Oh, the truth is you Meitner dudes are pissed off there's a new kid on the block offering better price/performance.
(yes, that is meant playfully)
I agree with you in spirit, Laz, but must say I find such threads therapeutic in a 'there but for the grace of god go I' sorta way. For ideally, despite our deply engrained 'gear headedness' and other technical geekosities, this game is all about connecting with the music. And on that count, my radio can move me emotionally to the same quadrant that my audio rig can. That there is joy in marching so many places to the right of the decimal point in the pursuit of 'accuracy' is no doubt fun. But at the end of the day, it is about music; an emotional connection; simple joy.
One need not spend a lot of money to gain this experience, nor let equipment get in the way of it.
Your fellow 12 step audioholic fool,
I have printed off and read all of that Esoteric thread over the last couple of days. It was damn near giving me an anxiety attack thinking that my $2900 Marantz SA-14 was at the bottom of a pile of dung. I then took a deep breath and realized it was like numerous other threads that I have read proclaiming the vast sonic differences between 1 meter interconnects costing hundreds or thousands of dollars.
I forgot that I had realized that at some point, everyone must call uncle, and for me, I'm at it. I rarely get to sit in the "sweet spot". I rarely get to just listen to music at a "normal" level (75-85 dB at listening position). Realistically, how the hell would I be able to discern a differnce between one excellent CDP and one outstanding?
Are many other people in this boat?
Lazarus28, I respect you're opinion of the DV-50, but you have to admit your statement that...
anybody's *absolute* assertion that the esoteric dv-50 is 'one-dimensional,' and 'sounds like radio shack,' and 'is bettered in every way' by the modded denons is a load of horse crap
is as dogmatic as the statements you disavow regarding your DV-50. Have you heard the APL 3910? Or any of the other players other than the Meitner that are being compared to the DV-50? If so, you have a valid argument. If not, you're argument carries no weight beyond the opinion of a DV-50 owner.
Lazarus28, Thank you for your viewpoint, I hope you read the WHOLE thread where I in fact Apoligized if I seemed overzealous. I am on a mission, and a search for the digital source that I feel is the best, to me. I believe what I am hearing right now in my system, with my ears, is in fact just that. I am really attempting to describe accurately, my findings. Not to promote, for I have no direct relationship with any modder, or manufacturer. In fact, I have the balls to do exactly what you say, That is I buy, try, compare, sell, or return. I, in fact am still searching for the right source. Only, now it is for my HT. I will still lend my unit for shootouts, comparisons, and fun. Hey, thats just me. I own a mortgage company, and do not need to sell audio for a living, nor do I. That being said, I do not have any motive except to report in an honest way, what I hear. You are right that not everyone is going to like the same thing. IMHO, most do, most meaning more than 50%. That makes a majority, and thats why shootouts are fun, and educational.
I am glad you have the Meitner gear, and are happy. Had I not run accross Alex, and APL I might have the Meitneer too. In fact I look forward to comparing, and guess what, If I like the meitner better, in my system, I will buy it. I have stated I have a budget of 20k for this, and I think the meitner falls in there. I hope one day soon you get to listen to the APL, and I get to compare, directly with the meitner. Hopefully my player will be at the shootout at audioesentials next weekend, (I will be on a cruise with my wife and daughter)I am just hoping those who
do attend, get the same type of enjoyment, and pleasure as me. My purpose here is not to promote a certain product, it is to bring great products to peoples attention. Why? Cause it makes me happy, and helps those around me on the same search as myself. A lot of people cannot take the time I am putting forth, and/or do not have the resources I have to play this game. Yes, to me, this is fun, I am on a journey to find my audio nirvana. Sounds to me that you are too. We seem to be on an analagous journey seperate, but together. Please tell me IYHO, the difference between the Meitner, and the DV-50. I am real interested to see how you would put it.
I also have owned the DV-50, or I never could have said what I said. Yes, my initial posting on the thread were overly zealous, and incorrectly phrased. I was so exited with my APL, and Exemplar, and acted foolish in my writings. I forgot that the written word, is a record. I
did apologize for that. I must tell you I feel really proud about my journey, and my writings, today. I have rerceived much email, of appreciation from many audiogon members, requesting me to keep up the great work. I am still having fun here, I hope I am not offending you in any way, shape, or form. As I said before, I intend to keep on my search, until I stop having fun with it. Please try not to make this journey a drag. I invite you to vistit if you are ever in the Chicago area.
All I can honestly say is that I am listening to the DCC copy of Aqualung, at about 70db/75 db, which is rare for me, and I am hearing instruments I have never heard before. The sound is unlike any I have experienced in my system, ever. I have been thru a lot of high quality players in the last 6 months, and primarily 3 months. I am just in awe of the music I am hearing now. I am not analyzing, I am toe tapping and just plain amazed. I am happy. I hope you find yours too.
The more I learn about audio the more I realize wild claims could well be system synergy at it's best and the same piece could sound noticably less good somewhere else.
Also something that often happens is something sounds really good for the first few days or weeks and after that it settles in and sounds different therefore getting less acclaim. I am especially leery of someone who just plugged something in listens a few hours, and then posts about it (I have done this myself) they are often excited (this is how some purchases are made) and throw superlatives around. Not a 'bad' thing just not especially level headed and sometimes misleading for other potential purchasers if the writer is not careful.
BTW 711 this is not directed at you as I have not read your thread but in response to Lazarus...
all the best,
Different people have different listening priorities. Some people may truly prefer one over the other, even after careful A/B testing, and living with them for awhile. It may also have something to do with how it all comes together in their individual systems and rooms.
I had to notice that you made a comment about how your new digital gear beat your very nice Teres analog system, and you've now sold it. But, I know of a few other people who have the exact same Teres 265 turntable that you had, and also have the newest flagship Meitner digital gear, and definitely prefer the Teres analog to even the best Meitner digital.
So, how can this be reconciled?
To each his own.
Some need to have different things out of their systems, than either you or I(or anybody else) may promote.
If you are happy, that is all that should matter.
711 - great response! that last bit cracked me up - and i guess i did miss the part where you said your earlier statements may have been a little overzealous. no worries, pal - and i'd love to hear the APL next time im in chicago. likewise, if you're in san antonio - come on by! we'll kick out the jams and drink some fine shiner bock beer, which is easily the best in the country and absolutely trounces all over the competition. (tongue firmly pressed against cheek)
david_berry - fortunately (depending on how you look at it) i live alone so that's not an issue. sounds like you need to start sneaking home during your lunch hour. . .
tvad - my general point remains to take all wild claims with a grain of salt, regardless of what that claim is - mine included.
philojet - yeah, i know what you mean. i've made changes to my system that floored my for a little while. like once, i borrowed my brother's little tube preamp for my office system and i was WOWED for a few hours. i was just about ready to run out and buy one. then after listening for a long time, i for whatever reason found it unsatisfying. i switched back to mine and was happy again.
twl - my point exactly. i'm in no way trying to invalidate the ability of the teres with that statement. it's just what i hear. gotta tell you, though - i almost wish i'd have kept the teres just to look at it. . .
Enthusiastic hobbyists we are, and are no different from those with other hobbies, enjoying the occasional one-up and the more than occasional fish story... I've read that whole thread and found it to be very informative and entertaining. I wish I had the resources to play in their game (also a Chicago resident), but I'll happily watch from the mid-fi seats...
lazarus, excellent & right on target.
I always loved to sit in the back of Long Island Audio Society meetings and laugh at the "mine is bigger than yours" comments that were exchanged. This is human nature, but I try not to engage in it. Occasionally, however, I suspect that my posts are more than "hey, guys you might want to listen to this" posts. I do try to avoid useless words, such as "blows away," and instead use equally useless words, such as "is more realistic or more transparent." Words are so useless in describing sound.
I know my position of writing on AA or Gon and saying how useless words are is hypocritical, but our passion is to share. As someone above said, perhaps we should just take everything as a grain of salt and listen for ourselves.
Tbg, Norm, you are cordially invited for a listen. Seriously, you, and I are on the same path. We are serching for the best, digital has to offer. For today, I believe I have found it with the APL. You own, or owned the meitner gear, and have been touting the Exemplar. I read, digested, bought the 2900, 3910, Exception II, am waiting for the Exception II with siltcech, and remote, but I have also been exploring, buying, selling, returning other products. I have apologized for using the "blown away" terminolgy. I am on a mission for self truth. As of today, I have found happiness with the APL 3910. I cordially invite you to listen, and ask for youto give me feedback and your opinion. I value your opinion, for without your writings, I would never have embarked on my journey to audio nirvana.
Best of luck in your journey too.
Steve, I actually had an Exemplar 3910 last week. It had been damaged in shipment and is now back with John and is fixed. I will get it early this coming week, but of course have to wait some time awaiting its breakin. I, of course, will not have the APL, but I will be comparing it with the TEAC UX-1, the Reimyo, and the 2900.
As I said, I will try to share my opinions, but in reality they may have little application to you or others.
Tbg, I appreciate you sharing. As I said, it was your statement regarding the Exemplar being better, IYHO, than the Meitner that encouraged me to buy the Exemplars I bought. I encourage you to try the APL, as well.
Best luck in your journey, and thanks again.
BTW, do you own the Teac, and Reimyo?