The SE upgrade is made by Globe Marketing. AFAIK they put teflon V-Caps, together with cryoed tubes and some symposium dampers. The upgrade costs $700 and is well worth the money. Replacing the caps by itself puts the player in different league in terms of resolution, transparency and microdynamics.
Although you can buy the caps and install them by yourself, you can't get cryoed tubes (unless you solder them off and send for cryogenic treatment).
Something just doesn't sit right with me pertaining to this supposeable upgrade. After being told that the upgrades original price was 2k but now is available for less than half of that cost. Over exploded ?????????
That's odd Zenieth. I have always heard $700 (perhaps it was $750) and I thought I had one of the very first to hit the market with the SE mod. I received mine right before the 6moons review of the Prima with SE upgrade.
I can't attest to before or after comparisons. I can tell you the player is good, and it may be overpriced. From what I hear of the mod improvements I would think it is fair in price.
The $700 upgrade through Globe Marketing takes the Capitole MKII and upgrades its output board to SE status ... but it does not modify the linestage (to add more analog inputs and digital outputs) ... that's what costs $2000. Basically you can get the sound of the SE for an extra 700, but to get the full functionality of the SE you have to spend the full $2000.
I have the lesser upgrade on my capitole MKII and it sounds awesome, no need to add more! ... also ask Globe for the De Mat from Art Speak which is to be used in conjunction with the Capitole ... surprisingly effective.
for those who want to go the extra mile ... try a whest audio dap.10 in the chain as well. (and use symposium rollerblocks and a good powercord on it).
Happy listening ... the Capitole is a great sounding player at a reasonable price when compared to the ones who surpass it from Emm Labs and Reimyo.
Audiofankj ....... Maybe it is odd! I'm just repeating what I was told. I found it to be some what strange. Maybe it was just a sales ploy to generate yet another modification.
The cryogenic treatment is it a life time process? I have heard of people doing this process to CD'S and the benefit only lasts so long. Having owned a few Tice power clocks you have to send them back every once in a while for this process. I have heard that cryogenic's is involved when recharging the clock among other things.
Whoever told you that was wrong. I called the distributor to ask them (which seems the logical thing to do to get accurate information)
The SE upgrade is $700.00
The upgrade that costs $2,000.00 is the AI upgrade to older model Capitoles, which involves adding three pairs of analog inputs (2 SE, 2 balanced), a new D/A output board with the inputs board attached, a modifiction to the power supply and a whole new back plate to allow for the new input jacks.
With all that you have stated I agree......someone was wrong. Then again I may have misunderstood what I was told. Have you gotten the SE upgrade?
The better upgrade allows you to bypass the pre unless you are still into vinyl. The analog inputs allow you to run your tuner through the Capitole. I am currently running my Satellite through the toslink and my DVD through the coax. Also, using the balanced and unbalanced outputs I am running the feed to two rooms in my house, by bi-amping.
Thanks for all your replies, what I really wanted to know what was the value "uf" of the caps. Can you suggest a particular manufacture. Is it true that the cryoed tubes used for the upgrade come from Philips? I'm just trying to figure out if the upgrade would be cheaper if I try to buy them on my own.
Ssynphonic -> the best way to tell is to open up your Capitole. The Mk II I got uses Hovland MusiCaps .1uF/400V.
You may substituthe those for .1uF/600V V-Caps, as I did. I belive that those are used in Globe's SE mod.
Elberoth- Thanks for your help. Have you changed the tubes?
No I did not. To be honest, I do not really believe in all that cryo voodoo.
You don't "believe" in cryo'd tubes? Is this religion or a search for better audio performance? You have to go with your ears and switch-off the paranoia that can develop after getting burned or lied-to by too many cable/accessory "hypesters".
Have you ever actually tried cryogenically treated tubes? I have heard obvious improvement in components with the use of cryo'd tubes.
If you've never tried it before and own Atmasphere amps with two million tubes in them :-) I can see being a little reluctant, but a couple of tubes in a preamp or CD player is not going to break the bank, and it's worth trying.
how many caps have to be changed. Can it be done by a local mechanic. anything else to be done to make it SE other than cryo tubes. i have a capitol reference.
thank you in advance
Just two. My Capitole mk II used Hovland Musicap 0,1uF, your Reference prolly uses the same, but you have to check for yourself. Just replace them with same value, Teflon V-Cap capaciors. I belive they are 40 each.
how do AA fix this in capitol reference SE ?
which 6021 tubes does audio aero uses , philips or sylvania?
Normally AA uses Jan Philips 6021W.
What cryo tube is used in SE upgrade (Philips, Sylvania) ?
I have emailed Globe Marketing recently they do not respond.
I think the cryo 6021W they use is Sylvania.
I think Globe is out of business.
I think there is supposed to be a new Audio Aero distributor announced soon. I would wait for a distributor to be named and contact them for cryo 6021W tubes, I can't find them either.
I have contacted France Audio Aero too, but they did not bother to respond. I'm out of luck trying to find Sylwania 6021W, But I have found Raytheon 6021W. Have anybody compared different brands of 6021W, is really Sylvania's the best one ?
The tubes used by AA in the player are the Jan Phillips. These tubes can be found at BOIAUDIOWORKS.com and some other places by just googling 6021w tube. The croyed tubes are questionable for the sonic differences as I have tried them both. You can always have them cryoed if you fully believe in that.
I have the AA Reference SE, if I get ambitious this weekend I'll open it up to see what's inside.
I'm not sure I've heard of anybody getting ahold of AA directly, that's why I'd wait for a distrubutor to be announced and go through them. You can always go for the JAN Philips and change to the cryo if you find them. I don't know if the Raytheon compare to the Sylvania, maybe call Tube World and ask. Sorlowski, why do you think you need new tubes right now?
I looked and the tubes are Philips.
This is interesting though, the leads from the two capacitors wrap around the bases of the tubes where they attach to the board. To change the tubes the capacitors would have to be moved. This is in a AA Reference SE.
A good local tech can change the tubes with no problem if he has experience and a good soldering station and the qualified ones have that. I have owned both the AA Prestige and the Capitole Classic and yes the Sonicraft teflon caps. are in a WOW location on the boards releative to the tubes but it can be done as I accomplished it several times with no problems while I owned the players.
I had my local tech (Alpha-Tech Electronics in St. Louis) replace the tubes in my Capitol 24/192 Mk 1 with Jan Phillips 6021's (not cryo'ed) from Tube World and they sound just fine.
So you actually have not heard big difference between regular tubes and cryo ones.
Some AA owners claim that difference is huge after applying SE upgrade, but it may be VCAPs not tubes, who knows. Do I believe in cryo treatment, not yet, curious it will not hurt to try. I will have piece of mind
I have already ordered CuTF VCAPs, I like the way AA Cap mkII sounds in midrange, but I would like to have more resolution and speed.
I have asked Tube World about differences between Sylvanias and Raytheon but they would not comment. Since they are out off Sylvanias I guess they will not recommend them and will not criticize tubes they have in stock.
If you are asking gwalt this question because I responded about cryoed tubes the answer would be it is not a huge factor in the sound IMO since I have tried them both. The AA Capitole SE/Prestige models have Sonicraft Teflon .10uf caps. and you are on the right track with the new CuTF V-caps with the copper/teflon mix if you want more bang for the buck. Those caps. are expensive but it would be my guess the caps. will extend the player both top and bottom and leave the quality of the midrange aside.
I have upgraded the Musicap to VCap CuTF and there was tremendous progress in terms of transparency and resolution.
It is so much better player now. Importunately I have latter upgraded Philips 6021W to cryo Sylvania 6021W and I have lost bass impact and dynamic.
Did anybody tried Sylvania's instead of Philis and noticed loss ob bass impact after upgrade ?
Is AA using Sylvania in their players at all ?