

Just a though about a road rarely traveled. But try it, it's free. With the dynamic speakers I have used I have never found a down side in medium sized rooms and prefer it.
Why don't you just experiment a little and put them where they soud best to you? After all,you are the one that has to listen to them.

Thanks for all the responses! I'll start moving them a little each day and evaluate.

Thanks again,

Did you ever settle on the toe in? My set up is similar to yours and my Avalons are toed in such that the tweater center passes about a foot outside my ears and would converge behind me.

I did try multiple experiments with toe-in and after several weeks, I found that minimal toe-in (1/8") provided the best ambiance, soundstage and coherence. You guys have been a big help and I just put my spike back on last night, finalizing their current position. Just can't wait for my Berkeley Alpha dac to arrive.
Try getting a pinpoint laser pointer hold it on the flat outside of the speaker and aim at the opposite wall to get an exact point of reference. slowly move them in or out till the center image comes into focus. I use one thats flat not round and hold it on the side of the speaker. I have the B&W802 matrix, so only the mid-treble head swivels , so its very easy. I keep the bass drivers straight ahead.

After more experimrnting I have found that sweet spot for my Ascendents in my listening room. My speakers are 8' apart, 40" from side wall and 51" from back wall with my ears 7' 6" away from speakers with a small 1/8" toe-in. I feel like I'm there...
What are your room dimensions, if I may ask?
15' X 40' with a fireplace in the middle splitting the room in half