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03-29-11
The "jr" has some advantages over the more expensi ... Geoch
03-30-11
..."in normal careful use, the great mass of the armpod ... Lewm
03-30-11
Dear lewm, sorry about my english it is obvious that i'm usi ... Geoch
03-30-11
Dear lew, you are very difficult to satisfy or please. even ... Nandric
03-30-11: Ct0517
I needed to think about this over night.
I took the soft activity to be any and all the movement that occurs outside of the normal cartridge/stylus retrieval of the signal that needs to occur for us to hear the sound. The tonearm (any type) moves up and down and side to side in normal use. The actual physical movement of the tonearm is itself a soft activity and necessary. Likewise at the other end (arm pod) movement is happening in the armpod with the resonances we just cant see it in the material as the vibrations are either absorbed or passed on. With the symposium jr. you are able to see it more clearly.
The footers of an armpod are like the foundation of the house. They however need to be such that they support the structure but also provide for passing of resonances into the platform below not to return up again or absorption of some of those resonances thereby dissipated. This can be done at least in two different ways from what I have learned.
Hard spikes/disks that allow the resonances to pass through and not go back up. Or they can be of a design soft and hard to absorb some or all of the energy / heat of the resonances and also allow for the remainder of the resonances to pass through. It sounds like the Jrs use this principle.
I have to admit the first time Geoch described this I had visions of a tower shaking during an earthquake. But then if you think about it as it moves as long as returns to position in time before the stylus is on the groove it should be fine. We accept the toearm movement as part of the normal movement why any different at the other end ?
A personal experience (not audio related) but that relates I believe to this bear with me. I have a contractor doing renovations to an old property that uses a large copper drain pipe. Whenever hot water is used it would go down the pipe putting energy into it from the heated water expanding it (causing noise) then when the water was stopped, the pipe would again (make noise) as it went back to its cold form form. We were able to cure this by cutting a couple of inches from a section of the pipe and replacing it with a rubber clamp. Now when the hot water is run the energy does the same thing and goes down the drain pipe but the energy makes its way to the rubber clamp (like the Symposium Jrs.) where the energy is absorbed. Drastically reduced noise. For our hobby this energy in the pipe is like those vibrations and the Jrs. are absorbing and passing it onward.
Thoughts ?
Ct0517 (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
03-30-11
Dear lewn - you can have the most precise and accurate platt ... Ct0517
03-31-11
Chris, i failed to notice that the original suggestion was ... Dgob
03-31-11
Chris, sorry, just one other brief thought. if you look a ... Dgob
03-31-11: Ct0517
One 16 lb (7.27kgs) Solid Brass Cylinder - 4" x 4"
$152.55 dollars
Brass bolt to secure tonearm to cylinder .15 cents
Steel spikes / discs to couple the arm pod $20 dollars
Drill bit and tap for making threaded holes for 3 spikes and one bolt. $15
Brass Polish $5 dollars
Unbiased, unsolicited, comments and recommendations from Audigon members - PRICELESS
You can see the raw brass piece here.
www.canuckaudiomart
I will try it out this weekend and if it sounds promising I will bring it to a machine shop to round it out and take out the fine scratches
Cheers Chris
Ct0517 (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
03-31-11: Ct0517
Dgob - I have no problem being the guinea pig. Will try to source some locally first. I have found in the past when talking with some of these manufacturers of these products that their experiences with what we are doing is limited.
They can't seem to say yes or no to me and their feedback is very general and ambiquous.
Geoch and his audio community are obviously there already. His comments are based on the Jrs. actual experiences with people so I trust his input as been unbiased. And besides as you say they are not alot of money - again about the price of a tank of gas :)
Geoch - I do have two questions
Are there any guidelines about the weight. Have your members found there is a minimum and maximum weight with the Jrs. and is there a limitation on the height of the object.
Also you mentioned that these are used by the parallel trackers but why not the Pivot arm or any other - since they are balanced as well.
Thinking of the pivot arm I am getting visions of a construction crane on a tower swinging over a job site.
Ct0517 (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
03-31-11: Geoch
Dear Chris, the only thing of great concern is how softy you can handle the arm lift. The JR responds quite sharp to an aggressive shock and your fingers must feel only an affectionate touch as like they slip over when queing or lift down the tonearm. If you try them & regret your purchase, I'll be gratefull to exchange them with my Aktyna ARIS every time. A fellow with a Clearaudio arm has the guts to do it first and the other two just have followed. The total weight of the cart/arm is only a small percentage of the 7kgr tower and cannot affect the balance. The height is irrelevant also as one of them uses a tower of over 20cm height for his Gabriel. If you can manage to soften your ET's lift by oiling & handle it with control then I can't see any problem. I guess there are not many TT chassis permitting an independent arm pod & above that most of the people afraid to use the JR's even under their integrated TT's plinth. So, it is normal for most to avoid such an extreme & dangerous option especially when they are used to the convenience of the pivoted tonearms. I don't think there is any guide about the appropriate mass loading of JRs and I have seen them under everything from light weight Tuners to even massive speakers. I realize the difficulty for everyone to accustomed to the swing threat upon every touching of his tonearm, which may cost his precious cartridge. Although one of these fellows trusted his Insider to JRs, I'm sorry but I honestly can't assure you about your stylus safety by first hand. I don't even have an isolated arm pod ... (yet).
Geoch (Threads | Answers | This Thread)
03-31-11
Dear geoch - and others - everything we do in this hobby is ... Ct0517
04-01-11
Geoch and nandric, despite whatever you both may think, my r ... Lewm
04-01-11
Dear lew, glad to have you on board because you was at first ... Nandric
04-02-11: Dgob
Nandric,
If you go down the route of Halcro (which I am more or less planning to do) with the arm tower design, you can offset your mounting hole to be nearer to any desired edge. This removes all concerns about tonearm length. This will also apply for arms with collars. Remember that I have experimented very successfully with a Morch DP6 and an Audio Craft AC3300 - both of which have collars and are 9" or less in length.
Apart from the unspecified and potential costs in needing professional help in drilling the holes, there really appears to be no limits to the arm tower approach and its applications.
Dgob (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
04-02-11
Dear dgob, i really hope that anyone will be able to 'go dow ... Nandric
04-02-11
To paraphrase the bandit in "the treasure of the sierra ... Lewm
04-02-11
I have asked some folks who have gone down this path using v ... Ct0517
04-02-11
Nandric, if you buy some aluminium plate (ebay often has va ... Dgob
04-03-11: Corby
i have been speaking with chris about this thread. he had seen pics of my armpod. you guys are very passonite about this. that's great to see.
my design requirements were to have adjust-ability for azimuth, vta (sra) and flexibility for different arms. the pics show a breuer, but i have already replaced that with a davinci.
i have mounted arms to the armpod that have the wiring come through the pivot point and out the bottom, so a surface mount would not work. i had to use an armboard mounted on a post, on the armpod, to offset the arm. this allows the wiring to exit through the bottom.
pics here:
www.canuckaudiomart
and here :
cgim.audiogon
don
Corby (System | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
04-03-11
Nice solution corby. can you explain how the vta adjustment ... Halcro
04-03-11
Corby, that's quite beautiful work. do you mean to imply tha ... Lewm
04-03-11
Halcro, the vta is adjusted using the micrometer ath the top ... Corby
04-03-11
Corby, what is the source for the threaded spikes you use on ... Kbell
04-03-11
Corby, are the tonearm wires on your arms the same aa they w ... Kbell
04-03-11
Dear corby, i did not at all mean to imply that you cannot a ... Lewm
04-03-11
Kbell the spikes are stock brass thumbscrews from spaenaur a ... Corby
04-03-11
Lewm you are correct in your assessment of the positioning o ... Corby
04-04-11
Sometimes we have a good and interesting result and an attra ... Lewm
04-04-11
Dear all, i asked my carpenter if he could produce a plinth ... Thuchan
04-04-11
Deat thuchan - a suggestion while searching for your screws, ... Ct0517
04-04-11
Dear chris, you are right, many footers are lying around he ... Thuchan
04-04-11
Dear thuchan i selfishly meant your eminent technology arm ... Ct0517
04-04-11
Thuchan the screws can be 140mm long. if you counterbore the ... Corby
04-04-11
Thuchan, i assume you know this, but in case not, thread siz ... Lewm
04-04-11
Dear ct0517, got it, sorry i did not think of my et-2 cause ... Thuchan
04-04-11
Dear corby, many thanks for this good hint. will follow your ... Thuchan
04-04-11
Dear lewm, yes - i bought a very good mk ii motor unit in a ... Thuchan
04-05-11
Dear thuchan, if you find that you enjoy the sp10 mkii but w ... Lewm
04-05-11
Dear thuchan: +++++ " and then too, since you posted he ... Rauliruegas
04-05-11
Dear lewm, dear raul - this thread is not about the naked gu ... Thuchan
04-05-11
No matter how you set it up, it will be of great interest to ... Lewm
04-06-11
Whow i didnt know that. Ebm
04-07-11
Mass loading is very good at least that is what my ears ar ... Ct0517
04-07-11
Hey chris, you can always elevate your turntable by putting ... Lewm
04-07-11
Lewn - i disagree - i think that cantaloupe slices would wor ... Ct0517
04-08-11
Just a short follow up on my experience with the footers use ... Ct0517
04-08-11
Cantaloupe? where do you ever see canned cantaloupe? i toy ... Lewm
04-08-11
Dear lewm: ++++ " you guys would hate it .... " ++ ... Rauliruegas
04-08-11: Ct0517
Dear Lewn - I would never hate anything that makes great sounds and music. Music is music. How you get there doesnt matter. As long as each of us gets to what makes us happy if that is possible in this hobby. It is a hobby right?
There are complicated and simple solutions to our audio goals. I find as I get older - I turned 50 in February - I much prefer the simpler ones and the ones that get me more involved.
I echo what Raul said - I look forward to hearing your impressions of the MKIII and Thuchan's impressions of his MkII.
FWIW - I knew something was off with my brass armpod. I got home tonight after being away, measured it and it is actually 4.25 tall. I was so like a little kid setting it up last weekend I never bothered to measure. Anyone ordering from Metal Supermarkets better make sure they give you the size you need especially if the little extra will make a difference.
Cheers Chris
Ct0517 (System | Reviews | Threads | Answers | This Thread)
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