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Where did your friends buy the psvane caps? can you post the ... Grantfidelity
Not sure how to post pictures in the forum - but here are th ... Grantfidelity
Dear jallen, it is not difficult to differential teflon from ... Sniper9999
I purchased some psvane capacitors a few weeks back and imme ... Serengetiplains
Greetings, i received the test measurements from my friend ... Jallen
To be fair i would purchase the caps from an authorized deal ... Sniper9999
Teflon is 'soft' to the touch compared to mylar. if the my ... Magfan
Magfan, yes, you're looking at total surface area as one fac ... Serengetiplains
A note of caution from an old fogie. 270 c and teflon do no ... Terry9
Hf....also known as hydrofluoric acid is really bad news. i ... Magfan
The psvane caps i got from the authorized dealer is definite ... Sniper9999
Sniper9999 do you feel at liberty to disclose which authoriz ... Eleet
I am afraid some distributors have been deceived about this ... Jallen
Do not mess w hf if you do not know what you are doing! Swampwalker
If your dielectric is heating up at all; it's because you ar ... Rodman99999
There is no point to divert attention, i suggest anyone who ... Sniper9999
Response to grant fidelity, i will post pics when they arri ... Jallen
Of course you are correct, rodman. no component. but what i ... Terry9
Magfan, i think the arthritic feeling comes from caf2 precip ... Terry9
Mr t- point taken! happy listening! Rodman99999
I have received a segment from a copper teflon capacitor cou ... Jallen
Here is the official answer:
China has been on holidays so I finally got hold of the technical lead person for these caps. Some clarification from Psvane Audio:
1. The Psvane caps were NOT designed to copy V-Cap. Instead, it's a high end cap designed for final sound with materials selected for sound. Below are the materials used in making the Psvane caps:
Copper foil - as seen from pictures provided by Jallen of V-Cap, the pure copper used by V-cap is of darker color as seen in high purity copper. Psvane caps use high conductivity Beryllium Copper instead.
Teflon film - this is where the clarification is much needed as raised by Jallen in the first post. Psvane caps use teflon shield for the leads, and the highest grade Polyester (BoPET) film from Dupont as insulation film. There may be future high end caps from Psvane Audio made with pure teflon films but these are still in lab design and testing stage. No sure release date yet because the final high end sound is what Psvane Audio is after, not the teflon insulation film. Design might be changed when final product is released and they will not release further details.
Given the above factory clarification, Grant Fidelity has corrected our website product listing by dropping 'teflon' from the description to avoid misleading customers.
The Psvane caps are still called 'Teflon caps' in the Chinese market and due to interpretation in Chinese language, it doesn't appear that local consumers in China are raising questions like we do in the west. However, Grant Fidelity is committed to provide Chinese hi-fi products with transparency and top service, we will refer the Psvane caps as 'Psvane copper foil caps' in all our publications.
As stated by Psvane Audio: the Psvane caps were not designed to copy V-cap; instead they were designed to go after the same high end market that V-Cap is occupying. Grant Fidelity believes that referring Psvane caps as 'Teflon caps' (as printed on the caps) has caused confusion among consumers hence some came to the conclusion that Psvane caps are fakes. There is merit to such a statement given the above circumstance.
However, Grant Fidelity has always sourced high end Chinese audio products for the sound quality - same sourcing criteria apply to our decision of taking on the Psvane caps in the first place. We carry Psvane caps for its sound, for its reliability and for what it can do for hi-fi sound in its correct application in electronics components. With correction of the production description, Grant Fidelity will continue carry the Psvane caps under the name of 'Psvane Copper Foil Caps' at the same price. All products from Grant Fidelity have always been priced according to its purchase cost and resell directly to consumers without retail mark-up.
In our opinion, the error in product description doesn't undergrade or undermine the sound quality of these caps and it doesn't change the test results that were published on our product listing page since day one by a high end audio manufacturer.
Psvane Caps are not fake V-Caps. It is simply another creation from the Chinese Hi-Fi industry by using different materials to deliver great sound as a final product. We apologize if our previous product description has caused confusion.
In terms of reliability issue reported by some buyers - Grant Fidelity cannot comment directly on the specific case because the caps were not purchased from Grant Fidelity. However, as myself has been in the product sourcing industry for nearly 20 years dealing with Chinese manufacturers, I can say that there exist the possibility that counterfeit caps could become available from China with the increasing popularity of Psvane caps in the Asian market. Using same packaging but different internal materials to make product bearing the same brand is a very common way of counterfeiting in China. Psvane Audio also commented that they typically select the best quality for their international clients, similar as on their vacuum tubes, and they were very surprised by the appear-to-be-high frequency of failed caps incidence reported on this forum. Grant Fidelity has never ever imported a single product through a middleman / broker in Hong Kong or China (as far as we know, some western businesses do purchase Chinese hi-fi products through English speaking Chinese brokers, but Grant Fidelity didn't, doesn't and never will.) We do not leave any chance for a product to be mixed with counterfeits. Grant Fidelity source directly from the manufacturer and only use a closely related party "Audio For Less' in Hong Kong which we trust 100% for shipping and logistics. Grant Fidelity do not resell caps or vacuum tubes to any other re-sellers (including the one Jallen purchased his caps from) so that our reputation will be guarded closely. We only provide caps and tubes to amplifier manufacturers to include in their final products for sale, but not sold separately.
It's not recent news that high end western brand audio accessories are being sold in China by unethical dealers who blend real ones with counterfeit together for sale. I have personally seen several cable brands and caps suffered from such loss. It's not a surprise such a counterfeit practice has spread to Chinese high end brands as well.
Grant Fidelity believes in creating value for end users by reducing distribution layers - adding another re-seller in the chain isn't the business model we are participating. From all our Psvane caps sales that we sold directly to end users, we have never had a consumer reported a failed cap. In the unlikely event if a cap does fail within warranty, we will certainly provide replacement without exception. In fact, we have started our amplifier factory order with these Psvane caps pre-installed on certain models. Amp factory has reported that all 160 caps delivered in the first batch all have past examination with flying color.
To find out how these Psvane caps sound (that's what really matters, not the plastic sheet used between the conductors, isn't?), Grant Fidelity will now provide 30 day return privilege on Psvane cap order from now until May 1st, 2012. As always, free shipping is provided worldwide. If you are not happy with the sound, just write us for return instructions then mail it back to us for refund(note the caps must not be damaged on the leads or cosmetically). That is how confident we are with the sound.
We hope the above has above has clarified the debate. I won't comment on the pictures provided by Jallen for the Psvane caps since those caps were not from us. Our cap internal pictures are posted on Grant Fidelity website product page (0.47uF/600V) for everyone to view in detail.
Thanks for reading and happy listening.
Rachel @ Grant Fidelity
Grantfidelity (Answers | This Thread)
Went to grant fidelity and now my computer thinks i speak fr ... Magfan
On the 1/20/2012 post, the comment from grant fidelity state ... Jallen
I had hoped to hear from one or more of the other manufactur ... Jallen
To answer jallen: if you read my answer line by line: it sta ... Grantfidelity
Did that last nite. for a second, i though my computer had ... Magfan
Grant fidelity, my reference was to the 1/20/2012 post. you ... Jallen
This seems unambiguous to me: it is for improving your audi ... Serengetiplains
I am surprised to parts connexion is on radio silence for t ... Jallen
Hi everybody, i am a hong konger and we chinese are the same ... Sniper9999
With all due respect, rachel (i understand you may simply be ... Chrisvh
All excellent points chris. i think it's very clear here ... Jtwrace
i am not jallen, a few years ago they were called out for s ... Cpk
This is a sad day for audio. the quick dollar seems to trum ... Jallen
To answer to chris from vh audio: 1. the misunderstanding ... Grantfidelity
I wonder if grant fidelity will refund anyone that wants to ... Jtwrace
Maybe a voucher for one of those third tier products nobody ... Audiofeil
I wold like to point out that besides not having a teflon di ... Casouza
Gf cannot absolve themselves from liability here as they are ... Audiofeil
The downside of pure copper is that it oxidizes like crazy a ... Magfan
Credibility is everything in the field of component parts. ... Salectric
I will never buy anything associated with psvane (or gf for ... Jtwrace
U get what u pay for. if it seems good to be true then it i ... Johnsonwu
Re: copper oxidation- gold is the only metal foil that will ... Rodman99999
Copper stability has nothing to deal with psvane's credibili ... Sniper9999
From a dealer's perspective i agree with rodman. a few yea ... Audiofeil
Have any of you had opportunity to compare the copper or tin ... Jallen
I'm waiting for rachel to exit the bunker and re-start the s ... Audiofeil
Hello jallen. i tested tin v-caps against relcap teflons fo ... Terry9
Should read rtx also sounded good ... Terry9
I have heard good things about the rel's, but have read seve ... Jallen
I have tried the rtx and found them to be a bit compressed s ... Jallen
A streamlined burn-in solution: (http://phonoclone.com/diy-r ... Rodman99999
You may wish to dismiss my comments as uninformed, because i ... Terry9
Sorry but have to disagree. even the cheap russian teflons ... Johnsonwu
I have heard the v-caps in enough circuits and compared with ... Jallen
I agree that teflon caps, including the russian ones, make m ... Terry9
Is rachel still in hiding? Audiofeil
I'd think if you duped that many people you would still be h ... Jtwrace
What's needed here is a bunker buster to get rachel and gf o ... Audiofeil
What exactly do you want to hear from them? Jtwrace
Ummmmm......the truth? although i'll settle for a woo hoo o ... Audiofeil
Oh. i thought "chrisvh" posted the truth above on ... Jtwrace