Anyone NOT like the sound of VPI?

Johnbrown, I have the SDS and converted to thread drive. This did not greatly change my perception of a relatively lightweight bass. YMMV

Madfloyd, I sort of missed it, but you're wondering about the Rega. I formerly had a Rega P25 with Grado Sonata, Sumiko Blue Point Special, ARC SP9 MKII, Pro-ject Tube Box, always thought that bass somewhat lightweight as well. The Tube Box improved that deficiency to some extent, in the end I blamed the tt.

I also currently have a highly modified Thorens TD160, this does give me a more satisfactory tonal balance. Unfortunately, it not in the same class as the VPI in the resolution department. Still, I would describe it as more musical than the VPI in it's current state.

Madfloyd, I've complained about a similar problem on these forums as well. Specifically, a relatively lightweight tonal balance, the bass doesn't have enough impact or fullness for me.

I'm not ready to give up on my Scoutmaster with 10.5i arm at this point, however. Many on this forum feel VPI's sound fine, so I'm willing to do further work on my setup.

As for the problem, I suspect the relatively low mass of the VPI arms could be part of the problem, you do have to use a fairly high compliance cartridge with these arms, particularly the 9" arms. Changing my 9 arm to the 10.5 arm helped out the bass to some extent, the higher mass of this arm is likely helping here. I also recently added about 40 lbs of lead weight to the Bright Star Big Rock under my tt, this further helped out the bass.

Beyond this, who knows where the problem lies. It could be cartridge alignment, the platter, rubber belt (I changed to thread drive), acrylic platter, tt isolation, cartridge, my phono stage. Every one of these things has been mentioned as possible culprits by audiogon members answering my posts. There are so many variables in tt setups, its difficult to pin it down to any one thing.

I've also heard from some who don't care for the VPI sound, it seems they think the VPI lacks musicality. I wonder if this is a lack of satisfying warmth in the lower frequencies.

I next move will be replacing the Sovtech 12ax7s in my phono stage with Mullards, then a different cartridge alignment with the Mint Lp. If I'm still not there, I will be changing out the capacitors in my phono stage to Mundorf Silver/Golds or VH Audio TFTFs. If the bass is still lightweight after these mods I will be much further inclined to blame the VPI. Still, a better cartridge and the super platter may be needed to complete the setup.

Based on my experience with my VPI to this point, I would have to say the VPI Scoutmaster is not a plug and play unit, its simply not a finished product without all the upgrades. The upgrade path VPI offers makes it easier to get started, but it sure sucks to think you aren't getting all the turntable has to offer without those upgrades. I have a feeling the Scoutmaster is going to end up being at least a 6.5k investment rather than the 2.5k investment I initially thought it would be.

Your bass response issues being resolved by the digital makes the tt setup the obvious culprit. Attending to other issues will only delay your getting the tt setup right.

The wall shelf will make little or no difference in the bass, I've tried both wall and floor setups, the wall setup is much better overall in other sonic aspects. I suspect the fact your setup sits on a cement slab will make even less difference vs. the wall setup. I highly doubt it is your tt isolation.

I had the Pro-ject Tube box in a former tt setup, I doubt that is the culprit. I actually found it to be somewhat dark sounding in that setup, it probably doesn't have the bass impact of the highest quality phono stages.

You may also want to try an armwand with the standard Discovery cable, more even tonal balance in my setup. My only problem with that cable is it seemed a little closed in on top, it also doesn't have the resolution, air and spaciousness of the Valhalla cable. I also think it may be worth considering a custom wired armwand with Cardas, Purist or some other wiring, this could make a worthwhile difference. The Purist will definitely take the bass up a notch.

It would also be enlightening to audition a higher end phono stage, I've tried this path with no success to this point. Based on my experience you may have a long road to go in getting the VPI to sound the way you want, on the other hand, perhaps the next upgrade and/or tweak could solve the problem. Kind of exasperating not knowing how far or close one can be to solving audio problems.

I would take a close look at your phono stage, I recently changed out some coupling caps, made all the difference in the world. If your problem is the same as mine, all the changes in setup or cartridges are not going to solve the problem. I don't know what caps the Pro-ject uses, but this is the first place I would look. You should also see if you can audition a higher quality phono stage.

My recent experience illustrates the importance of a quality phono stage. At this point I think it may be the most important link in the analog chain.

I should also mention I had the previous iteration of the Pro-ject Tube Box with a Rega P25. I thought the bass was somewhat lightweight with that setup. Knowing what I know now, perhaps it wasn't the Rega, rather the Tube Box that was holding back the bass. Just something to think about.