Amp stands for Pass Labs


Has anyone used amp stands for Pass amps? What brand and how did they effect the sound? Thanks.
peterayer
I have used 2" maple platforms on Mapleshade brass footers, and Sistrum SP-101 platforms under my Pass Labs amps. Neither made a bit of difference sonically, but they looked cool.
years ago I had a set of the Aleph 2s on some stands I had made that used an inner tube under the platform. I swtiched my system around and put them on some sand box style stands mostly because I liked the looks better. I was really bothered by the sound for about a week and I couldn't imagine why it had changed. I decided to switch the stands back to the original inner tube ones and the good sound came back. I am a firm believer in the impact that racks and stands have on the sound of your system. I have been a user of Grand Prix Audio racks for a few years now and they are the best I've heard.
Spend your money elsewhere and leave the amps on the floor.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260508943717&_trkparms=tab%3DSelling

And these are cool too, kinda pricey though.
I have ALWAYS hear an improvement when equipment is placed on Grand Prix Audio Monaco stand, I would think Pass should behave similarly.
I use a Salmander under my X250. As Tvad said, doesn't make a difference sonically.
Yes they look cool,like chrome on a Harley but that's about it.
We use Sound Anchors on our XA-100.5 monos.
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I bought a couple different brands of stands for my X-600 monos and got ho-hum results. Someone here on the 'Gon suggested hockey pucks. I tried them and they work beautifully. I sold the stands and still use the hockey pucks. I have a concrete floor covered with a thick carpet and padding.
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I would recommend SRA (Silent Running Audio) any day. They make isolation platforms including the type that sit on the floor/carpet to support amplifiers. Kevin Tellekamp who owns SRA apparently does military applications for submarine isolation. He translates some to the secrets into his commercial side of the business. I can say that whatever in these platforms actually works.

Back in my early days with entry-level equipment, just about any support (stand and rack included) would help improving sound quality. As I get pieces of equipment of the same caliber as your XA100.5, these gadgets becomes a hit and miss. They can help in some areas, and harm in others. I stumble into SRA some 5 years ago, took a calculated risk waiting for them to tailor-make me a platform for my Meridian 808. Needless to say ever since then, I've gotten a few more platforms/stands for other pieces of equipment. Unlike all sort of supports, SRA platform does not augment the base or treble, creating a sense of vividness at the expense of something else. The end result is simply deeper soundstage and more detail in the music fabric. The down side is that these platforms are made based on your listening room and all kinds questions they'll ask you. They are considerably more expensive that your typical amp stand. Each piece is tailor-made and you have to wait for them to make it for you personally. But the wait is definitely worth it.
Grant,

Did you place the amps stands you tried directly on the floor or were they placed inside another piece of furniture?
While you were at demo with these amps and amp stands what were your source components placed on and enclosed? Tom
11-20-09: Theaudiotweak
Grant,

Did you place the amps stands you tried directly on the floor or were they placed inside another piece of furniture?
Directly on the floor.

While you were at demo with these amps and amp stands what were your source components placed on and enclosed? Tom
Theaudiotweak (Threads | Answers)
What difference does that make?

If you're suggesting that all my components should have been on Sistrum stands and platforms for me to hear what they can *really* do, then I'm guilty. I don't care to experiment further.
If you don't care to experiment then what is there? Stasis? Tom
11-21-09: Theaudiotweak
If you don't care to experiment then what is there?
I don't care to experiment further with Sistrum products.
I use a 4" Maple block with Audio Points underneath.
Grant,

My question was one of inquiry as to the reason why no perceived difference was heard or felt when either assembly was placed under your amps. Thats all. Tom
11-21-09: Theaudiotweak
Grant,

My question was one of inquiry as to the reason why no perceived difference was heard or felt when either assembly was placed under your amps.
I see.

It's a question I cannot answer.
I currently use a combination of a 2" maple platform and Black Diamond Racing Jumbo Pits under my Pass amp. Like Tvad, I didn't notice a difference. This was quite different from my experience putting isolation devices under my dac/preamp, which resulted in improved clarity and focus.

For peace of mind, I left the isolation under the amp anyway.
11-21-09: Bryoncunningham
This was quite different from my experience putting isolation devices under my dac/preamp, which resulted in improved clarity and focus.
Agreed 100%. I have had the most profound improvements using Grand Prix Audio Apex footers under my preamp and source.

For peace of mind, I left the isolation under the amp anyway.
Bryoncunningham (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers)
Again, agreed 100%. "It couldn't hurt, right?"
Grant

And all who have not heard a difference or very little when direct mechanical coupling their power amps.

A short story. 1998 and having owned a Essence power amp for a few years and knowing the builder Dale Pitcher [now of Intuitive Designs}and the amps general layout. Alex Gibson the designer of FMS cables told me to forward my speaker cables to Brent Riehl in Lincoln to have them re-wired shotgun style in hopes of producing more bass slam. Brent as it happened designed the original Audiopoint for use with Dale's amp in mind . The Essence amp in Corian had potted power supplys on a single board laying flat on the chassis bottom. In discussion with Brent, this of course came up and I was sent 3 Audiopoint 1.5 APs. These points were to be threaded into the 3 inscribed factory ready receptacles,lifting the power supply away from the main chassis and then coupling the supply to mechanical gound. My self installing the 3 points under a 120 pound amp all the while trying to thread them into a floating power supply was about to kill me. The pay off was big time in every way. The stage size and clarity increase was amazing and huge. The very reason I purchased this amp over many others became even more apparent with the installation of the three coupling points.

The use of the points this first time was under a power amp, directly coupled to the huge power supply inside. Since this first encounter I have direct coupled almost every power transformer and almost as many power supply capacitors, always with a positive audio result. I have performed the latest upgrade to my Wyred4Sound SE preamp removing the steel mounting bolt holding down the transformer and replacing with non ferrous brass and remounting on .2 audiopoints. Result was greater speed and detail.

Looking back in time now I have gleaned that especially a large mass as a power amp it is most imperative to direct couple the power supply mechanically and better yet couple it independently from the amplification circuit. If not the power supply resonance will pollute the wide bandwidth circuit. The power supply always comes first before the circuit it supplys. The supply is the greatest of resonance offenders and needs to be corrected first and most effectively interior and then exterior. Perhaps this in part is why the difference in improvement was not as large as one may have predicted. Tom
So, you're recommending that I unscrew the transformers in my $10,000 Pass Labs amplifiers to separate them from the chassis, and then to screw threaded Audiopoints through the bottom of the amplifier's chassis and into the transformers, thus directly coupling them to the Audiopoints?

There's no way I'm going to do that to my amplifiers. No way.

To suggest that performing this tweak, thereby voiding the manufacturer's warranty, in order to be able to hear the positive effects of $1700 Sistrum stands absolutely stuns me.

Incredible.
Huh,

I said no such thing either by description or by your suggestion have I ever done such a thing. I never accomplished any such feet/feat so completely except for that first time with the Essence amp because it was designed so completly to do so from the factory. The reason that I brought up the Essence was to describe the experience of separately coupling the power supply to ground from the main chassis and "that factory design" would be superior to the following. All other mods I performed were to couple the transformers of any other audio device directly to their own chassis,not independently. And those uspeakable mods could be performed by any thoughtful designer to everyones benefit, including to the Pass by Mr.Pass. You do not have to screw thru the chassis to do so, you simply put unthreaded points and coupling discs between the transformer and the existing chassis and replace the factory supplied steel screws that screw with the field of flux with non ferrous materials as described in published text books from a few hundred years ago. All other factory built power supply mounting methods I have seen are inferior to the method applied by Mr.Pitcher and Mr.Riehl just over ten years ago. Tom
Don't let anyone fool you, isolating your amplifiers can make a great sonic difference. I've used three different amp stands with varying results. I'd rank them in this order: 1. Sound Anchors custom amp stands
2. Solid Steel Large amp stands 3. Auralex Gramma speaker and amp stands.

I know all 3 stands can enhance the sound over just sitting them on the floor. I don't know the reason others cannot hear the difference. The bottom line, try a pair, Music Direct will sell you a pair to try for up to 30 days. If you don't hear a differnce, send them back.

Have fun!
...you simply put unthreaded points and coupling discs between the transformer and the existing chassis and replace the factory supplied steel screws that screw with the field of flux with non ferrous materials...
Theaudiotweak (Threads | Answers)
As I already stated, I am not going to unscrew the transformers in my Pass Labs amps and displace them. My $10,000 amps are not going to be altered in any way.
You have no sense of adventure Tvad.

What you need to do is audiotweak the system i.e. bolt a high rise aluminum Edlebrock manifold (using points of course) to the amps.

Then add a pair of Holley 4 barrel carburetors (make sure you remove the transformer bolts and mount directly to the manifold-points are optional here) to really boost the torque and horsepower.

Now you're cooking and applying the well know science and research of the past 150 years.

She's real fine my 409....................
Bill,

Your partially right in the mention of the use of a manifold. The application though is to the ceiling and wall convergence in my sound room. Got rid of those horrendous sounding 90 degree angles and recontoured them with 33 degree angles which edges roll away into the flat of the ceiling and wall. Got that idea when I had a new header reheated and bent to clear the linkage of my old Lotus Europa twin cam. Tom
I used Sistrum SP-101 under my X600.5's. Going from the floor to the stands, the bottom end became more tight and defined. It was quite noticable. I had a highly resolving system (Thiel, Wadia, Nordost, Pass). I would also consider SRA and HRS, but much more expensive.
Stillpoints Component Stands. 3 or 4 leg. The best!
It´s 2013, and you probably have a new power amp.

Feedback resonance can be a serious problem if you like high Db´s. I suggest you read about resonance at :

www.hiendracks.com/#/technology/

I´m not encouraging you to get one of those systems, but at least I can share with you some useful info.

Regards
Thanks Heindracks,
After I realized the incredible gains from placing my turntable on a Vibraplane isolation platform, I bought two more for my amplifiers. I had no idea the improvement would be so great, especially for SS amps. I am very pleased with the results.

I appreciate the link to your company, but I have found my solution.
You can just get a nice square piece of mdf or plywood and spray paint it.