A question of loading...

I've been running MC's into 47k since the 80's sans step up transformers. Do you know what load the Kleos is seeing at the moment ?

@daveyf 

The reason I asked  about the actual loading on MC is because I was wondering how they got the extra 11db for the MC input. If they used low gain transformers then the actual load would be 47k/turns ratio (of the transformer )squared - which would result in a load seen by the MC cartridge somewhere between 3500 - 5000 ohms.
According to Steophile review of the Cat SL1 Renaissance MC unloaded measured 3560 ohms.
So it is possble your load is between 3 & 5kohms.

Jonathan Carr the designer of your cartridge says that loading does not affect the cartridge itself with modern MC designs, but what loading  can do is dampen any ultrasonics that might affect the phono stage ( solid state devices can have low overload margins at very high frequencies, whereas tube designs less so ). Thats why he specs out loading range  up to 47k.

In my view if you can run MC's into higher impedances without upsetting the phono its a good thing. Klyne has done this for years, they use higher loading combined with very high frequency contouring to tame any ultrasonic nasties.. you are hearing the benefit of "unloading" your cartridge.

@fsonicsmith 

Your 1st email above is impossible to decipher

unloading to 25 does produce a very euphonic lively sound

25 what ? - 25 ohms or 25kohms ?
If you mean 25ohms you are loading the cartridge, not unloading it.
If you mean 25kohms, then you are indeed "unloading it", relative to say 100ohms.

Too much loading and the sound becomes lifeless.You have to strike a balance. For my Etna, it is 50K. 

This statement is oxymoronic.
 "too much loading and the sound becomes lifeless" - I agree with this if you mean loading down to 50, 100 ohms etc.
"For my Etna, it is 50k" -  50 kohms is unloading, its higher than the standard 47k.

@fsonicsmith 

47K is the standard for MM. Not for MC.

Whats your point. Are you loading at 50k as you claim or 50 ohms ?

We vinyl junkies, for better or worse, refer to lower capacitance as unloading even though you are technically correct. 

MC's are not generally impacted by capacitance changes.
Loading generally refers to resistance with MC's.

Because as you lower loading values, the cantilever is subject to less damping. At the end of the day it is damping and not technical numbers that counts. 

Jonathan Carr, the designer of your cartridge, does not agree with this.
Your theory is old school thinking. If you search for JCarr postings on loading you will find his views elsewhere on this forum.
 

@daveyf 
@atmasphere 

I suspect Ken got tired of people calling about noisy tubes and SUTs are a way to get around that.

Yep, I know from experience that customers were complaining about their Koetsu's with the CAT - not enough gain & too much noise.
The problem was that you only needed a transformer with about 10db ( turns ratio 1:5 ). Most off the shelf audio SUT's are up around 20/26db - which resulted in too much gain. I think this is why he has addressed the gain issue in the way he has.
Daveyf, the gain is also impacted by the system gain - how sensitive is your power amp input - so there are always exceptions.

The test is not looking if the sound is better or not but if exist a mistracking or not.

This is complete and utter nonsense.
In 40 years of high end audio, including distributing and retailing high end audio back in the 80’s, setting up hundrededs of high end TT’s I have NEVER had mistracking due to "incorrect" loading.

The assertion is a fantasy. If the perception is loading down has cured mistracking, the listener must have the disease known as "cloth ears". Might want to consult an ENT specialist.